Yoss Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Cheers both, useful info. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AND180Y Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Bank overdrafts, taxes and council taxes are preferential. What a load of pish!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbers Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 What a load of pish!! Exactly what your 5 words are. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Can someone point out the dancefloor for me? It's wherever you want it to be. Make your own boundaries... -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AND180Y Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Exactly what your 5 words are. I'm sure there is an insult there somewhere, I must be too clever to see it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muggy Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Honestly hope Livi come through this like we have. A completely different board and financial prudence. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Honestly hope Livi come through this like we have. A completely different board and financial prudence. Leapords (should that be Lions?) don't change their spots. Livingston will cheat honest clubs until the day they finally die. Hopefully that will not be too long, and then perhaps a new, proper club can start from the bottom and live within their means. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest penelope pitstop Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 (edited) Exactly what your 5 words are. No - he is right and yu are wrong - or at the least out of date. Bank overdrafts have no priority at all they are the same as any other unsecured loan. If the overdraft is secured by a mortgage on the clubs assets then that will take priority but not otherwise. Tax due to HMRC used to have preferential status but that was abolished in about 2004 since when they take their chances with all the other unsecured creditors. HMRC's hard line with clubs and refusing to agree to CVA's stem from this time. Council Tax has no priority and never has had I would make the point that no one else on here has about CVA's. In order for them to be agreed 75% of the creditors by value have to vote yes. HMRC have withdrawn all co-operation with Football CVA's since they lost their preferred creditor status. This is because of the preferred status given to football creditors by the SFL, SPL. EPL and EFL. They did challange the football creditors rule in the High Court in London in the case of HMRC -v- Wimbledon FC and lost in the court of appeal. Therefore unless the SFL waive the rule or HMRC are less than 25% of the creditors getting out via a CVA will not be as easy as all that. MCL - I would imagine that Massone would have to prove that he has put in £500k before he gets any status as a creditor at all - that may prove to be difficult. I am not sure where you got the comments about him having to agree to sell his shares if a buyer is found. That is not the way administration works - if 75% of the creditors agree a CVA then that will be entered into - only if he has more than 25% of the debt could he stop a CVA. As I said proving that may be difficult. If 75% of the creditors do not agree a CVA then the administrator can still sell the assets of the Company to a third party. This enables a value to be realised and if the administrator can show it was the only way to realise money because one or more party was refusing to accept the offer for whatever reason under a CVA. Again this does not need any kind of consent from Massone - it is the administrator's choice and there is nothing Massone can do to stop him. The administrator's powers are set up to prevent a rogue owner like Massone sabotagueing a deal and they are effective. Whoever is telling you the information you are putting on here is wrong. Massone has no power now other than as a creditor with everyone else - and only then if he can satisfactorially show he has a genuine debt. Edited July 24, 2009 by penelope pitstop 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCL Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 The Interim Manager Donald McGruther - BBC Video 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chibber Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Leapords (should that be Lions?) don't change their spots. Livingston will cheat honest clubs until the day they finally die. Hopefully that will not be too long, and then perhaps a new, proper club can start from the bottom and live within their means. well said 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raith1974 Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 (edited) Honestly hope Livi come through this like we have. A completely different board and financial prudence. Do you mean, ditch all their debt and start a fresh spending big money which will come back in the future to bite your arse. I don't like to see football clubs go to the wall, but my club had to cut their cloth to stay in existance so if the worst was to happen then they only have themselves to blame for spending too much but gaining nothing. Edited July 24, 2009 by raith1974 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCL Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 MCL - I would imagine that Massone would have to prove that he has put in £500k before he gets any status as a creditor at all - that may prove to be difficult. Obviously and I'm not saying he has put anything like that in. I'm wondering though if the moneymen who disappeared last year have loaned money to the club through Massone and he is claiming that it's his personal money ? The guy McGruther will need to be good to untangle everything in a couple of weeks !! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rovers_Lad Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Do you mean, ditch all their debt and start a fresh spending big money which will come back in the future to bite your arse. Is that not what Dundee are doing? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muggy Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Leapords (should that be Lions?) don't change their spots. Livingston will cheat honest clubs until the day they finally die. Hopefully that will not be too long, and then perhaps a new, proper club can start from the bottom and live within their means. Dundee can be the shining inspiration to any side who wants to better themselves and make themselves an attractive proposition. Livi will survive. Livi sopravviveranno. Essi uscirà più forte di questo. Noi (Dundee) vi mostra la via. Seguire noi. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbers Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Andy180. My apologies. My info was v ery much out of date. PP, thanks for the update on this. Its as you say though, a CVA will be very hard to get at best. I just hope this can be resolved very quickly and that a new and genuine livi fc is born from it. However, it still stands as administration, interim or otherwise, and the SFL have to act upon that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banjo player Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Livi sopravviveranno. Essi uscirà più forte di questo. Noi (Dundee) vi mostra la via. Seguire noi. Dove il gabinetto? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Dundee can be the shining inspiration to any side who wants to better themselves and make themselves an attractive proposition. Livi will survive. Livi sopravviveranno. Essi uscirà più forte di questo. Noi (Dundee) vi mostra la via. Seguire noi. Too fishy for me. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Wall E Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 I would imagine that Massone would have to prove that he has put in £500k before he gets any status as a creditor at all - that may prove to be difficult. The administrator's powers are set up to prevent a rogue owner like Massone sabotagueing a deal and they are effective. Massone has no power now other than as a creditor with everyone else - and only then if he can satisfactorially show he has a genuine debt. Massone's got no future at Livi. It's time for him to be shown the door. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raith1974 Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Is that not what Dundee are doing? My point exactly. There should be a clause written that when debt is apparently written off then the new owners coming in can't make a mockery of the situation by spending hundreds of thousands on new players. Debt MUST and should be paid back, once a club gets back on its feet, just like Dundee. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muggy Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 (edited) My point exactly. There should be a clause written that when debt is apparently written off then the new owners coming in can't make a mockery of the situation by spending hundreds of thousands on new players. Debt MUST and should be paid back, once a club gets back on its feet, just like Dundee. Wouldn't work. Melville would not have came to Dundee if he had to pay all creditors back. Stupid thinking, son. Edited July 24, 2009 by Muggy 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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