Baxter Parp Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 As seen on the Better Orange Together march over the weekend... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet Pete Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 CROCODILE TEARS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 I'm another one who doesn't like the broad sweeping statements about what people in Norn Iron are like, needless to say there are plenty of good people there. What isn't up for debate IMO is that anyone in 2014 who labels themself a "loyalist" is never far from having a raging superiority complex, and never a million miles from being a bigot/racist. A more rancid, hateful "IDENTATEE" you won't find, and the only reasonable response for Northern Irish prods is to do what my dad and aunts/uncles did and reject it. I also can't be doing with the way many people on the other side act whiter than white yet brush off murder and violence as something that can't be avoided, but let's not pretend each "COMMUNITAH" is equally bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 What isn't up for debate IMO is that anyone in 2014 who labels themself a "loyalist" is never far from having a raging superiority complex, and never a million miles from being a bigot/racist. A more rancid, hateful "IDENTATEE" you won't find, and the only reasonable response for Northern Irish prods is to do what my dad and aunts/uncles did and reject it. Mainstream Unionist politicians aren't exactly queuing up to assume a leadership role during things like the fleg protests. When this guy leaps to prominence it should tell you something: I also can't be doing with the way many people on the other side act whiter than white yet brush off murder and violence as something that can't be avoided, but let's not pretend each "COMMUNITAH" is equally bad. In the final analysis people are people and if you take that as the starting point it's not unreasonable to come to the conclusion that a certain percentage of any grouping within the wider population are going to be intellectually subnormal and prone to extremism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 Mainstream Unionist politicians aren't exactly queuing up to assume a leadership role during things like the fleg protests. When this guy leaps to prominence it should tell you something: In the final analysis people are people and if you take that as the starting point it's not unreasonable to come to the conclusion that a certain percentage of any grouping within the wider population are going to be intellectually subnormal and prone to extremism. IMO saying there'll be good and bad folk within every group depends on how you label the group itself. Are there good and bad people in NI from both Protestant and Catholic, pro-British and pro-Irish backgrounds? Of course there are, that's a no brainer. However, when people call themselves loyalists they're always on the way to cunthood in my book. What is it about "loyalism" that gives anyone a sense of pride? The whole thing is based round the idea that "this is our wee country, not yours", it's supremacist shite. The worst bit of deflection in this thread was when someone (rightly) lamented the 12th of July celebrations, and someone deflected it on to Scotland by saying they can't wait for Bannockburn day. The only Scots you'll find who's sense of pride and identity comes from the "yaaas, we pyure won a battle against our enemies hundereds of years ago and thousands of them died" are the fictional ones created in the Build A Jock Workshop at Better Togethers smear HQ. Not only is this very real with loyalists, it's the focal point of their whole culture. An absolute humiliation for any NI Protestant with even a remotely progressive mindset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 I point you again towards the first part of my post where I pointed out that mainstream Unionist politicians are not queuing up to assume a leadership role in things like the fleg protests. Ulster Unionism did very well out of the Good Friday Agreement, because Republicans made concessions they probably would never have if they had realized that the demographic shift was going to be as negligible as it turned out to be in the 2001 and 2011 census returns. The problem is convincing the plebs that their side are actually winning at the moment in terms of UI being a complete non-starter and that walking past the Ardoyne shopfronts on the 12th and not having a coloured piece of cloth fluttering outside the city hall 24/7 are really not that critical in the big scheme of things. The DUP needs the votes of people, who still don't get that bigger picture, so it will rumble on rather than being confronted the way it ideally should be, but over time it will hopefully fade away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AberdeenBud Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/alliances-anna-lo-disgusted-by-loyalist-bonfire-posters-30410894.html Anna Lo pictures on a bonfire. Classy as ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing (2) Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/alliances-anna-lo-disgusted-by-loyalist-bonfire-posters-30410894.html Anna Lo pictures on a bonfire. #Enrico plays with it# Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fccologne-celticfc Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 Polish is the new oirish.. Poor people. Reading regularly on belfast telegraph about racist attacks in east and north belfast. Unionists are on the edge of losing everything, even the last wee bit of sympathy within their own people. They feel they are losing on every side. Bunch of inbred dossers the lot of them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fccologne-celticfc Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 Its oir cultchur tae burn flags and bonfires and always repeat the same old 5 tunes played by the worst marching Bands on the planet, getting pissed and wear rangers tops with 150 kg and being 40 years old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 Its oir cultchur tae burn flags and bonfires and always repeat the same old 5 tunes played by the worst marching Bands on the planet, getting pissed and wear rangers tops with 150 kg and being 40 years old. That German accent is brilliant. Well done sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Orton Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 Its oir cultchur tae burn flags and bonfires and always repeat the same old 5 tunes played by the worst marching Bands on the planet, getting pissed and wear rangers tops with 150 kg and being 40 years old. Interesting to see you on this thread when you claim to be a German football fan who is only on pie and bovril to discuss sport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audaces Fortuna Juvat Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 Polish is the new oirish.. Poor people. Reading regularly on belfast telegraph about racist attacks in east and north belfast. Unionists are on the edge of losing everything, even the last wee bit of sympathy within their own people. They feel they are losing on every side. Bunch of inbred dossers the lot of them A nice moderate point of view although, coming from you, I should feel complimented. IMO saying there'll be good and bad folk within every group depends on how you label the group itself. Are there good and bad people in NI from both Protestant and Catholic, pro-British and pro-Irish backgrounds? Of course there are, that's a no brainer. However, when people call themselves loyalists they're always on the way to cunthood in my book. What is it about "loyalism" that gives anyone a sense of pride? The whole thing is based round the idea that "this is our wee country, not yours", it's supremacist shite. The worst bit of deflection in this thread was when someone (rightly) lamented the 12th of July celebrations, and someone deflected it on to Scotland by saying they can't wait for Bannockburn day. The only Scots you'll find who's sense of pride and identity comes from the "yaaas, we pyure won a battle against our enemies hundereds of years ago and thousands of them died" are the fictional ones created in the Build A Jock Workshop at Better Togethers smear HQ. Not only is this very real with loyalists, it's the focal point of their whole culture. An absolute humiliation for any NI Protestant with even a remotely progressive mindset. As said in an earlier post, I often struggle with what exactly my identity is as I am no longer Protestant, although I am from that community and my mother tried to inculcate some sort of religion within me. I am unionist, with a small "u", as I wish Northern Ireland to remain part of the UK, and I am from a Loyalist background, so I guess I'm a little bit of all three. Why do you perceive all loyalists as being on the way to cunthood? It's not a single homogenised group, more a disparate bunch of views and opinions and yes, some are very repellent, but that does not make us all as such. I don't do the pride you refer to as I find anyone who is overly proud of their country/background to be slightly inadequate, after all, it's only a piece of land and a flag is only a piece of cloth, nor do I have any truck with supremacist shite as that is truly retarded. I'm certainly not pointing the finger at you, as you seem reasoned, but there are a few posters on here who continually attack one side of the two communities in our sad little country. I would disagree with you on one point though, they are as bad as each other. However, the republican community have much better leadership, whereas the loyalist unionist community are largely represented by buffoons who do not know the true value of good PR, and lurch from one disaster to another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 A nice moderate point of view although, coming from you, I should feel complimented. As said in an earlier post, I often struggle with what exactly my identity is as I am no longer Protestant, although I am from that community and my mother tried to inculcate some sort of religion within me. I am unionist, with a small "u", as I wish Northern Ireland to remain part of the UK, and I am from a Loyalist background, so I guess I'm a little bit of all three. Why do you perceive all loyalists as being on the way to cunthood? It's not a single homogenised group, more a disparate bunch of views and opinions and yes, some are very repellent, but that does not make us all as such. I don't do the pride you refer to as I find anyone who is overly proud of their country/background to be slightly inadequate, after all, it's only a piece of land and a flag is only a piece of cloth, nor do I have any truck with supremacist shite as that is truly retarded. I'm certainly not pointing the finger at you, as you seem reasoned, but there are a few posters on here who continually attack one side of the two communities in our sad little country. I would disagree with you on one point though, they are as bad as each other. However, the republican community have much better leadership, whereas the loyalist unionist community are largely represented by buffoons who do not know the true value of good PR, and lurch from one disaster to another. I'd just call it a cultural protestant if it needs a label. What exactly are you loyal to if you're a bit of a loyalist? I wouldn't call wanting NI to be in Britain being a loyalist as such. If you ask my dad what he thinks he doesn't call himself Irish but he sure doesn't call himself a loyalist either. I hear what you're saying about people being too proud of their history not making sense, but when it's a history like the "loyalists" have. that's especially true. Again, I'm not saying anyone from a unionist background is a p***k, I'm saying that people who believe in the protestant supremacy that (to me) loyalism in NI is based around are. One side of my family is Catholic and the other Protestant, but both my parents are atheists as am I. I'd say I'm in a fair position to make an assessment on who's worse, and although my opinion isn't more important than anyone elses and I don't get the deciding vote on the matter, I disagree that both sides are the same. Looking at the history rationally, you can see why republicans aren't happy. What's annoying is how they bang on like they're prisoners when it's not that big a deal in the grand scheme of things, but when it comes down to it their hatred is down to politics. The unionists have it their way, and yet they're the most raging of the lot. When a side has it (almost) all their own way and they still go round hatefully trying to make life shit for the other side, you know it's pure bigotry. I like to think I'm completely impartial, but maybe the fact that even my own proddie dad thinks there's nobody worse than an angry orangeman has clouded my judgement. I'm not sure, I think I've looked at it rationally and agreed with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kincardine Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 What isn't up for debate IMO is that anyone in 2014 who labels themself a "loyalist" is never far from having a raging superiority complex, and never a million miles from being a bigot/racist. Erin, this is simply supercilious bollocks. I am perfectly happy to say I am a loyalist and have no issue with anyone regarding race or religion. I do, though, think that folk who choose not to use the the apostrophe should be consigned to a very hot fire. Edited to add: f**k off with any 'team Rangers' shite that anyone may make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 ^^^ Team: Not Rangers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kincardine Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 ^^^ Team: Not Rangers. have a charles ya chunt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audaces Fortuna Juvat Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 One side of my family is Catholic and the other Protestant, but both my parents are atheists as am I. I'd say I'm in a fair position to make an assessment on who's worse, and although my opinion isn't more important than anyone elses and I don't get the deciding vote on the matter, I disagree that both sides are the same. Looking at the history rationally, you can see why republicans aren't happy. What's annoying is how they bang on like they're prisoners when it's not that big a deal in the grand scheme of things, but when it comes down to it their hatred is down to politics. The unionists have it their way, and yet they're the most raging of the lot. When a side has it (almost) all their own way and they still go round hatefully trying to make life shit for the other side, you know it's pure bigotry. I like to think I'm completely impartial, but maybe the fact that even my own proddie dad thinks there's nobody worse than an angry orangeman has clouded my judgement. I'm not sure, I think I've looked at it rationally and agreed with him. I'm an atheist myself, and I respect your opinion, but having grown up there and lived there for thirty years, I've had a lot more than my parents to influence my views, although I was well warned never to join the OO. I also spent a long time working in the A&E department of a Belfast hospital, witnessing first hand what the scumbags on both sides can do to each other, and the savagery is quite frightening, and equally so. As you say, historically, republicans did have it worse, but they now have practically everything they want, as do the unionists. It is bigotry on both sides driving it on, especially among the uneducated and out of work, although that is not to say that everyone in these categories are bigots. Republicans are just as capable of bigotry and violence though, just look at the veiled threats of mass protest from the Ardoyne Residents Committee, protest being a strange euphemism for days of rioting. Witness also the links I posted about intimidation of protestants to Mr "Nananana not listening", but this also happens the other way round. Sadly, it is ongoing in both communities. I wouldn't say I'm impartial as I still retain a little bias, but I like to think I can look at things impartially. Time to "march" off to bed now, I have an 06:30 start tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parsforlife Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 Can someone explain the difference between loyalism and unionism? My understanding is the viewpoint is the same, wanting uk to remain as it is, but those that would describe themselves as unionist seem more rational and reasonable and those that would call themselves loyalists far more prone to being absolute fuckwits. I understand why a unionist would want to avoid identifying themselves as loyalist given the negative conetatations but would someone like the_kincardine say why they are happy to call themselves a loyalist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 I'd just call it a cultural protestant if it needs a label. What exactly are you loyal to if you're a bit of a loyalist? I wouldn't call wanting NI to be in Britain being a loyalist as such. If you ask my dad what he thinks he doesn't call himself Irish but he sure doesn't call himself a loyalist either. I hear what you're saying about people being too proud of their history not making sense, but when it's a history like the "loyalists" have. that's especially true. Again, I'm not saying anyone from a unionist background is a p***k, I'm saying that people who believe in the protestant supremacy that (to me) loyalism in NI is based around are. One side of my family is Catholic and the other Protestant, but both my parents are atheists as am I. I'd say I'm in a fair position to make an assessment on who's worse, and although my opinion isn't more important than anyone elses and I don't get the deciding vote on the matter, I disagree that both sides are the same. Looking at the history rationally, you can see why republicans aren't happy. What's annoying is how they bang on like they're prisoners when it's not that big a deal in the grand scheme of things, but when it comes down to it their hatred is down to politics. The unionists have it their way, and yet they're the most raging of the lot. When a side has it (almost) all their own way and they still go round hatefully trying to make life shit for the other side, you know it's pure bigotry. I like to think I'm completely impartial, but maybe the fact that even my own proddie dad thinks there's nobody worse than an angry orangeman has clouded my judgement. I'm not sure, I think I've looked at it rationally and agreed with him. An excellent post sir - well played. You've come to pretty much the same conclusion as I have (and I have no links with the place or either of the religions at all). I feel pretty bad that I've just described you as a 'reem boy' on another thread. Turns out you are fairly intelligent - for a reem boy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.