TxRover Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 30 minutes ago, Been going too long said: Because Nolan didn’t want to resign or Murray didn’t rate him, you can be Nolan’s biggest fan all you want but that’s the reality. We enter cup competitions like every other provincial club hoping to land the OF so we have more money and only you would try and argue last season’s defence was any good I’m pointing out something you seem to be missing in your complaint. You say we haven’t signed enough…you say that Nolan isn’t good enough…OK, fine, make up your mind. Nolan started for us last year and is thereby, by default, a reasonable person to sign if we’re that short, especially if we’d be pairing him with Watson, no? Wait, IM doesn’t think he’s worth signing, what could that mean? Could it be we have a loan already tentatively agreed upon, someone better than Nolan? Could it be Nolan wants too much money? Could it be Nolan doesn’t want to be here? Or could it be any of an hundred other factors…some or all of these factors could apply to almost any of the apparently available CB’s (according to some posters) that are just waiting for us to pluck them from the North CB Sea. Just to clarify, I actually think Masson is about 90% of Nolan right now and Corr is probably as good. Oh, and last seasons defence wasn’t terrible, in that it had a specific weakness for set-pieces, and that’s hardly down to the CB’s alone. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renton Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 8 minutes ago, TxRover said: Just to clarify, I actually think Masson is about 90% of Nolan right now and Corr is probably as good. Oh, and last seasons defence wasn’t terrible, in that it had a specific weakness for set-pieces, and that’s hardly down to the CB’s alone. I'm not thrilled at the prospect of Masson starting, but even I wouldn't be that nasty about his skill level. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Been going too long Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 9 minutes ago, TxRover said: I’m pointing out something you seem to be missing in your complaint. You say we haven’t signed enough…you say that Nolan isn’t good enough…OK, fine, make up your mind. Nolan started for us last year and is thereby, by default, a reasonable person to sign if we’re that short, especially if we’d be pairing him with Watson, no? Wait, IM doesn’t think he’s worth signing, what could that mean? Could it be we have a loan already tentatively agreed upon, someone better than Nolan? Could it be Nolan wants too much money? Could it be Nolan doesn’t want to be here? Or could it be any of an hundred other factors…some or all of these factors could apply to almost any of the apparently available CB’s (according to some posters) that are just waiting for us to pluck them from the North CB Sea. Just to clarify, I actually think Masson is about 90% of Nolan right now and Corr is probably as good. Oh, and last seasons defence wasn’t terrible, in that it had a specific weakness for set-pieces, and that’s hardly down to the CB’s alone.honestly @TxRover are you Nicola sturgeon in real life and use lots of words when a few would do ? Nolan wasn’t very good, I made my mind up about that a long time ago 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Been going too long Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 15 minutes ago, Beachbum said: Remember it well, a good day enjoyed by all 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirJimmyofNic Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 Bloody glad I'm not Masson or Corr reading some of these posts, the confidence would be well sapped, gie the boys a chance ffs till we at least see who wants to come and play for the club. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TxRover Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 7 minutes ago, SirJimmyofNic said: Bloody glad I'm not Masson or Corr reading some of these posts, the confidence would be well sapped, gie the boys a chance ffs till we at least see who wants to come and play for the club. I agree with that thought. Masson is a young player who has not been given many chances to play , let alone play CB. We saw Watson coach him through the last couple of times he played, and he’s only better for that. If we started with him Saturday, he would still be ahead of where Nolan was when he first started for us. Corr has more playing time, although much at a lower level, and appears slightly ahead of Masson in development (which makes sense). Either would probably do just fine paired with Watson, it’s more the lack of depth that worries me than a lack of talent. As for @Been going too long having made up his mind Nolan wasn’t very good…Nolan was a key player in getting to the Challenge Cup Final, the League Cup Quarters and staying in contention for the playoffs. That’s not terribly bad for a “wasn’t very good” player, and can you explain how we were 12-1-8 in games where Nolan played more than 20 minutes…and 6-9-9 in games where he didn’t play or (the 2) he played less than 20 minutes. Again, that being said, I’m happy we retained Masson and got Corr versus retaining Nolan and losing Masson, as I think Masson has a bright future. On ex-player related notes, Coulson seems a popular player at Alloa, and is apparently much more confident looking now he’s seeing semi-regular playing time. Not much word about Young at Dumbarton yet, but I really wish we had that spare LB right about now. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael W Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 1 hour ago, Beachbum said: By my reckoning, he was at least 30yards further back than that when he hit it. That video's been doctored. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ro Sham Bo Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 3 minutes ago, Michael W said: By my reckoning, he was at least 30yards further back than that when he hit it. That video's been doctored. He was definitely in our own half... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hadji Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 1 hour ago, TxRover said: I’m pointing out something you seem to be missing in your complaint. You say we haven’t signed enough…you say that Nolan isn’t good enough…OK, fine, make up your mind. Nolan started for us last year and is thereby, by default, a reasonable person to sign if we’re that short, especially if we’d be pairing him with Watson, no? Wait, IM doesn’t think he’s worth signing, what could that mean? Could it be we have a loan already tentatively agreed upon, someone better than Nolan? Could it be Nolan wants too much money? Could it be Nolan doesn’t want to be here? Or could it be any of an hundred other factors…some or all of these factors could apply to almost any of the apparently available CB’s (according to some posters) that are just waiting for us to pluck them from the North CB Sea. Just to clarify, I actually think Masson is about 90% of Nolan right now and Corr is probably as good. Oh, and last seasons defence wasn’t terrible, in that it had a specific weakness for set-pieces, and that’s hardly down to the CB’s alone. You're missing the point totally. Nolan didn't want to re sign and IM didn't want him to resign. ATM there are no deals loans or permanent pending, the club is actively searching for "up to 3 starters" Last seasons defence WAS that terrible we had clear and obvious deficiencies that the opposition took advantage of time and time again! (dead balls) 17 minutes ago, TxRover said: agree with that thought. Masson is a young player who has not been given many chances to play , let alone play CB. We saw Watson coach him through the last couple of times he played, and he’s only better for that. If we started with him Saturday, he would still be ahead of where Nolan was when he first started for us. The manager may not think Masson is as ready as you do hence his limited/chosen game time. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Been going too long Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 19 minutes ago, TxRover said: I agree with that thought. Masson is a young player who has not been given many chances to play , let alone play CB. We saw Watson coach him through the last couple of times he played, and he’s only better for that. If we started with him Saturday, he would still be ahead of where Nolan was when he first started for us. Corr has more playing time, although much at a lower level, and appears slightly ahead of Masson in development (which makes sense). Either would probably do just fine paired with Watson, it’s more the lack of depth that worries me than a lack of talent. As for @Been going too long having made up his mind Nolan wasn’t very good…Nolan was a key player in getting to the Challenge Cup Final, the League Cup Quarters and staying in contention for the playoffs. That’s not terribly bad for a “wasn’t very good” player, and can you explain how we were 12-1-8 in games where Nolan played more than 20 minutes…and 6-9-9 in games where he didn’t play or (the 2) he played less than 20 minutes. Again, that being said, I’m happy we retained Masson and got Corr versus retaining Nolan and losing Masson, as I think Masson has a bright future. On ex-player related notes, Coulson seems a popular player at Alloa, and is apparently much more confident looking now he’s seeing semi-regular playing time. Not much word about Young at Dumbarton yet, but I really wish we had that spare LB right about now. @tx I don’t have the energy to explain anything to you, I have wasted enough time with you, so to summarise last years defence was good in your eyes and your disappointed we didn’t keep more of them, I think you stand alone on that front, Paterson has gone back to Hartlepool for pre season so maybe they will assess him and release him or whatever. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Been going too long Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 4 minutes ago, Ro Sham Bo said: He was definitely in our own half... He was in our 6 yard box if I remember correctly 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TxRover Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 2 minutes ago, Hadji said: You're missing the point totally. Nolan didn't want to re sign and IM didn't want him to resign. ATM there are no deals loans or permanent pending, the club is actively searching for "up to 3 starters" Last seasons defence WAS that terrible we had clear and obvious deficiencies that the opposition took advantage of time and time again! (dead balls) The manager may not think Masson is as ready as you do hence his limited/chosen game time. No, I covered those points. Nolan is simply another example of one of those CB’s out there, and how we just may not be able to sign any of them, which is why we’re short at back. The defence wasn’t terrible, it WAS terrible against set pieces. We allowed 49 goals, versus 44 the year before (and we were on track to allow 48 the year before that), so unless we’re arguing that the previous three years we’ve had bad defences, it seems a bit myopic to target last year alone. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renton Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 3 minutes ago, TxRover said: No, I covered those points. Nolan is simply another example of one of those CB’s out there, and how we just may not be able to sign any of them, which is why we’re short at back. The defence wasn’t terrible, it WAS terrible against set pieces. We allowed 49 goals, versus 44 the year before (and we were on track to allow 48 the year before that), so unless we’re arguing that the previous three years we’ve had bad defences, it seems a bit myopic to target last year alone. McGlynn ball defences generally were a big shaky. Davo and Bene always having a mistake between them (and McGlynn never exactly being a wizard at training his teams against dead balls) but also due to a setup that pushed both full backs up high. We didn't notice it too much the Covid season due to being generally quite swashbuckling at the other end (and the fortuitous ending of the season as we started to look like we might be running out of steam in the league), but poor defences will generally see you in far deeper shit than brilliant attacks will lift you high. Hence why some folk are expressing some amount of disquiet about the state of ours. Nolan, for the record, was, for us at least a third rate centre back who's best attribute was his ability to stay fit. Not comfortable with the ball at his feet, not terribly fast and if Lang was too rash, then Nolan too lackadaisical. He was neither commanding or canny. Fwiw, I'd hope Masson has something more about him, but I wouldn't be relying on him all year, and like it or not Saturday's game is fairly pivotal for cup advancement - and getting an early win, particularly on TV can only be good for maintaining the off field momentum and helping shift ticket sales before the ever fickle KDY public decide "its the same old Rovers" 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CountryBumpkin Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 No point complaining about it now, we've got what we've got for the weekend and likely the group stage of the tournament, so lets support the lads who play. Masson and Corr deserve their opportunity to play, you don't gain any experience sitting on the bench and while they're our players we should be behind them and hoping they get every opportunity to prove themselves and progress. From what i've seen of Masson this pre-season, aside from a few hand in the back fouls on the notoriously annoying to play against Nathan Austin, he's done nothing to suggest he doesn't deserve the chance. I can't recall a time where he's let us down when playing either. He was subbed early against Dundee but that was for a formation change rather than performance. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RRFC_Liam Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 1 hour ago, TxRover said: Nolan started for us last year and is thereby, by default, a reasonable person to sign if we’re that short Nolan only played because we had no one else that was a natural left sided CB,dick was only a back up CB if needed, Masson mainly right sided and it’s clear Murray thinks he not ready with the amount of time he’s given him, Nolan was also apart of a horrid defence with an obvious weakness 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stardog_champion Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 1 hour ago, Beachbum said: I fell over 3 seats when that went in. Also cracked my collar bone in the process 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RR35 Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 4 minutes ago, CountryBumpkin said: No point complaining about it now, we've got what we've got for the weekend and likely the group stage of the tournament, so lets support the lads who play. Masson and Corr deserve their opportunity to play, you don't gain any experience sitting on the bench and while they're our players we should be behind them and hoping they get every opportunity to prove themselves and progress. From what i've seen of Masson this pre-season, aside from a few hand in the back fouls on the notoriously annoying to play against Nathan Austin, he's done nothing to suggest he doesn't deserve the chance. I can't recall a time where he's let us down when playing either. He was subbed early against Dundee but that was for a formation change rather than performance. Masson was subbed off around the 30 minute mark after having a complete and utter howler against Dundee In the East Fife game he looked an extremely weak link. What I would say is his tackling looked on point in the second half but with the influx of quality players we desperately need another capable centre half. Personally I would send Masson on loan for a season to see how he shapes up in league 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirJimmyofNic Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 There's no denying the need for at least a good CB and LB ( Patterson being back at Hartlepool and if released he'll probably end up elsewhere), plus a DM if Broon or Mathews have to be nursed back, but whoever there is out there with the necessary experience has to want to come to the club for the salary the club can afford to pay, Masson & Corr yes are inexperienced, but at least we have them to develop and dont forget Millen & Dick were very much part of a poor defence yet nobody has said a word about their part in conceeding 49 goals The team is a work in progress just like the infrastructure of the club, they dont happen overnight 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RRFC_Liam Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 3 hours ago, Hadji said: we've tried to get Muirhead, Murray and Stranger as well as Ngwenya Aye that’s the difficult part mate now is that 2/3 if Ngwenya joins partick all tied up who would’ve added to the squad especially Stanger who was highly rated, Murray’s future is currently unknown he may or may not sign for us(unless you know more and he’s defo not)… as the pars were linked also it could well be we might bring in another total unknown or another older head we’ll just have to wait and see 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RRFC_Liam Posted July 13, 2023 Share Posted July 13, 2023 3 minutes ago, SirJimmyofNic said: There's no denying the need for at least a good CB and LB ( Patterson being back at Hartlepool and if released he'll probably end up elsewhere), plus a DM if Broon or Mathews have to be nursed back, but whoever there is out there with the necessary experience has to want to come to the club for the salary the club can afford to pay, Masson & Corr yes are inexperienced, but at least we have them to develop and dont forget Millen & Dick were very much part of a poor defence yet nobody has said a word about their part in conceeding 49 goals The team is a work in progress just like the infrastructure of the club, they dont happen overnight Wouldn’t be surprised if Patterson ended back up at cove with Hartley tbh 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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