Comic Book Movies (and TV Shows)

[DA Baracus]

If they did Venom again, they couldn't do it any worse than in Spiderman 3. The bit where Peter Parker turns heel was an exceptional piece of cinema for all the wrong reasons.

[11thHour]

If they did Venom again, they couldn't do it any worse than in Spiderman 3. The bit where Peter Parker turns heel was an exceptional piece of cinema for all the wrong reasons.

The whole Emo haircut thing was fucking hilarious/cringeworthy. And before he turns and is full of confidence he is swaggering down the street and then starts dancing at some bird walking by, utterly embarrassing.

[the jambo-rocker]

I think heroes and villians come and go in terms of class. I always thought Iron Man was something of a B character in the Marvel universe until they went for a complete revamp of him before the movie. Electro could easily be given the same effect.

[banterman86]

The only problem with that is that to do that storyline any justice Kraven has to be a firmly established character, otherwise it doesn't have the resonance as to why Kraven acts like he does in it. No you could do a variation on the character's debut in SM #15 (with obvious amendments for being 2012 and not the 60's) and I think that would work far better.

fine shout

I think heroes and villians come and go in terms of class. I always thought Iron Man was something of a B character in the Marvel universe until they went for a complete revamp of him before the movie. Electro could easily be given the same effect.

It's not so much about their quality but their pop culture resonance - i think, for example, that The Ventriloquist is a brilliant Batman villain, but I'd be suprised if he was the lead villian in a Batman film

[captainkev]

fine shout

It's not so much about their quality but their pop culture resonance - i think, for example, that The Ventriloquist is a brilliant Batman villain, but I'd be suprised if he was the lead villian in a Batman film

I think there is something to the pop culture thing of villains going in and out of fashion as time goes on. Even The Joker had a bit of a dry spell in the comics during the 1960s only to come back with a bang as comics started to move on from the silver age. Mr. Freeze is a good example of a villain who was pretty unremarkable for the first couple of decades after his creation. But since the animated series of the early 90s he's become a quite popular villain (schwarzeneggar's portrayal excluded ).

I have to agree with you on the Ventriloquist. Excellent villain but we're unlikely to see him in a Batman film any time soon. I'd quite like to see Mad Hatter as a villain in a Batman film. It's quite unlikely though that Warner Bros. would have him as a villain either.

[banterman86]

I think there is something to the pop culture thing of villains going in and out of fashion as time goes on. Even The Joker had a bit of a dry spell in the comics during the 1960s only to come back with a bang as comics started to move on from the silver age. Mr. Freeze is a good example of a villain who was pretty unremarkable for the first couple of decades after his creation. But since the animated series of the early 90s he's become a quite popular villain (schwarzeneggar's portrayal excluded ).

I have to agree with you on the Ventriloquist. Excellent villain but we're unlikely to see him in a Batman film any time soon. I'd quite like to see Mad Hatter as a villain in a Batman film. It's quite unlikely though that Warner Bros. would have him as a villain either.

Mr Freeze is is a good villan because he's a bit of a tragoc figure, it;s a shame Arnold has ruined him for the forseeable movie going future.

I actually thought The Ventriloquitst would ahve fit into the Nolanverse quite well, in an unhinged sort of way, it'd be a real opportunity to do some different.

My problem with the Mad Hatter is that in the wrong hands he turns into a bit of a Joker rip off, I thouight the Arkham games captured him very well though. The good thing for the next Bat films is that Nolan, Joker and Dent aside, picked some left field villans,leavong favourties like The Penguin and Riddler free.

[DA Baracus]

The whole Emo haircut thing was fucking hilarious/cringeworthy. And before he turns and is full of confidence he is swaggering down the street and then starts dancing at some bird walking by, utterly embarrassing.

It's brilliant, utterly brilliant. I saw it at the cinema and for a moment genuinely thought it was another film.

[captainkev]

Mr Freeze is is a good villan because he's a bit of a tragoc figure, it;s a shame Arnold has ruined him for the forseeable movie going future.

I actually thought The Ventriloquitst would ahve fit into the Nolanverse quite well, in an unhinged sort of way, it'd be a real opportunity to do some different.

My problem with the Mad Hatter is that in the wrong hands he turns into a bit of a Joker rip off, I thouight the Arkham games captured him very well though. The good thing for the next Bat films is that Nolan, Joker and Dent aside, picked some left field villans,leavong favourties like The Penguin and Riddler free.

Unfortunately that's true for a few Batman villains, you only have to look at Tommy Lee Jones's performance as Two-Face in Batman Forever. The characters who have an obvious gimmick can easily be turned into poor Joker knock-offs.

Victor zsasz has a lot of potential as a villain too. You could do a pretty decent film with Batman hunting down Zsasz trying to stop him going on a killing spree. The phone call sidequest in Arkham city and his interview tapes in Arkham Asylum show Zsasz's particular addiction to murdering people can be quite creepy. Plus if it's a cat and mouse style story with Batman and Zsasz you can technically look at Batman as the worlds greatest detective which none of the Batman films have really gone into up till now.

Edited December 6, 2012 by captainkev

[banterman86]

Unfortunately that's true for a few Batman villains, you only have to look at Tommy Lee Jones's performance as Two-Face in Batman Forever. The characters who have an obvious gimmick can easily be turned into poor Joker knock-offs.

Victor zsasz has a lot of potential as a villain too. You could do a pretty decent film with Batman hunting down Zsasz trying to stop him going on a killing spree. The phone call sidequest in Arkham city and his interview tapes in Arkham Asylum show Zsasz's particular addiction to murdering people can be quite creepy. Plus if it's a cat and mouse style story with Batman and Zsasz you can technically look at Batman as the worlds greatest detective which none of the Batman films have really gone into so up till now.

I've ran out of greenies kev, or else I would have plussed your last few posts. A detective angle for the next Bat-film would be great, the Riddler would also work in that vein.

[forehead7]

The good thing for the next Bat films is that Nolan, Joker and Dent aside, picked some left field villans,leavong favourties like The Penguin and Riddler free.

I think that's more just proof of how vast Batman's Rogues Gallery is, not just with loads of villains but the quality of the villains as well. Nolan used 2/3 a film for three films and still didn't use a bunch of big ones.

I kind of wish Nolan had used the Riddler or Freeze, especially the latter because no one wants those 90s versions being the only cinematic version about.

I like Kev's shout of making detective style Batman films. You could throw in the likes of Deadshot and Hush to those sort of villains that would fit in with a less physical style of Batman films. I'd also buy Joseph Gordon-Levitt as Batman if they went down the detective route because him besting Bane in a physical fight would be beyond ridiculous.

[banterman86]

I like Kev's shout of making detective style Batman films. You could throw in the likes of Deadshot and Hush to those sort of villains that would fit in with a less physical style of Batman films. I'd also buy Joseph Gordon-Levitt as Batman if they went down the detective route because him besting Bane in a physical fight would be beyond ridiculous.

Like Brock Le...

Edit only joshing forehead, yeah Detective is the way to go!

Edited December 6, 2012 by banterman86

[captainkev]

I think that's more just proof of how vast Batman's Rogues Gallery is, not just with loads of villains but the quality of the villains as well. Nolan used 2/3 a film for three films and still didn't use a bunch of big ones.

I kind of wish Nolan had used the Riddler or Freeze, especially the latter because no one wants those 90s versions being the only cinematic version about.

I like Kev's shout of making detective style Batman films. You could throw in the likes of Deadshot and Hush to those sort of villains that would fit in with a less physical style of Batman films. I'd also buy Joseph Gordon-Levitt as Batman if they went down the detective route because him besting Bane in a physical fight would be beyond ridiculous.

I think if they are going to do Hush they should wait until they've established an series with ongoing villains in place (like Nolan did with Scarecrow in his three films). Then when you've had a couple of films or so and got the villains ready to go, do the original Hush storyline with all the villains lining up to get Batman. Frankly do that or an Arkham Asylum film with Batman trapped with the lunatics.

A film with Deadshot is a good shout as well, wouldn't mind seeing what a fresh creative team would do with him.

Is anyone else keen on seeing a more serious take on Robin? Batman Forever wasn't horrendous in it's approach with the character but they ultimately shot themselves in the foot by having an actor too old to be Robin. The character of Robin particularly seems to have been contaminated by the failure of Batman and Robin as far as the mainstream opinion goes. It good to see him get taken as seriously as Batman has been in the last three films.

Edit: Meant to add, I know Jospeh Gordon-Levitt's character is meant to be a Robin-esque figure but it's not the same as the actual boy wonder himself is it?

Edited December 6, 2012 by captainkev

[banterman86]

I don't think JGL will be continuing his Nolanverse character, the new Batman will surely be a fresh slate

Is anyone else keen on seeing a more serious take on Robin? Batman Forever wasn't horrendous in it's approach with the character but they ultimately shot themselves in the foot by having an actor too old to be Robin. The character of Robin particularly seems to have been contaminated by the failure of Batman and Robin as far as the mainstream opinion goes. It good to see him get taken as seriously as Batman has been in the last three films.

Introducing Robin would be a quick clear way to establish the new franchise as different. It's a hard one to balance though.

[captainkev]

I don't think JGL will be continuing his Nolanverse character, the new Batman will surely be a fresh slate

Introducing Robin would be a quick clear way to establish the new franchise as different. It's a hard one to balance though.

Seeing as doing the origin story again for Batman will probably be unneccesary (The Amazing Spiderman kinda demonstrated that) perhaps the best way to get a new Batman series going would to fire in with him already out fighting crime and doing the Robin origin from scratch? They might not even choose the Dick Grayson Robin either which would be unexpected but still interesting.

[banterman86]

Seeing as doing the origin story again for Batman will probably be unneccesary (The Amazing Spiderman kinda demonstrated that) perhaps the best way to get a new Batman series going would to fire in with him already out fighting crime and doing the Robin origin from scratch? They might not even choose the Dick Grayson Robin either which would be unexpected but still interesting.

Yes, that is exactly what i'd do if you were going down the Robin route - introduce Batman to the audience through his eyes, kind of like Sherlock Holmes and Dr Watson

[forehead7]

I think if they are going to do Hush they should wait until they've established an series with ongoing villains in place (like Nolan did with Scarecrow in his three films). Then when you've had a couple of films or so and got the villains ready to go, do the original Hush storyline with all the villains lining up to get Batman. Frankly do that or an Arkham Asylum film with Batman trapped with the lunatics.

A film with Deadshot is a good shout as well, wouldn't mind seeing what a fresh creative team would do with him.

Is anyone else keen on seeing a more serious take on Robin? Batman Forever wasn't horrendous in it's approach with the character but they ultimately shot themselves in the foot by having an actor too old to be Robin. The character of Robin particularly seems to have been contaminated by the failure of Batman and Robin as far as the mainstream opinion goes. It good to see him get taken as seriously as Batman has been in the last three films.

Edit: Meant to add, I know Jospeh Gordon-Levitt's character is meant to be a Robin-esque figure but it's not the same as the actual boy wonder himself is it?

Yeah, I wouldn't use Hush as the first villain or even the main villain of the film (assuming they went with at least 2 per film like all the films have except Batman (1989)) but he could definitely be used if they went down the detective route.

I would quite like to see Robin done well. It'd need to be established beforehand though, I'm sure Bale vetoed any ideas of Robin (or said he'd never do a Batman film with Robin or something). I agree about Chris O'Donnell but I also think that any good stuff from those original films (maybe 1989 except) is like a needle in a haystack among all the shite. I don't know if I'd have Robin in the first film but could definitely be added in for the second one (if they're doing another trilogy). If they put the scene from Frank Miller's Batman and Robin (not sure if that was the comic or if it was All Stars) with them and Green Lantern, I'd pay to see it for that alone.

Green Lantern is giving Batman shit for Robin being like 14 or whatever, Batman and Robin are in a full yellow room, in yellow suits. Robin kicks his ass and steals his ring!

He seems a bit too old as well. If they continued with him, he'd probably need to be Nightwing (unless he did take up the Bat-cape)

[captainkev]

Yeah, I wouldn't use Hush as the first villain or even the main villain of the film (assuming they went with at least 2 per film like all the films have except Batman (1989)) but he could definitely be used if they went down the detective route.

I would quite like to see Robin done well. It'd need to be established beforehand though, I'm sure Bale vetoed any ideas of Robin (or said he'd never do a Batman film with Robin or something). I agree about Chris O'Donnell but I also think that any good stuff from those original films (maybe 1989 except) is like a needle in a haystack among all the shite. I don't know if I'd have Robin in the first film but could definitely be added in for the second one (if they're doing another trilogy). If they put the scene from Frank Miller's Batman and Robin (not sure if that was the comic or if it was All Stars) with them and Green Lantern, I'd pay to see it for that alone.

Green Lantern is giving Batman shit for Robin being like 14 or whatever, Batman and Robin are in a full yellow room, in yellow suits. Robin kicks his ass and steals his ring!

He seems a bit too old as well. If they continued with him, he'd probably need to be Nightwing (unless he did take up the Bat-cape)

I can see where Christian Bale was coming from when he said he'd refuse to a film with Robin. In retrospect it's easy to see his version of Bruce Wayne is a man who can barely keep himself together emotionally and psychologically. Obviously no version of Bruce Wayne is entirely stable given that he dresses up as a bat and goes out fighting crime. However the Bale version of Bruce Wayne seems far more emotionally damaged than the vast majority of interpretations of Batman that I've come across* . Batman usually serves as a father figure for Robin (in the same way Alfred does for Bruce Wayne) but there is no way Bale's Bruce Wayne could ever be that sort of person.

If they do go for Robin then I hope they'd be doing it with a view to making him Nightwing. An interesting route to go down perhaps would be to have Batman with Robin for a couple of films, have Robin become Nightwing leaving Batman alone again, then do a Killing Joke style story examining just how far Batman could and will go if he doesn't have Robin at his side to stop him. It'd be a hard sell to a studio to begin with but it'd be a potentially interesting story.

* The only one that comes close is the Batman in Grant Morrison's Arkham Asylum and even that's meant to be a criticism of that kind of emotionally vulnerable depiction of Batman

[tobeylarone]

JGL would be nightwing i would say, Robin just does not translate to the big screen, where as Nightwing is quite capable of carrying a film or franchise of his own i would say, especially with JGL,

As for villains my choice would be Great white Shark.

If i had any say in the next Batman film i would always pick Killer croc, but have him as a mudered/cannibal with a skin condition, rather than a crocodile/man/the lizard from spider-man.

[captainkev]

JGL would be nightwing i would say, Robin just does not translate to the big screen, where as Nightwing is quite capable of carrying a film or franchise of his own i would say, especially with JGL,

As for villains my choice would be Great white Shark.

If i had any say in the next Batman film i would always pick Killer croc, but have him as a mudered/cannibal with a skin condition, rather than a crocodile/man/the lizard from spider-man.

Great White Shark is potentially interesting. He's got a lot going for him but ultimately he' s probably too unknown by the public at large to be used as a villain at the moment. Then again I'd never heard of Ra's al Ghul and subsequently Talia al Ghul until after I'd watched Batman Begins so with the right person at the helm it might work out.

I don't agree that Robin does not or can not translate to the big screen. I mentioned Batman Forever earlier and although that film is far from perfect, I think it shows Robin can work in a Batman film. Batman Forever imo would have worked a bit better had they cast a younger actor as Robin.

Having Robin around gives Batman something to lose in a situation. Although Robin can look after himself, he's still Bruce Wayne's responsibility. In the comics the fact that Batman failed to save the second Robin from being killed by the Joker haunted the character for years after the actual story took place. If you put Robin's life seriously at threat in a film then you can really ramp up the stakes in a story rather than having resort to having a nuclear bomb set to blow up the city.

[yoda]

Black Mask would have worked very well in the "Nolanverse" Batman. You could have altered an origin story and thrown him in as Batman but gone bad: wealthy family, parents die, seeks vengeance but as a crime lord.