The Famous Aberdeen - Season 2022/23

[HarleyQuinn]

If I were an Aberdeen player, I'd be upset by Robson's comments. It doesn't instill any confidence in your ability. As a fan, I don't want to hear it either. I hate this mentality of us (or any other club) just being there to make up numbers in a cup final against either half of the ugly sisters. Similarly to finishing in the elusive third spot and having a points gap of 20-30 behind 1st place, we are content with just reaching a cup final and picking up a runners up medal when facing either of those two.

We're officially out of Europe (having performed reasonably well) and we've finished runners up in the league cup final. Time to focus our energy on the league and propel ourselves into a fighting chance of that elusive third spot.

Getting ahead of myself however regarding January we need to source a new Ramadani. We've missed him this season. We also need to source a young replacement for Shinnie, who like Hayes, is done. Polvara is developing into a good footballer and I'd love to keep Barron (unlikely) but we need a few new faces in the middle of the park. A couple of wingers and a change of formation would be welcome too.

 

 

 

[DrewDon]

11 minutes ago, HarleyQuinn said:

If I were an Aberdeen player, I'd be upset by Robson's comments. It doesn't instill any confidence in your ability. As a fan, I don't want to hear it either. I hate this mentality of us (or any other club) just being there to make up numbers in a cup final against either half of the ugly sisters. Similarly to finishing in the elusive third spot and having a points gap of 20-30 behind 1st place, we are content with just reaching a cup final and picking up a runners up medal when facing either of those two.

We're officially out of Europe (having performed reasonably well) and we've finished runners up in the league cup final. Time to focus our energy on the league and propel ourselves into a fighting chance of that elusive third spot.

Getting ahead of myself however regarding January we need to source a new Ramadani. We've missed him this season. We also need to source a young replacement for Shinnie, who like Hayes, is done. Polvara is developing into a good footballer and I'd love to keep Barron (unlikely) but we need a few new faces in the middle of the park. A couple of wingers and a change of formation would be welcome too.

This isn't directed at you in particular, but I am sceptical about this idea of players suddenly being declared 'done' or 'finished' without looking at the wider context. It just seems a bit too convenient and easy. 

Shinnie is having a relatively poor season, but what function(s) is he being asked to perform by the management? Does he have the necessary support around him to perform these adequately in an already physically demanding set-up? Why is he being asked to essentially perform the work of at least two players because we didn't replace Ramadani, and also to carry more of the creative burden this season? He ended last season as one of our best and most important players, and was certainly missed during his suspension (and I remember thinking, along with many others, that Ramadani suffered without him there, too). It just seems unlikely to me that, a matter of months on, he is suddenly 'done' or 'finished', even if there will be a decline to be managed over a longer period there. 

Take another example: By and large, Clarkson has been a shadow of the player he was for most of last season, especially post-Goodwin. But nobody in their right mind would conclude that Clarkson is 'finished' because of this drop off. It is most likely because of what is around him, and what he is being asked to do. In the second half of last season, he essentially benefitted from having two dogs of war in Ramadani and Shinnie in front of him, which afforded him more time and space whilst helping to balance out his weaker areas. He doesn't have that structure or personnel around him to the same degree this season, and unsurprisingly his performances and outputs have suffered accordingly.

Sure, there has to be some individual responsibility on the players too, but there is clearly a bigger picture at play and it would be a mistake to overlook it.

[Dons_1988]

6 hours ago, DrewDon said:

This isn't directed at you in particular, but I am sceptical about this idea of players suddenly being declared 'done' or 'finished' without looking at the wider context. It just seems a bit too convenient and easy. 

Shinnie is having a relatively poor season, but what function(s) is he being asked to perform by the management? Does he have the necessary support around him to perform these adequately in an already physically demanding set-up? Why is he being asked to essentially perform the work of at least two players because we didn't replace Ramadani, and also to carry more of the creative burden this season? He ended last season as one of our best and most important players, and was certainly missed during his suspension (and I remember thinking, along with many others, that Ramadani suffered without him there, too). It just seems unlikely to me that, a matter of months on, he is suddenly 'done' or 'finished', even if there will be a decline to be managed over a longer period there. 

Take another example: By and large, Clarkson has been a shadow of the player he was for most of last season, especially post-Goodwin. But nobody in their right mind would conclude that Clarkson is 'finished' because of this drop off. It is most likely because of what is around him, and what he is being asked to do. In the second half of last season, he essentially benefitted from having two dogs of war in Ramadani and Shinnie in front of him, which afforded him more time and space whilst helping to balance out his weaker areas. He doesn't have that structure or personnel around him to the same degree this season, and unsurprisingly his performances and outputs have suffered accordingly.

Sure, there has to be some individual responsibility on the players too, but there is clearly a bigger picture at play and it would be a mistake to overlook it.

Shinnie was tremendous at ibrox this season and has had other decent performances, he’s clearly not finished. It’s definitely true that we’ve not replaced ramadani. 

This was obvious though, if you look back on this thread around the time we sold him you’ll see plenty of posts stating it’s madness to sell him without sourcing a replacement. 

[Dons_1988]

Barry Robsons post match comments are that of an inexperienced manager. 

He’s not said we had no chance in the final but he’s said words that no fan wants to hear after a performance like that, and can be wilfully misinterpreted. 

I don’t expect us to turn up at hampden and dominate rangers for 90 minutes, I’m fine with being difficult to beat and compact out of possession. I’m fine with us being direct too as long as there’s a purpose to it. 

But the fact is we didn’t lay a glove on them, we didn’t have a shot on target and at no point did I ever feel like we really threatened them. The plan was to chip balls over the top and in behind and hope they made a mistake to gift us something. They didn’t. 

Thats unforgivable Barry, it’s a cup final against a beatable side. You don’t get away with just being the unlucky underdog here. That was woeful. 

[Donte Polvara]

38 minutes ago, Dons_1988 said:

Barry Robsons post match comments are that of an inexperienced manager. 

He’s not said we had no chance in the final but he’s said words that no fan wants to hear after a performance like that, and can be wilfully misinterpreted. 

I don’t expect us to turn up at hampden and dominate rangers for 90 minutes, I’m fine with being difficult to beat and compact out of possession. I’m fine with us being direct too as long as there’s a purpose to it. 

But the fact is we didn’t lay a glove on them, we didn’t have a shot on target and at no point did I ever feel like we really threatened them. The plan was to chip balls over the top and in behind and hope they made a mistake to gift us something. They didn’t. 

Thats unforgivable Barry, it’s a cup final against a beatable side. You don’t get away with just being the unlucky underdog here. That was woeful. 

I'm not sure the blame for that can be entirely Robsons though we've pulled off this game plan created a good number of chances in Europe and twice against Rangers already this season. I think in the first half especially players were panicking and shelling balls forward without any real thought. They've shown they can do it but just lacked the composure to do it in the final. 

There's a lot of valid criticisms of Robson and that interview isn't a good look but the one thing I'd give him is we have been competitive against "better" teams. His record against Rangers since coming in is 2 wins, 1 draw (that should have been a win) and 2 defeats with a goal difference of +2. I think part of the reason that we all see Rangers as beatable is how we've performed against them under him outwith that since Clement has come in they've been unbeaten and topped their Europa league group. 

[Flammable sheep]

1 hour ago, Dons_1988 said:

The plan was to chip balls over the top and in behind and hope they made a mistake to gift us something. They didn’t. 

This is the plan in every game, it seems - doesn't matter if it's PAOK or Hibs. When it comes off and we take our chance, it feels good and there's no regrets, but the rest of the time it's absolutely awful and you come away thinking "what if we'd just tried to pass the ball and play with more control?". There's not a feeling of "well, at least we gave it a good go", it just feels like we didn't turn up. 

It's also completely against every point in that "football philosophy" document they came out with. Betting on fine margins like a long ball breaking our way or a set piece isn't playing attractive, attacking football with an identity. Is our philosophy now just "poor us, the bigger teams are better"?

[DukDukGoose]

2 hours ago, Donte Polvara said:

I'm not sure the blame for that can be entirely Robsons though we've pulled off this game plan created a good number of chances in Europe and twice against Rangers already this season. I think in the first half especially players were panicking and shelling balls forward without any real thought. They've shown they can do it but just lacked the composure to do it in the final. 

There's a lot of valid criticisms of Robson and that interview isn't a good look but the one thing I'd give him is we have been competitive against "better" teams. His record against Rangers since coming in is 2 wins, 1 draw (that should have been a win) and 2 defeats with a goal difference of +2. I think part of the reason that we all see Rangers as beatable is how we've performed against them under him outwith that since Clement has come in they've been unbeaten and topped their Europa league group. 

Define competitive?

If it's giving them a close game without anything to show for it then it's not working.

[Dons_1988]

2 hours ago, Donte Polvara said:

I'm not sure the blame for that can be entirely Robsons though we've pulled off this game plan created a good number of chances in Europe and twice against Rangers already this season. I think in the first half especially players were panicking and shelling balls forward without any real thought. They've shown they can do it but just lacked the composure to do it in the final. 

There's a lot of valid criticisms of Robson and that interview isn't a good look but the one thing I'd give him is we have been competitive against "better" teams. His record against Rangers since coming in is 2 wins, 1 draw (that should have been a win) and 2 defeats with a goal difference of +2. I think part of the reason that we all see Rangers as beatable is how we've performed against them under him outwith that since Clement has come in they've been unbeaten and topped their Europa league group. 

It wasn’t the same game plan that we’ve had success with. You watch back the second half at ibrox. We were solid but we counter attacked with purpose and committed bodies forward. That 2nd goal we were queuing up to hit shots. 

In the game at pittodrie we got in front by being aggressive and we had them rattled. In the second half we camped on our own box and conceded a lot of chances and chucked it. 

We all know what we saw yesterday. He just tried to stay in it and nick something. A repeat of 2018, where mcinnes did similar. But that day, like yesterday, we could have played all night and not scored. 

[Bogbrush1903]

11 hours ago, DrewDon said:

This isn't directed at you in particular, but I am sceptical about this idea of players suddenly being declared 'done' or 'finished' without looking at the wider context. It just seems a bit too convenient and easy. 

Shinnie is having a relatively poor season, but what function(s) is he being asked to perform by the management? Does he have the necessary support around him to perform these adequately in an already physically demanding set-up? Why is he being asked to essentially perform the work of at least two players because we didn't replace Ramadani, and also to carry more of the creative burden this season? He ended last season as one of our best and most important players, and was certainly missed during his suspension (and I remember thinking, along with many others, that Ramadani suffered without him there, too). It just seems unlikely to me that, a matter of months on, he is suddenly 'done' or 'finished', even if there will be a decline to be managed over a longer period there. 

Take another example: By and large, Clarkson has been a shadow of the player he was for most of last season, especially post-Goodwin. But nobody in their right mind would conclude that Clarkson is 'finished' because of this drop off. It is most likely because of what is around him, and what he is being asked to do. In the second half of last season, he essentially benefitted from having two dogs of war in Ramadani and Shinnie in front of him, which afforded him more time and space whilst helping to balance out his weaker areas. He doesn't have that structure or personnel around him to the same degree this season, and unsurprisingly his performances and outputs have suffered accordingly.

Sure, there has to be some individual responsibility on the players too, but there is clearly a bigger picture at play and it would be a mistake to overlook it.

Shinnie looked a yard off it both in body and mind yesterday, as he has done for most of the season.

If he still has the ability and stamina to perform at the level we require of him then he isn't fitting into the system Robson wants to play. 

If that's the case then Robson shouldn't be playing him in nearly every game (I know he was left out for Frankfurt).

I felt Barron and Polvara were more suited to that big Hampden pitch yesterday and McGarth or Clarkson behind the strikers but not both in the starting line up.

Shinnie perhaps a useful addition on the pitch later in the game but to go in alongside Barron.

I would've started with Miovski (although he didn't look fit to me) alongside Duk with Sokler a like-for-like (to an extent) replacement if Miovski was struggling.

I might've been tempted getting some natural width with Morris although he can be a useful sub as legs begin to tire.

I would've played MacDonald instead of Ruby and Hayes would've been making up the numbers on the bench.

[Donte Polvara]

41 minutes ago, DukDukGoose said:

Define competitive?

If it's giving them a close game without anything to show for it then it's not working.

4/6 points off Rangers in the league, beating Frankfurt at home, drawing with PAOK in Greece. Obviously there were some disappointing results PAOK at home, the two Helsinki games and the cup final but we were in those games for 90 minutes and deservedly so. Compare that to Hearts last season who got the same points at us but were on the receiving end of a 4-0,  3-0, 5-1 and 3-1. Which leads to my point that we're mainly letting ourselves down against teams at a similar or lower level to us.

Taking the conference league and league cup final in isolation the outcomes are a bit disappointing yes but we're there competing and you'd hope with more time with the squad we'd improve and take the next step and progress/win. If Robson can sort out performances against the non old firm teams then I'd happily keep him and play the way we do against the "bigger" teams. Whether he can do that is another thing I guess the run up until the winter break will tell us that but if we do bin him i'd like it to be because we're in the bottom half of the table not because we didn't win the league cup or get through the conference league group.

[Donte Polvara]

52 minutes ago, Dons_1988 said:

It wasn’t the same game plan that we’ve had success with. You watch back the second half at ibrox. We were solid but we counter attacked with purpose and committed bodies forward. That 2nd goal we were queuing up to hit shots. 

In the game at pittodrie we got in front by being aggressive and we had them rattled. In the second half we camped on our own box and conceded a lot of chances and chucked it. 

We all know what we saw yesterday. He just tried to stay in it and nick something. A repeat of 2018, where mcinnes did similar. But that day, like yesterday, we could have played all night and not scored. 

I agree with you in a way but I don't think Robson has said to them don't counter them well and get forward rather the players are lacked the confidence to do it in a cup final at Hampden. Part of the reason that we didn't counter with purpose or get bodies forward was that as soon as someone got the ball they either battered it up the park or misplaced a pass and I think there's a limit to how much Robson can affect that. 

[Dons_1988]

8 minutes ago, Donte Polvara said:

I agree with you in a way but I don't think Robson has said to them don't counter them well and get forward rather the players are lacked the confidence to do it in a cup final at Hampden. Part of the reason that we didn't counter with purpose or get bodies forward was that as soon as someone got the ball they either battered it up the park or misplaced a pass and I think there's a limit to how much Robson can affect that. 

I’m sorry but I disagree. They’ve done it in Frankfurt, they’ve done it in Greece, they’ve done it effectively against this rangers team more than once. I don’t think we can say we just froze on the big occasion. 

It’s actually so frustrating when we go 1-0 down and suddenly we do start attacking and getting men forward when we’re chasing it. I don’t think it’s a coincidence. 

And his comments after the match do suggest that he’s trying to justify his approach. 

[DrewDon]

39 minutes ago, Bogbrush1903 said:

Shinnie looked a yard off it both in body and mind yesterday, as he has done for most of the season.

If he still has the ability and stamina to perform at the level we require of him then he isn't fitting into the system Robson wants to play. 

If that's the case then Robson shouldn't be playing him in nearly every game (I know he was left out for Frankfurt).

I felt Barron and Polvara were more suited to that big Hampden pitch yesterday and McGarth or Clarkson behind the strikers but not both in the starting line up.

Shinnie perhaps a useful addition on the pitch later in the game but to go in alongside Barron.

I would've started with Miovski (although he didn't look fit to me) alongside Duk with Sokler a like-for-like (to an extent) replacement if Miovski was struggling.

I might've been tempted getting some natural width with Morris although he can be a useful sub as legs begin to tire.

I would've played MacDonald instead of Ruby and Hayes would've been making up the numbers on the bench.

It is all speculation, but my gut feeling is that a midfield two of Barron and Polvara would have struggled yesterday too, against the physicality of Lundstram and the energy of Sterling. I think Barron is our most complete midfielder and should be playing for us regularly, and I have thought that since people were telling me earlier this season that he would end up at Inverurie Locos or something. Even then, though, Polvara's defensive awareness still isn't all there and he still isn't great at tackling (both evidenced against Barisic at the goal), so you would likely have ended up with people making some similar criticisms of Barron if we had lost as are being made of Shinnie as he would have had to have picked up more slack. 

There would have been a way in a 5-4-1 to squeeze all three into the team, but that again circles back to questions about the system being deployed and the demands being placed on certain individuals. 

[Dubford don]

What we need is an experienced manager who would get the best out of what is actually a very decent squad

[Jacksgranda]

16 hours ago, DrewDon said:

We now have to find a way to achieve a good points total from Livingston, Dundee, Motherwell, St Mirren and Ross County in quick succession. I am definitely generalising a touch, but they all feel like games where we are likely to have a decent share of possession and unlikely to have as many opportunities to play in transition and over the top.

To be fair to Robson, he seems to have a very clear idea of how he wants his Aberdeen team to play, but I'm yet to see much if any evidence from him that he can adapt it to the type of games we have between now and 2nd January. 

6 points

[betting competition]

1 hour ago, Bogbrush1903 said:

Shinnie looked a yard off it both in body and mind yesterday, as he has done for most of the season.

If he still has the ability and stamina to perform at the level we require of him then he isn't fitting into the system Robson wants to play. 

If that's the case then Robson shouldn't be playing him in nearly every game (I know he was left out for Frankfurt).

I felt Barron and Polvara were more suited to that big Hampden pitch yesterday and McGarth or Clarkson behind the strikers but not both in the starting line up.

Shinnie perhaps a useful addition on the pitch later in the game but to go in alongside Barron.

I would've started with Miovski (although he didn't look fit to me) alongside Duk with Sokler a like-for-like (to an extent) replacement if Miovski was struggling.

I might've been tempted getting some natural width with Morris although he can be a useful sub as legs begin to tire.

I would've played MacDonald instead of Ruby and Hayes would've been making up the numbers on the bench.

Shinnie best game for Aberdeen this season was at Ibrox when we had 4 in the midfield, as DrewDon has said the problem is 3 against 4 which makes the Aberdeen midfielders look poor 

[Jacksgranda]

13 hours ago, HarleyQuinn said:

If I were an Aberdeen player, I'd be upset by Robson's comments. It doesn't instill any confidence in your ability. As a fan, I don't want to hear it either. I hate this mentality of us (or any other club) just being there to make up numbers in a cup final against either half of the ugly sisters. Similarly to finishing in the elusive third spot and having a points gap of 20-30 behind 1st place, we are content with just reaching a cup final and picking up a runners up medal when facing either of those two.

We're officially out of Europe (having performed reasonably well) and we've finished runners up in the league cup final. Time to focus our energy on the league and propel ourselves into a fighting chance of that elusive third spot.

Getting ahead of myself however regarding January we need to source a new Ramadani. We've missed him this season. We also need to source a young replacement for Shinnie, who like Hayes, is done. Polvara is developing into a good footballer and I'd love to keep Barron (unlikely) but we need a few new faces in the middle of the park. A couple of wingers and a change of formation would be welcome too.

 

 

 

We have plenty of those - 36. 17 in the league, 9 in the cup, 10 in the league cup.

[Thenorthernlight]

14 hours ago, HarleyQuinn said:

If I were an Aberdeen player, I'd be upset by Robson's comments. It doesn't instill any confidence in your ability. As a fan, I don't want to hear it either. I hate this mentality of us (or any other club) just being there to make up numbers in a cup final against either half of the ugly sisters. Similarly to finishing in the elusive third spot and having a points gap of 20-30 behind 1st place, we are content with just reaching a cup final and picking up a runners up medal when facing either of those two.

We're officially out of Europe (having performed reasonably well) and we've finished runners up in the league cup final. Time to focus our energy on the league and propel ourselves into a fighting chance of that elusive third spot.

Getting ahead of myself however regarding January we need to source a new Ramadani. We've missed him this season. We also need to source a young replacement for Shinnie, who like Hayes, is done. Polvara is developing into a good footballer and I'd love to keep Barron (unlikely) but we need a few new faces in the middle of the park. A couple of wingers and a change of formation would be welcome too.

 

 

 

See before we sign these players you’re looking for, there’s two far more pressing issues.

We need an actual DoF, not someone promoted above their level.

We also need a new manager, one that doesn’t treat us like idiots, and one who doesn’t play long ball guff every game. 

[kingjoey]

20 minutes ago, Thenorthernlight said:

See before we sign these players you’re looking for, there’s two far more pressing issues.

We need an actual DoF, not someone promoted above their level.

We also need a new manager, one that doesn’t treat us like idiots, and one who doesn’t play long ball guff every game. 

I'd read that post without knowing who had posted. After reading the last sentence I knew exactly who it was.  Never change NL.

[Thenorthernlight]

33 minutes ago, kingjoey said:

I'd read that post without knowing who had posted. After reading the last sentence I knew exactly who it was.  Never change NL.

Sorry?

I couldn’t hear you for the happy clapping.

You accept mediocrity (not even) if you like.

The club will love folk like you.

 

Edited December 18, 2023 by Thenorthernlight