BerwickMad Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Exactly. They're as bad as each other. Which is why it's utterly ridiculous when people fall for it. And it's the separatists shouting the loudest all the time, so the idiots on that side of the fence falling for it are more noticeable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confidemus Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Exactly. They're as bad as each other. Which is why it's utterly ridiculous when people fall for it. And it's the separatists shouting the loudest all the time, so the idiots on that side of the fence falling for it are more noticeable. Can you explain "it's the seperatists shouting the loudest all the time" to me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebhoy123 Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Tax and spend would be an issue for me..... ( a big issue ) seems to me that Scotland is more of a " socialist country " which is fine - I have no problem with that but in the future ( in the even t of a yes vote ) who is going to pay for everything ? England is more of a " Tory country " - low tax etc so that being the case - If you were going to start a business - where would you go - Scotland or just over the border in England where you would pay lower tax..... If you were a pensioner / on medication etc then you would be better of in Scotland - so it would seem to me that if you are a " net taker " from the tax system, you are better of in Scotland where as if you are a " net contributor " you would be better of in England.... That might be a simplistic view but seems logical to me - I can't be ar$ed reading 500 page speculative reports on all the whataboutery from both sides...... But I would say voting NO would be the sensible thing to do....... As for " governing ourselves " that is nonsense IMO - The government ( whoever they are ) will do what Europe tell them and as far as foreign invasions go ( Iraq, Afghanistan or whoever the next exciting misadventure sponsored by Uncle Sam will be ) if America or Nato say jump, Scotland will say " how high " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thepundit Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Can you explain "it's the seperatists shouting the loudest all the time" to me? Isn't it obvious that those who aren't happy with the status quo will make the loudest noise? But the Yes supporters aren't just loud in that respect. Their behaviour towards No supporters, particularly online, especially towards celebrities, has been an absolute disgrace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BerwickMad Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Can you explain "it's the seperatists shouting the loudest all the time" to me?Here for example. Opinion polls suggest that 'No' is in the majority, but look on here and the vast majority seem to be in the 'Yes' camp. As with anything, the people who want change will generally be more passionate than the people who're happy with the way things already are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AUFC90 Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Tax and spend would be an issue for me..... ( a big issue ) seems to me that Scotland is more of a " socialist country " which is fine - I have no problem with that but in the future ( in the even t of a yes vote ) who is going to pay for everything ? England is more of a " Tory country " - low tax etc so that being the case - If you were going to start a business - where would you go - Scotland or just over the border in England where you would pay lower tax..... If you were a pensioner / on medication etc then you would be better of in Scotland - so it would seem to me that if you are a " net taker " from the tax system, you are better of in Scotland where as if you are a " net contributor " you would be better of in England.... That might be a simplistic view but seems logical to me - I can't be ar$ed reading 500 page speculative reports on all the whataboutery from both sides...... But I would say voting NO would be the sensible thing to do....... As for " governing ourselves " that is nonsense IMO - The government ( whoever they are ) will do what Europe tell them and as far as foreign invasions go ( Iraq, Afghanistan or whoever the next exciting misadventure sponsored by Uncle Sam will be ) if America or Nato say jump, Scotland will say " how high " Canadas corporation tax is much lower than than USA's rate. Do you see the Americans worrying about it ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Isn't it obvious that those who aren't happy with the status quo will make the loudest noise? But the Yes supporters aren't just loud in that respect. Their behaviour towards No supporters, particularly online, especially towards celebrities, has been an absolute disgrace. http://wingsoverscotland.com/tag/smears/ You should probably read this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bairn Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 2. Every other country is independent. 193 of em. Why not us? Might seem daft but think about it. Hang on a minute..... What about Wales, the Faroe Islands and American Samoa? Can you provide me some solid evidence that "Every other country is Independent", please be very specific. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confidemus Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Hang on a minute..... What about Wales, the Faroe Islands and American Samoa? Can you provide me some solid evidence that "Every other country is Independent", please be very specific. Yeah, sorry, Scotland should remain chained to their master along with the Faroes and American Samoa. My humblest apologies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BerwickMad Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 "Chained to their masters". What a load of shite! You as an individual have as much say as me. A Scottish person is no more a slave than an Englishman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confidemus Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 "Chained to their masters". What a load of shite! You as an individual have as much say as me. A Scottish person is no more a slave than an Englishman. It was tongue in cheek, touchy. Sheesh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thumper Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 The irony is that for all the bleating many Scots do about the Conservatives, under independence they will eventually turn to the Scottish centre right parties to dig them out of the economic hole that the left will put them in. It will just take them a little longer than the rest of the UK currently take to realise what's needed. Serious question: did you live in the same Eighties that the rest of Scotland did? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confidemus Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Serious question: did you live in the same Eighties that the rest of Scotland did? He was probably a toddler at the time. Guarantee it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaven Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Serious question: did you live in the same Eighties that the rest of Scotland did?He could be thinking about the two terms under labour at Holyrood. ( parliment building and Edinburgh trams)SNP however know how to balance the books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I'm Brian Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 I have to say guys, I'm leaning strongly towards yes, however unlike some people (on both sides of the debate) I am willing to listen to what both sides have to say. It wasn't supposed to be a dig at the no camp. What I would really like is to meet a no campaigner on the street to hear what they have to say and how they are convincing people to vote no. I haven't seen much here so far, although I feel that may have been because people thought I was trying to challenge them. Let's try again, why would you advise someone to vote no? Good luck in that. They are a rare breed, They tend to shy away from public events as well. This is a prime example from last week Thanks to the good people of St Andrews Church, Ayr, who invited us along last night to speak in favour of a Yes vote at their referendum debate. The Church had primarily organised this for its youth groups being concerned that these first ...time voters weren't getting access to both sides of the argument in what is a big decision. Plenty of first time voters evident together with a good cross section of other voters in attendance.I was looking forward to debating with John Scott MSP but John failed to turn up leaving me with the floor to myself! After explaining why I was both voting and campaigning for Yes! I spent about an hour taking questions and answers. The discussion then spilled over into coffee and biscuits. Judging by the questions the audience were predominately No and Don't Knows. There were two or three Yes badges in the pews and if you're reading this folks thanks for chipping in during the discussion! Hopefully a few folk went home with something to think about. So yet another no-show by the BT Campaign but hats off to St. Andrews for organising the event. If you or a group you are a member of are trying to organise a similar debate please contact us. We will be only too happy to provide speakers and/or campaign materials. Isn't it obvious that those who aren't happy with the status quo will make the loudest noise? But the Yes supporters aren't just loud in that respect. Their behaviour towards No supporters, particularly online, especially towards celebrities, has been an absolute disgrace. Whilst I agree to a small degree wrt to your point about the celebrities, the No supporters are pretty bad when it comes to this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Rider Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Aye. The SNP are desperate to turn it into Scotland v the Tories. Hence the Tory takeover shit and the desperation to get Cameron into a TV debate with Salmond. Cameron is the Prime Minister of the UK. The man who would fight with every fibre of his being for the Union. He's the guy in charge of the UK. It's only right that he makes his case for the Union in a debate with Salmond, our First Minister. Who do you think should lead the charge for the Union? A backbench Labour MP who increased the UK's debt under his charge? If Miliband was PM (shudder) I expect him to do the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thepundit Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Salmond doesn't debate people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AUFC90 Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Salmond doesn't debate irrelevant fannys that his deputy would beat Fixed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doulikefish Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Is this a weekly thing now,old broony kicking off the no campaign?Banterman you must know,your a monkey in a red rosette voter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I'm Brian Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 How many times does it have to be said? Alex Salmond is on record as saying that he will debate anyone once he has debated David Cameron first. Cameron's stance may have been defendable had he not had a string of speeches on the issue. However now he is an active part of the wider debate he in my opinion must do the honourable thing and debate Salmond. Had he and his minions kept their collective nose out like he said they would, then he would have had one over Salmond. I still have a certain amount of sympathy with him, in that he is damned if he does, damned if he doesn't. I always believed he would end up debating and I still stand by it. I think the pressure will be too great for it not to happen. Let's face it, everyone with an interest in this debate wants to see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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