ObserverFromAfar

Just looked at that link... that photo may, just may, have been okay back in the day. But in this day and age?

My life as Noel Edmomd's alter ego

Whatever he loses, he won't lose his dignity.. He's already forfeited that by being associated with Livi.

Wouldn, they be made redundant Redundancy Statutory Minimum entitlement either from company or tax payer?

Thanks for the link.... Got a great advert accompanying the doc...

Short but incorrect. Meadowbank Thiatle weren't unsustainable prior to William Provan Hunter assuming 'control'. Upto that point the club was cash rich due to superb financial management of the late John Blacklaw. The myth that viability could only be achieved in Livingston was proven mythical by the first close shave with administration/liquidation (occuring under WP Hunter's 'control') in 1998 which was only averted due to the generosity of a Lottery winner. With 2 administration events since then, and the current round of boardroom and financial uncertainty, it is clearly evident that, no matter what their business model, 18 years on Livi have never been, or ever will be, viable.

The comments from Brewing Up A Storm provide an interesting insight and contextual background based on his/her view of events based on a time before the vast majority of current fans took up an interest in the football club. As such it is ignorance not to appreciate there is a history and background which needs to be explained. Moving on 18 years, why, based on what I see on here or 'supporter operated forums', are only 1 or 2 fans wondering: - about the nature of the Trust's rep departure from the board - can a replacement fans' rep be put on in his place - are there any more issues or problems our there that this is diverting attention from, ie is the club in danger of going through its 4th financial crisis. Given the commentary on here from a limited number of individuals about the size of the directors' loans, then my perception is that the fans are silent and therefore not overly concerned the silence demonstrates consent that things are all tickety-boo.

Has the Suporters' rep on the board, David Stoker, left his role? Was it the end of his stint? If so, have the supporters been offered the chance to select a new board member? Or has he resigned ... or left involuntarily?

Aye.. He walked away He walked back in He walked away again You cannot accuse him of just walking away.... He walked away twice.

MCL - what makes it so interesting? What is the link to the Club or Trust??

<br /><br /><br />Oh no. The major noticeable similarity is all 3 had guys who pretended to have endless riches. 2 went blobby up - and it won't be 3rd time lucky if there is any justice.

Surely that's not right? If it is, what happened between 31 January 2010 when he was voted to be the the Trust's representative on the board and 30 July 2010 when he was appointed to the board? What role was he playing?

The Livi Trust rep on the board has another interesting responsibility. If I remember correctly, the personal statement he made when seeking election to the Board highlighted that he is also an employee of Her Majesty's Revenue & Customs. I am sure he correctly prioritises his employers interests in his dealings as a board member.

What on earth is happening? A legitimate and good question on the same topic asked for the 2nd or 3rd time by MCL, and no responses, neither decent nor indecent, from the Livi Trust members/supporters/donors. Come on - get us an answer.

Interesting.. according to the Candidates' Manifesto document on the Trust's site, Mr Stoker is "employed by HM Revenue and Customs". (http://www.liviforlife.co.uk/PDFs/TrustRepManifestos.pdf) Is it the first time am HMRC official has got on to a Football Club's board?

Ok.. words can be interpretted in many ways.. Players on 1st Division wages won't be offered the same money when their contracts expire unless the club can afford it. A good start! Before Christmas there had been no offers for the season pros at the club. Maybe, because the players left are not really good enough for full time clubs to offer them contracts?? The reason contracts weren't cancelled was the new owners had an obligation to honour them before they took over the club as stated as a requirement by the SFL. The Administrator/Interim Manager could have cancelled the contracts before the New Owners took control - I'm sure the new owners could have insisted on the cancellations before they took over, and therefore still complied with any SFL obligations they perceived they were under Ged sees us as a full time club next season. We have other avenues to bring in money that other part-time teams don't. Yes - I suppose if he is Chief Executive and handing out multi year full time contracts, he cannot say that he couldn't see them as a full time club. Having other revenue streams no other club has? Suppose if you are getting stadium and rooms etc at zero rent this year and relatively peppercorn rent next (subsidised courtesy of the Tax Payer), any sub letting of facilities will generate revenue no other club is capable of! We're closer to spending 99p in the £ than the general perception is and the directors aren't shovelling money into the club. Figures can be so misleading. Spending £1,000 in the £ is closer to 99p in the £, than spending £1,000,000 in the £. But it still doesn't mean you are not still incredibly overspending. Loss for this season. Now have a lower ceiling for wages. One of the main cuts was through the catering. Makes sense - if you have lower crowds in Division 3 than Division 1, catering costs should, per head, be lower. No surprise. There are no director's loans. None of the guys running the club are looking to fund the club going foward and we will aspire to be what we can afford to be. None of the guys want to lose money funding the club.... this does not say that none of them want to make money. The ticket scheme for P7s will run for two seasons provisionally. They wanted to just give free tickets to every one but it now has to be on a game by game basis. I am sure it would be unfair to say that the board didn't full think the plans through on this one. They are not looking to develop the stadium but are looking to let the Nitespot. They've outsourced a room in the stadium to a physio company Physis. Well, the club has been provided with a cheap rental 10000 or so seater stadium with function and functional rooms a plenty. So its obvious there is no need to develop a stadium if you don't own it, and with such great revenue opportunities of renting out assests owned by the local authority why wouldnt you look to utilise it? Shame the local authoirty/council tax payer isn't directly beenfiting from the physio's rent. The volunteers have saved the club around a 5 figure sum for this season. The local tax payers (via the generosity of the local council) have, arguably, contributed and allowed the club to save, even more.

I presume the cheque won't bounce? Did the Trust's Fighting Fund donate the money to East Stirling? Seriously, I think it is more aligned with "common courtesy", than a "nice touch".

Oh .. have Livingston been reinstated to Division One?

Any thoughts on this one.. http://www.livilions.co.uk/forums/showthre...4197#post324197 May be me misunderstanding it completely, but it looks like some of the Trust's money (may be the Fighting Fund referenced here) is being used to pay for a New Year's Eve party at Livingston FC. I'm sure it has been well publicised, lots of people have bought tickets etc, and will be successful (with lessons learned from the last 2 cancelled events.. the Brunch & Christmas party).

In attempt to balance the "censorship" you were subject to VikingTON, there is an outbreak of questioning going on right now at that site: people asking LLD (programme contributor/editor) to ask Ged Nixon to clarify the 99p in the £ spending claim and are the directors lending or donating money to the club to gap any bridges; some peoples' perception of some of high prices for their up coming cup game - £16 for adults v Dundee (although offering a new contract to Robbie Winters may be the explaination for higher than expected gate). Good luck to those Livi fans starting to question how Livi is being run.

Sure... for scratching a game, no points deduction but a fine of a few thousand and £1000 costs to East Stirling. Everything ticketyboo!

Hello EdinburghLivi I'll try not to be too negative or put the boot in an unconstructive manner. Maybe its somewhere in the other 500+ pages, but do you know if making the Full Time players redundant was ever considered by the new owners or the Interim Manager/Administrator? Would that have been acceptable to the SFL or resulted in a harsher footballing "punishment" for Livingston? Interesting comments on the owners probably underwriting any wage/creditor shortfalls post-administration. Do you know if these ae genuine "donations" that are being made with no repayment expected, or IOUs that would be liabilities on the club's/company's balance sheet? For the health of Livi, I hope it is a donation. Cheers

Like several posters on here, it's all a bit fast moving and sometimes difficult to get a true and fair perspective on what's going on! Can someone please help bring me up to speed and answer a few questions to clarify my understanding? 1. In the proposed new structure, the man the Livi fans considered would be no good for the club and didn't want any where close to it, Rankine, will hold more shares in it than anyone any other body (50%)? 2. The Trust do not hold a significant shareholding in the club, and, should any vote come down on shares held, the fans' Trust do not have a real say in the running of the club? 3. Nixon is holding shares on his own behalf, and not on behalf of the Trust or any other fans' group? 4. Although Massone is being berated by Livi fans etc, if he and his consortium had not turned up to buy the club last year, his offer was the only one the ensured the continuation of football at LIvi last season and witout which, it is likely there would be no Livi today? McDougall and Rankine, two people who combined would own a majority interest in Livi under current proposals, did not raise the equivalent of a "note of interest" in Flynn's sale of the club? 5. Based on the posting earlier by AND180Y quoting the LIvi Website, assuming the SFL confirm the reprieval of the club this week, even though McDougall may be Chairman and Nixon will CEO, with 50% of the shares, Rankine will have the biggest and most influential say in how the club/company is run and what deals are made/not made? 6. Future announcements, probably after this Wednesday's SFL meeting, from Livi's new owners may cast a positive light and remove the shadow of uncertainty about how the club will live within its' means in the future and how the existing debt will be managed away? 7. In light of everything, Livi fans are rejoicing at who maybe running the club and how it is proposed to be run? 8. There's still alot of work to be done to ensure Livi's survival? Thanks in advance!

What on earth are you implying? If there was fit and proper test, Jim would be up there with fittest and properest of them all. Or are you saying that given his involvement with LIvi previously and sitting on the same club management team as McDougall up until the last week or so, then his judgement may have been tinted? Surely not! Rankine has delivered on the knowing how the blazers operate - well done to him for getting this through the first hurdle. So... if a CVA is reached and an agreement made the debtors to pay them a fraction of the debts, where does that leave any revenue brought in from potential land deals and development? Money with the council rather than either the Football club or Rankine-McDougall-Nixon axis?

According to the Sun, the ownership of the "club" will be split 50% Rankine, and 50% between McDougall and Nixon. Now, do the Trust and the fans get any shares in this future? Will any profits from say land deals be split amongst these 3 only. Could have sworn that the Livi fans were against getting into any pact with Rankine. Well done to them if they pull this one off. Not sure if I feel uncomfortable about this proposed 'solution" one on moral grounds, or on the grounds of having a severe distaste of Livi the franshise (but not a distaste of the fans). Probably both to be honest, but with leanings towards the former.