Al B Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 (edited) I'd say going purely on what you've written and without finding any other information, you haven't listened to much of Machine Head's most recent 3 albums. I may be wrong and probably am, but your view on their style seem very out-dated. I could see how you could (at a stretch, to be fair)...draw a parallel between Pantera and something like Burn My Eyes, but Ashes, The Blackening and Locust are miiiiles away from Pantera (for whom I would agree with your groove metal description, if it had to have a tag). One thing is a cast iron definite however, and that is that these days Machine Head could in no way be classed as a groove metal band. And I genuinely struggle to believe that anyone would put them even on the same shelf as Ministry or Fear Factory...that's just bizarre. And regarding Max Cavalera and your opinion that he hasn't done anything worthwhile since Chaos A.D....aside from opening up a whole Soulfly debate as you clearly don't rate their stuff otherwise you'd have mentioned them....but the Roots album isn't worthwhile??? Again, that's just a bizarre view from someone who likes metal as a general genre. Whether you like the album or not is neither here nor there and purely down to taste...but to dismiss it as not being worthwhile is madness when it's arguably the most influential thing from Cavalera's whole musical output. Edited October 26, 2013 by Al B 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavieCFC Posted October 26, 2013 Share Posted October 26, 2013 I'd say going purely on what you've written and without finding any other information, you haven't listened to much of Machine Head's most recent 3 albums. I may be wrong and probably am, but your view on their style seem very out-dated. I could see how you could (at a stretch, to be fair)...draw a parallel between Pantera and something like Burn My Eyes, but Ashes, The Blackening and Locust are miiiiles away from Pantera (for whom I would agree with your groove metal description, if it had to have a tag). One thing is a cast iron definite however, and that is that these days Machine Head could in no way be classed as a groove metal band. And I genuinely struggle to believe that anyone would put them even on the same shelf as Ministry or Fear Factory...that's just bizarre. And regarding Max Cavalera and your opinion that he hasn't done anything worthwhile since Chaos A.D....aside from opening up a whole Soulfly debate as you clearly don't rate their stuff otherwise you'd have mentioned them....but the Roots album isn't worthwhile??? Again, that's just a bizarre view from someone who likes metal as a general genre. Whether you like the album or not is neither here nor there and purely down to taste...but to dismiss it as not being worthwhile is madness when it's arguably the most influential thing from Cavalera's whole musical output. Roots is a fucking awful album. Early Sepultura is brilliant thrash, but the whole change in style that came about with Roots pretty much killed them for me and alot of other people (look at the avergae scores on the Metal Archives and Rate your music, theres a big dropoff from their earlier stuff, which is a pretty good (but no definitive) indicator that people didnt like the new direction they took). Dont get me wrong i do like Machine Head (i own 4 of their albums) but have i ever at one point consider them thrash? Nope and im pretty sure if you asked fans of the thrash metal genre, Machine head isnt a band thats going to come to mind, if you want to hear Rob Flynn doing thrash, listen to Vio-Lence. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavieCFC Posted October 27, 2013 Share Posted October 27, 2013 You clearly don't. And following your claims Max Cavalera has done nowt good since Chaos A.D, Roots is a quality album and you obviously don't rate Soulfly. Whats also clear is you mustn't have heard either Nailbomb or Cavalera Conspiracy... Il say it again, Max Cavalera has done nothing worthwhile since Chaos AD. You seem to find that concept hard to grasp, im aware of what he has done since, its bad. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Patterson Posted October 27, 2013 Share Posted October 27, 2013 Can folk not just agree to disagree? Some folk like certain albums, other folk don't. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Patterson Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 The early Seps stuff when they were still thrash was quality but Roots (taking nothing away from it's quality) was an obvious stylistic change. Quite like how Max has incorporated more world music into his records over the years. The Prophecy album by Soulfly is a favourite of mine. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavieCFC Posted October 29, 2013 Share Posted October 29, 2013 I'll agree to disagree. The guy doesn't know his thrash from his elbow. Roots wasn't when Sepultura stopped being thrash. Chaos AD was the album Sepultura 'changed direction' so to speak. Slowing down from thrash to a new tuned-down slower metal. Roots was just another change in direction. Point out when i said Sepultura stopped being Thrash. I just said they stopped being good after Chaos AD because off the style change (which the previous poster elluded too) that really came to the forefront with Roots. I hated all that tribal shit they added. You cant fucking read. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Patterson Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 Not strictly metal I suppose but more so than the other material of that era. Amongst the best that the old band ever did. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Patterson Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 ^Good tune^ Locomotive is a class tune from that era too. Aye that's a belter. Loved when they did more challenging stuff like that. Only issue with the Illusions records is Sorum is such a dullard at times and also Izzy is mixed way too low though I understand that he was smacked out of his face a lot around that time so having him louder might not have been for the best. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Patterson Posted November 2, 2013 Share Posted November 2, 2013 Totally disagree about Sorum - added a bigger sound and tighter performance to the band, and a technically much better drummer. Izzy got sober during the Illusions tour and eventually quit as he couldn't be around the other musicians drug & booze issues, whilst Axl was just being a control freak and drama queen. Sorum certainly allowed the band to get to another level and do stuff that Adler wouldn't have a clue with but there's times when his playing just sounds too clinical and drum machine like. That being said I don't think the overly compressed snare and kick sounds helped. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunning1874 Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 Download announcement at 8am tomorrow. All three headliners and sub-headliners to come over the course of this week. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Patterson Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 Chat of Avenged getting a headline slot. Struggle to take them seriously tbh but at the same time, I suppose a so called "newer" band has to make the step up at some point. In a few years we're not going to have the likes of Maiden, Metallica etc around anymore so someone will need to step up to the plate. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IainMorton Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 Chat of Avenged getting a headline slot. Struggle to take them seriously tbh but at the same time, I suppose a so called "newer" band has to make the step up at some point. In a few years we're not going to have the likes of Maiden, Metallica etc around anymore so someone will need to step up to the plate. Same thing was said of BFMV and Trivium, but they seem to be falling back down the pecking order after looking promising. Avenged seem to be getting stronger though. Would be good to see them headline. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Patterson Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 Suggestions of Avenged / Kiss / Van Halen 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunning1874 Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 Yeah, I reckon Avenged will be one of them. I was absolutely certain it'd be them before their album came out, but it wasn't a massive critical success despite the initial sales being huge so there's a possibility they could just be a sub-headliner. Still about a 95% likelihood they'll be headliners though, it's about time they pushed another band onto headline and it can really help a band's reputation to headline a festival the stature of Download: obviously they always had a good reputation as a live band but it was Download 2009 that really cemented Slipknot as one of the top level live metal acts. Also 8am is an unusually early time in the morning for an announcement, but it happens to be 9am in Sweden, Sweden Rock are also having an announcement tomorrow, so we'll be getting a band which fits in there. Van Halen and Aerosmith have both been heavily rumoured, highly unlikely both would play but good booking if it's either of them. There has been talk of Aerosmith headlining with VH as special guests which would be pretty spectacular. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Patterson Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 Asides from something like an Appetite era GN'R reunion (can't really think of much else of that magnitude) they're soon not going to be able to keep wheeling out old bands as an easy cash cow. It must be awkward for the likes of Copping putting a bill together. You probably genuinely do want to have new bands getting up to another level but at the same time you know you're going to need to have certain names which will sell the tickets. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunning1874 Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 We're going to get a headliner and sub-headliner on Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday. Glad this is coming so early, gives more time to weigh up my options for festivals for next year. I want to see how the Bloodstock undercard shapes up and I'm also considering my first Euro festival, had planned for Wacken but then it sold out in two days so that was down the shitter, looking at doing MetalDays in Slovenia if the line-up turns out well. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavieCFC Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 Mentioned the upcoming announcments to my dad he heard strong rumours of Status Quo playing download, mentioned it would be the 4 original members playing this time round. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Patterson Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 Mentioned the upcoming announcments to my dad he heard strong rumours of Status Quo playing download, mentioned it would be the 4 original members playing this time round. The Frantic 4 lineup in a tent would be tremendous. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunning1874 Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 Avenged Sevenfold headlining Friday, Rob Zombie subbing. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrcat1990 Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 Pretty uninspiring choice. Regardless of my opinion on Avenged Sevenfold's music they hardly scream headline material. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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