Pink Freud Posted February 18, 2010 Share Posted February 18, 2010 Is that the the same men that initially fled to Jordan? Its a strange one because this sort of thing doesn't normally make such a big impact, after all, the Israeli secret service are normally pretty efficient. Hopefully some facts do emerge, and we investigate it properly, because this is too interesting to just be swept under the carpet. At least you don't think its a non story! Nor do I, and nor, I'm glad to say, does Gordon Brown. Your point is well made, since the Israelis were caught doing this years ago, apologised and promised not to do it again. Now, correct me if I'm wrong, in diplomacy speak that is pretty heavy duty, no? Therefore if they have done it again, it's a limited dimplomatic incident. The only problem being that Israel don;t really give two flying ones about anyone except the Yanks, so they will no doubt run out the same platitudes until they get caught next time. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LOL @ Celtic Posted February 18, 2010 Share Posted February 18, 2010 You have a passport right? Its generally trusted, you get free travel within Europe, it serves as ID. If a British passport is discredited as commonly forged, thanks to repeated incidents like this, then you can say goodbye to that. Look forward to full cavity searches and visas to travel anywhere. Thats why we need to come down hard on whoever is responsible, and we (as the public) need to make sure any investigation doesn't go the way of the BAE or Saudi Arabian investigations. Doulikefish seems to think its alright. Reynard thinks its alright. How many Mossad assassinations does it take to discredit a passport? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTChris Posted February 18, 2010 Share Posted February 18, 2010 Nor do I, and nor, I'm glad to say, does Gordon Brown. Your point is well made, since the Israelis were caught doing this years ago, apologised and promised not to do it again. Now, correct me if I'm wrong, in diplomacy speak that is pretty heavy duty, no? Therefore if they have done it again, it's a limited dimplomatic incident. The only problem being that Israel don;t really give two flying ones about anyone except the Yanks, so they will no doubt run out the same platitudes until they get caught next time. The case has to be proven against Israel and it's very doubtful that it will be. If it was Mossad then the agents got out of Dubai and have disappeared, giving the Israeli government plausible deniability, as I believe these things are referred to as. The previous occasions when intelligence operations have lead to diplomatic friction the agents have been caught red-handed, like the incidents with Australian and New Zealand passports and the occasion when agents poisoned a Hamas leader after travelling using Canadian passports. If proof was forthcoming then I'd imagine that the FCO would probably issue some sternly worded reprimands to the Israeli's and clamp down on some diplomatic priviledges for a while. Perhaps they would even expel a diplomat or two, although I doubt it would progress to that level given the generally friendly relations between the two governments and the fact that no British citizens have been directly harmed. It's my recollection that following the murder of Alexander Litvinenko several Russian diplomatic staff (FSB/GRU staffers in other words) were expelled and the Russian government did likewise with some of our Embassy staff. Given that situation involved the death of a British citizen and relations with Russia are significantly frostier I'd expect that it won't escalate to that level. You have a passport right? Its generally trusted, you get free travel within Europe, it serves as ID. If a British passport is discredited as commonly forged, thanks to repeated incidents like this, then you can say goodbye to that. Look forward to full cavity searches and visas to travel anywhere. I don't think that the Israeli's will be using forged British passports again for a while, given the publicity garnered by this case, so any repeated incidents such as this are unlikely. I would also doubt that this would cause any reduction in the credibility of a British passport - nothing is forge-proof (is that a word/phrase?) but even this incident doesn't mean that there are factories churning out hooky UK passports. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Wilson Posted February 18, 2010 Share Posted February 18, 2010 I have the transcript of todays meeting F.O. I say old boy, this passport business, it's not cricket, not cricket at all, no, no. Isr Fuck up or I'll kill you too. F.O. Oh I say! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thistle_do_nicely Posted February 18, 2010 Share Posted February 18, 2010 What are the thoughts of people on this latest attempt to find the final solution? For the last couple of years Israel has been gradually starving the Gaza strip, in an effort to break Hamas (which was originally democratically elected, just like Arafat was), and then they act all surprised when an oppressed and starving people get violent! At the moment they are (amusingly enough) trying to find a final solution, ignoring hundred of years of precedent about what violence achieves. Short of killing everyone in the West Bank and Gaza (which even they probably wouldn't do), there is no military way for them to achieve peace. This latest invasion will achieve the square root of f**k all, just like all their previous attempts. Great choice of words there you fucking ignorant bellend. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwififer Posted February 19, 2010 Share Posted February 19, 2010 Mossad are great. Hopefully the Israeli ambassador is being given a huge pat on the back and a list of other clowns they can go and take out. they certainly don't screw about with national security. You have a passport right? Its generally trusted, you get free travel within Europe, it serves as ID. If a British passport is discredited as commonly forged, thanks to repeated incidents like this, then you can say goodbye to that. Look forward to full cavity searches and visas to travel anywhere. Thats why we need to come down hard on whoever is responsible, and we (as the public) need to make sure any investigation doesn't go the way of the BAE or Saudi Arabian investigations. Doulikefish seems to think its alright. Reynard thinks its alright. You are being over-dramatic methinks. And it's +3. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam_Wee Posted February 19, 2010 Share Posted February 19, 2010 Well, yes. I listed some examples of it in a previous post, specifically, examples of Israel being caught at it. Aye, perhaps if you're a insular halfwit. Is that the the same men that initially fled to Jordan? Its a strange one because this sort of thing doesn't normally make such a big impact, after all, the Israeli secret service are normally pretty efficient. Hopefully some facts do emerge, and we investigate it properly, because this is too interesting to just be swept under the carpet. At least you don't think its a non story! Resorting to personal insults, my that is big! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTChris Posted February 19, 2010 Share Posted February 19, 2010 From today's Daily Telegraph The two men, who are both in custody in Dubai, supplied logistical support to an assassination squad that carried out the killing of Mahmoud al-Mabhouh, according to police in the Gulf state.Making a potentially explosive accusation, Hamas alleged that Ahmad Hasnin and Anwar Shekhaiber are employed by a company whose owner is a top confidante of Mr Abbas, the western-backed leader of the Palestinian Authority, which controls the West Bank. Already facing domestic criticism for allegedly pursuing an overly cosy relationship with Israel, the allegations are likely to cause deep discomfort for Mr Abbas. They could also complicate faltering diplomatic efforts to end a bitter feud between Mr Abbas's moderate Fatah faction and the Islamists of Hamas, which controls Gaza. The two factions fought a brief civil war in 2007, which ended when Fatah was ejected from Gaza. "We know that the two Palestinians that were arrested worked as police officers with the Fatah police in Gaza before Hamas took control," Ihab Ghussain, a spokesman for the Hamas interior ministry in Gaza, was quoted as saying. Fatah acknowledged that both men, who were extradited to Dubai from Jordan, were employed by the Palestinian Authority until 2007 but maintained that neither remained in service after the civil war. Allies of Mr Abbas sought to deflect the charges of collusion by repeating claims that Hamas had been infiltrated by Israeli intelligence and that at least one of the two men had fled Gaza after his cover as an Israeli double agent had been exposed. "Hamas should extensively search the scope of penetration within its ranks that has led to the assassination of Mabhouh and other Hamas leaders," a spokesman for the Palestinian Authority security forces said. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doulikefish Posted March 2, 2010 Share Posted March 2, 2010 Hamas hold brit 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTChris Posted March 2, 2010 Share Posted March 2, 2010 (edited) Hamas hold brit Strange story - I hadn't read anything about that. Hamas investigate Arab link to Dubai killing Edit: Just googled the story doulikefish posted and according to reports at the time Martin was making a documentary about a young Palestinian militant who belonged to a an offshoot of Fatah. This man has been detained by Hamas in Gaza on suspcion of passing information to Israel and Martin was giving evidence in his trial when he was when he was carted off to jail. Interesting, could be a British citizen getting caught upin the ongoing fueding between Fatah and Hamas. Edited March 2, 2010 by ICTChris 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swampy Posted March 2, 2010 Share Posted March 2, 2010 I don't think that the Israeli's will be using forged British passports again for a while, given the publicity garnered by this case, so any repeated incidents such as this are unlikely. I would also doubt that this would cause any reduction in the credibility of a British passport - nothing is forge-proof (is that a word/phrase?) but even this incident doesn't mean that there are factories churning out hooky UK passports. I do think that an illiberal government (e.g. Labour, Conservative) would be secretly delighted with this development as it could re-awaken the ID card issue, and also make mandatory the new biometric passports. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTChris Posted March 2, 2010 Share Posted March 2, 2010 I do think that an illiberal government (e.g. Labour, Conservative) would be secretly delighted with this development as it could re-awaken the ID card issue, and also make mandatory the new biometric passports. I'm sure our current Westminster government wouldn't be averse to using developments like this to argue for the measures you describe. Of course, biometric passports and ID cards are completely impossible to forge. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swampy Posted March 2, 2010 Share Posted March 2, 2010 Oh yes, and they can't at all be intercepted, either. That's a point. I haven't been keeping up with this particular story - was it the new-fangled passports that were (allegedly) used or the old-style ones? And did Israel definitely do this or is it still conspiracy? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pink Freud Posted March 2, 2010 Share Posted March 2, 2010 Oh yes, and they can't at all be intercepted, either. That's a point. I haven't been keeping up with this particular story - was it the new-fangled passports that were (allegedly) used or the old-style ones? And did Israel definitely do this or is it still conspiracy? It was the old style ones - it seems that they deliberately went for them. So in fact there is no added reason to make our identities more "secure". Which is probably why the whole thing has gone quiet. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted March 23, 2010 Author Share Posted March 23, 2010 Hard to believe, but we are actually doing something! Britain is to expel an Israeli diplomat over the cloning of British passports linked to the hit-squad killing of a Hamas commander, the BBC has learned. Foreign Secretary David Miliband will make a statement to Parliament later. The foreign secretary is to make the statement after Britain's Serious Organised Crime Agency found proof of the cloned passports, said BBC correspondent Jeremy Bowen. Diplomatic sources stressed the British government was not accusing Israel of involvement in the killing, our correspondent added. However the expulsion sends a very strong message of Britain's displeasure at the cloning of UK passports. Interesting... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTChris Posted March 23, 2010 Share Posted March 23, 2010 Interesting... It is interesting. I wonder if the Israeli's will respond in kind, that is the usual way these diplomatic spats play out. The last diplomat I remember being slung out was a Russian in the wake of the Litvenenko killing, although there's probably been others that have been low profile. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted April 2, 2010 Author Share Posted April 2, 2010 http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/8600285.stm Its been a busy news day! Israeli planes have carried out 13 air strikes on the Hamas-ruled Gaza Strip, Palestinian sources have told the BBC.Four of the strikes took place near the town of Khan Younis, where two Israeli soldiers were killed in clashes with Palestinian fighters last week. Israel says the operation was targeting four weapons factories. Reports say three children were injured. The latest violence is the most serious since the end of Israel's assault on Gaza in January 2009. Is this the same Gaza strip that Israel are gradually starving to death, and in which they have "pacified" the Palestinians? See all this flattening and killing, it isn't going to work! It only makes things worse. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The big chair Posted April 2, 2010 Share Posted April 2, 2010 Is this the same Gaza strip that Israel are gradually starving to death, and in which they have "pacified" the Palestinians? See all this flattening and killing, it isn't going to work! It only makes things worse. Could turning the Gaza strip into a nature resort be the answer? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted January 23, 2011 Author Share Posted January 23, 2011 Shock result coming up: Israel inquiry finds Gaza aid flotilla raid 'was legal' An Israeli inquiry has found the country's navy acted legally in a deadly raid on a flotilla of aid ships trying to reach Gaza last May. The raid, in which nine Turkish activists were killed, attracted widespread international condemnation. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 My, that Lord Hutton does get about doesn't he... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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