renton Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 I thought all China needeed to do to "win" was to ask the USA for it's wedge back? Given that the US is China's largest customer they'd be cutting their own throat. China and the US are stuck with each other, if China tries to collapse the US economy it'll only succeed in destroying it's own economy with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethbalesstupidface Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 I mean how much clearer do people need it to be, front page of the bbc right now http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-23845765 uk draws up contingency plans for military intervention http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-23845800 russia and china warn uk and usa against military intervention there it is in black and white, the world has not been closer to ww3 since the cuban missile crisis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AberdeenBud Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 The end is nigh, head for the hills! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renton Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 I mean how much clearer do people need it to be, front page of the bbc right now http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-23845765 uk draws up contingency plans for military intervention http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-23845800 russia and china warn uk and usa against military intervention there it is in black and white, the world has not been closer to ww3 since the cuban missile crisis. Yes it has, the 1983 Able Archer scare as well as the 1995 Norwegian weather satellite launch both had the Russian (Soviet) missile systems active and counting down. There is no way either Russia or China would dare use nuclear weapons in defence of Syria, and neither have the conventional forces to stop the west either in Syria itself or by attacking Europe or the States directly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Neither. Let them get on with it. Democracy evidently doesn't work in the Middle East. Why do you think "Democracy" (undefined) "evidently doesn't work" in the Middle East? Both your working and your general point would be welcomed. What is the difference between Syria and Saudi Arabia? Both are dictatorships controlled by a tribe. One plays ball and the other doesn't. If by "play ball" you mean (almost certainly) launch chemical weapons attacks on its own civilian population, then you'd have a valid point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captain kirk Posted August 27, 2013 Author Share Posted August 27, 2013 Dont recall Uncle Sam commenting on this red line? http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-22310544 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeeperDee Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 It's not like China's economy depends on the US economy doing well.. Not at all.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethbalesstupidface Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Yes it has, the 1983 Able Archer scare as well as the 1995 Norwegian weather satellite launch both had the Russian (Soviet) missile systems active and counting down. There is no way either Russia or China would dare use nuclear weapons in defence of Syria, and neither have the conventional forces to stop the west either in Syria itself or by attacking Europe or the States directly. no it hasnt, I'm aware of both those, they were simply misunderstandings that nearly caused a nuclear launch, this is much more serious, there is clear conflict and disagreement and two sides emerging. this did not start with syria, the sides were the same over libya, edward snowden also. and russia and china clearly do have the conventional forces to make a hell of a fight of it, as does iran, though its not them that actually wants war its us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeeperDee Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 no it hasnt, I'm aware of both those, they were simply misunderstandings that nearly caused a nuclear launch, this is much more serious, there is clear conflict and disagreement and two sides emerging. this did not start with syria, the sides were the same over libya, edward snowden also. and russia and china clearly do have the conventional forces to make a hell of a fight of it, as does iran, though its not them that actually wants war its us. Trollllllllllololololllllllololoooooollllllolol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethbalesstupidface Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 It's not like China's economy depends on the US economy doing well.. Not at all.. china isn't the one angling for war. the usa is, they also just announced they will reach their debt ceiling in october. possibly putting a timeline on all of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethbalesstupidface Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 putin has opposed us over iran, libya, edward snowden, now syria. russia has sent missiles to the syrian government, russia has also seen the largest mobilisation of its military since the cold war. all in the very recent past. you'd be very naive not to think something very big is developing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renton Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 no it hasnt, I'm aware of both those, they were simply misunderstandings that nearly caused a nuclear launch, this is much more serious, there is clear conflict and disagreement and two sides emerging. this did not start with syria, the sides were the same over libya, edward snowden also. and russia and china clearly do have the conventional forces to make a hell of a fight of it, as does iran, though its not them that actually wants war its us. Misunderstandings that got to within 10 minutes of a real nuclear launch, how do you get much closer? We are no where near that at the moment, and there is no way a true near peer conflagation between the major UNSC powers would stay conventional. The Russians sat on their hands over Libya and accepted that they couldn't do much about their other erstwhile ally, Serbia back in 1999. THe Russians and Chinese might not like it much, but there is little they could do to help Syria beyond given them a tonne of arms which the US would obligingly turn to slag in the long run. The Chinese don't have a conventional force that can fight anywhere beyong the asian mainland, and Russian options are severely limited as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethbalesstupidface Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 actually got nowhere near a nuclear launch. if you read the testimony of the officer who got the initial warnings he said he knew it couldnt possibly be an attack, in both instances, as he had always been trained that any attack would involve a massive launch of hundreds of missiles, and he was only getting 2 or 3. so really nowhere near it. nothing like as dangerous a situation as we are in now. as for china you clearly didnt see their latest aircraft carrier unveiled only this year, or their latest fighter jet which is remarkably enough identical to americas later fighter, sparking claims from america just this year also that china must have stolen the plans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
placidcasual Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Why do you think "Democracy" (undefined) "evidently doesn't work" in the Middle East? Both your working and your general point would be welcomed. If by "play ball" you mean (almost certainly) launch chemical weapons attacks on its own civilian population, then you'd have a valid point. The obvious answer would be Egypt. Look what happened to the democratically elected government there. Your turn now. Give me an example of a democracy in the Middle East that does work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reynard Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Given that the US is China's largest customer they'd be cutting their own throat. China and the US are stuck with each other, if China tries to collapse the US economy it'll only succeed in destroying it's own economy with it. Yes, I suppose it depends on how serious you thought I was being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reynard Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 The obvious answer would be Egypt. Look what happened to the democratically elected government there. Your turn now. Give me an example of a democracy in the Middle East that does work It works fine in Israel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorlomin Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 There will be no WWIII over Syria. The Russian fleet is a rusting hulk and the Med a western Mare Nostrum full of air bases and choke points. Syria is a non entity, little more than a football between Riyadh and Tehran. The Russians had clear reasons to get arsey over Serbia and had effectively gone to war for them in the past, but Syria? No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AberdeenBud Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Misunderstandings that got to within 10 minutes of a real nuclear launch, how do you get much closer? We are no where near that at the moment, and there is no way a true near peer conflagation between the major UNSC powers would stay conventional. The Russians sat on their hands over Libya and accepted that they couldn't do much about their other erstwhile ally, Serbia back in 1999. THe Russians and Chinese might not like it much, but there is little they could do to help Syria beyond given them a tonne of arms which the US would obligingly turn to slag in the long run. The Chinese don't have a conventional force that can fight anywhere beyong the asian mainland, and Russian options are severely limited as well. Yeah I seem to remember the tin foil hat brigade saying much the same thing after the Chinese embassy was bombed in Belgrade. David Icke says ww3 within 6 months. Here come the lizards! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethbalesstupidface Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 also totally pointless mentioning serbia in 99. russia was on its knees economically in 99 and at the weakest ever in their entire history pretty much, the rise in the price of oil under putin since then has seen their economy and military rebuilt. I didnt see anyone in the west protesting when they invaded georgia a few years ago. wonder why that was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethbalesstupidface Posted August 27, 2013 Share Posted August 27, 2013 Yeah I seem to remember the tin foil hat brigade saying much the same thing after the Chinese embassy was bombed in Belgrade. David Icke says ww3 within 6 months. Here come the lizards! nobody said that then. you're a bit of idiot tbh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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