The New Raith Rovers Thread

[Rovers1992/1993]

Oaft, your club is an absolute fucking shambles.
It's absolutely delicious.

Just another visit in here just to let us know how little you care about us Grant?

[HoBNob]

Just another visit in here just to let us know how little you care about us Grant?

You will be absolutely astounded at just easy it is to make a post on a forum, I'll read anything that'll give me a chuckle.

[Poet of the Macabre]

4 hours ago, Rovers1992/1993 said:

Just another visit in here just to let us know how little you care about us Grant?

Don't think Pars fans have ever said we don't care about the Rovers. Just that we support a far bigger and better club.

£50k lost though, yikes. What a bunch of cheats.

[Stellaboz]

TBF, it's disgusting

[Rovers_Lad]

7 hours ago, Grant228 said:

 

Oaft, your club is an absolute fucking shambles.
It's absolutely delicious.

 

That's what happens when your trying to service your debts

[Frank conner]

10 hours ago, donny86 said:

To sum up so far this season Drysdale has:

 

Appointed Locke from a pool of great candidates

 

Allowed us to swap Vaughan for Stevenson

 

Didn't know the rules of his own committee so we had to play a striker in goals against relegation rivals

 

Dropped gate prices after getting fans to commit to season tickets

 

If anyone else makes decisions like this at work they would be sacked. He should do the right thing and walk

 

 

 

Unfortunately he wont be sacked the directors dont have the guts all the cliques  at the club will rally round him probably  to protect their own interests. Plus i know they wont come out and say it but lockes appointment had nothing to do with his cv it was our so called hearts connection a couple  of phone calls from gorgie job done.

[Fifes Elite Force]

56 minutes ago, Rovers_Lad said:

That's what happens when your trying to service your debts

Speaking of debts the accounts say there are creditors due within 1 year for the tune of 935k (as at June 2016), since it is abbreviated accounts it doesn't go into too much detail. Anyone know what this is for?  Reading the accounts the club is relying on shareholder funds

"At the year end the company had net liabilities of £878,120 and it relies on the financial support of the directors to continue trading,. The directors have confirmed that they will continue to provide adequate support for the foreseeable future and they consider it appropriate to prepare the financial statements as a going concern"

Also I assume you don't own your stadium and pay rent in a similar way to ourselves, if that's the case what debts are you servicing, if its shareholder loans they look like they have risen so if the club aren't paying it back between 2015/2016 so the only way they could be servicing them is paying interest to the directors who have lended the money?

Edited April 13, 2017 by Fifes Elite Force

[Beachbum]

You'll get all the answers here. It's not something the ordinary supporter is privy to.

[Scary Bear]

You'll get all the answers here. It's not something the ordinary supporter is privy to.

Not sure you will.

Me: how much are we paying Skacel, how much is the third party paying and what's Skacel's total wage?
Lassie in office: whit, son?
Me: (repeat previous)
Lassie in office: eh...*muffled voice* I've got some nutter here going on about players wages.
Me: How much money is Eric on with wages and expenses?
Lassie in office: *call ended*

I feel like giving it a try just to see if it's something like this.

[Fifes Elite Force]

20 minutes ago, Beachbum said:

You'll get all the answers here. It's not something the ordinary supporter is privy to.

Someone else brought up the servicing of the debts point (I have even quoted them), I am merely asking for more clarity.

Hopefully the shareholder funds quote isn't anything to be too worried about

 

 

 

[Stellaboz]

Sickening stuff

[Zen Archer (Raconteur)]

[The Moonster]

1 hour ago, Frank conner said:

lockes appointment had nothing to do with his cv

I would fucking hope not.

[Rovers_Lad]

46 minutes ago, Fifes Elite Force said:Speaking of debts the accounts say there are creditors due within 1 year for the tune of 935k (as at June 2016), since it is abbreviated accounts it doesn't go into too much detail. Anyone know what this is for?  Reading the accounts the club is relying on shareholder funds

"At the year end the company had net liabilities of £878,120 and it relies on the financial support of the directors to continue trading,. The directors have confirmed that they will continue to provide adequate support for the foreseeable future and they consider it appropriate to prepare the financial statements as a going concern"

Also I assume you don't own your stadium and pay rent in a similar way to ourselves, if that's the case what debts are you servicing, if its shareholder loans they look like they have risen so if the club aren't paying it back between 2015/2016 so the only way they could be servicing them is paying interest to the directors who have lended the money?

The make up of who owns what at Starks is or was complicated and sure there's been a moving of bodies/ money/ who owns what over the last few years.As you say we don't own the stadium our only asset that's worth much( not a lot)it's owned or was owed by Starks Park properties,only one director John Simm( controlling interest).He did or still does provide a personal guarantee to the bank of 400 + thousand so guessing that makes up the best part of figure you mentioned

[Poet of the Macabre]

Thousands being lost, supporters in revolt, relegation on the horizon. Very worrying times for Raith Rovers Football Club.

[Beachbum]

3 minutes ago, Rovers_Lad said:

The make up of who owns what at Starks is or was complicated and sure there's been a moving of bodies/ money/ who owns what over the last few years.As you say we don't own the stadium our only asset that's worth much( not a lot)it's owned or was owed by Starks Park properties,only one director John Simm( controlling interest).He did or still does provide a personal guarantee to the bank of 400 + thousand so guessing that makes up the best part of figure you mentioned

I would agree with that.

This was the state of affairs 2 years ago:

The open invite AGM, which was attended by around 50 supporters, took place in the Raith Suite and started with chairman Young announcing profits of £97,000 for the year to June 30, 2014.

He explained that the most of the profit was a result of the income generated from the live televised Scottish Cup quarter-final against St Johnstone, adding that the Ramsdens Cup run produced little extra income.

The balance sheet showed a deficit of £507,000 but Young explained that £427,000 was due to internal creditors, with only £80,000 due to the “outside world”.

“All tax payments are up to date and there is no bank borrowing,” he added. “We have costs under control.”

[Skyline Drifter]

1 hour ago, Fifes Elite Force said:

Speaking of debts the accounts say there are creditors due within 1 year for the tune of 935k (as at June 2016), since it is abbreviated accounts it doesn't go into too much detail. Anyone know what this is for?  Reading the accounts the club is relying on shareholder funds

"At the year end the company had net liabilities of £878,120 and it relies on the financial support of the directors to continue trading,. The directors have confirmed that they will continue to provide adequate support for the foreseeable future and they consider it appropriate to prepare the financial statements as a going concern"

Also I assume you don't own your stadium and pay rent in a similar way to ourselves, if that's the case what debts are you servicing, if its shareholder loans they look like they have risen so if the club aren't paying it back between 2015/2016 so the only way they could be servicing them is paying interest to the directors who have lended the money?

The vast majority of the £935k will be directors loans or possibly inter company loans to other parts of the group.

[Fifes Elite Force]

 

21 minutes ago, Skyline Drifter said:

The vast majority of the £935k will be directors loans or possibly inter company loans to other parts of the group.

Correct, that's what my post states, heres the quote

"At the year end the company had net liabilities of £878,120 and it relies on the financial support of the directors to continue trading,. The directors have confirmed that they will continue to provide adequate support for the foreseeable future and they consider it appropriate to prepare the financial statements as a going concern"

 

44 minutes ago, Rovers_Lad said:

The make up of who owns what at Starks is or was complicated and sure there's been a moving of bodies/ money/ who owns what over the last few years.As you say we don't own the stadium our only asset that's worth much( not a lot)it's owned or was owed by Starks Park properties,only one director John Simm( controlling interest).He did or still does provide a personal guarantee to the bank of 400 + thousand so guessing that makes up the best part of figure you mentioned

Its actually not complicated at all, John Sim owns 51% of the stadium company with the other two shareholders owning a combined 49%.  If John Sim has a personal guarantee with the bank for the debt then that would be (and is) on the balance sheet of the stadium company not the football club so it wouldn't be included in the figure in the football clubs accounts surely?

The stadium company owns the stadium, It has the debt and security has been provided. where does the debt in the football clubs accounts come into it? Surely if they did then the stadium company would have debtors for the same  amount that is owed to them by the club but it sits at zero at the moment? 

I am not an expert of accounts so happy for someone to explain it to me

 

Edited April 13, 2017 by Fifes Elite Force

[Fifes Elite Force]

55 minutes ago, Beachbum said:

I would agree with that.

This was the state of affairs 2 years ago:

The open invite AGM, which was attended by around 50 supporters, took place in the Raith Suite and started with chairman Young announcing profits of £97,000 for the year to June 30, 2014.

He explained that the most of the profit was a result of the income generated from the live televised Scottish Cup quarter-final against St Johnstone, adding that the Ramsdens Cup run produced little extra income.

The balance sheet showed a deficit of £507,000 but Young explained that £427,000 was due to internal creditors, with only £80,000 due to the “outside world”.

“All tax payments are up to date and there is no bank borrowing,” he added. “We have costs under control.”

Has there been an open invite to the AGM since 2014?

Looking at the accounts the figure for these creditors due within 1 year has risen from 353,845 on 30/06/2014 to 934,611 to 30/06/2016.

 

Has there been any statements for Rovers to explain these amounts or is the club relyng on shareholder loans to keep trading?

Edited April 13, 2017 by Fifes Elite Force

[Skyline Drifter]

33 minutes ago, Fifes Elite Force said:

 

Correct, that's what my post states, heres the quote

"At the year end the company had net liabilities of £878,120 and it relies on the financial support of the directors to continue trading,. The directors have confirmed that they will continue to provide adequate support for the foreseeable future and they consider it appropriate to prepare the financial statements as a going concern"

Well, no, it doesn't. Nothing in that quote, which you've quoted twice now and is a pretty bog standard going concern caveat in an auditor's report, actually says who the debt is to. It could all be owed to The Robert Maxwell Pension Fund for all you know based on that quote. All that says is that the company owes a lot of money and that it depends on financial support of directors to guarantee it's ability to continue to service that debt (to whatever extent it actually needs serviced, it may be interest free and on easy repayment / no repayment terms for all we know here).

Incidentally, a guarantee from directors wouldn't be on the balance sheet of ANY company. A guarantee if just what it says, a promise to pay something if the company defaults, It's not a liability in itself and wouldn't have a financial value in the accounts.