The Arbroath Thread

[Tattie36]

3 minutes ago, ScottishLoon said:

Welcome to the Angus football mire  where winning your first game in two months 2-0 just makes you more annoyed for delaying the sacking of your manager

You want Campbell back?…… please.

[lichtiekev]

Heard from a few folk Campbell got into it with a fan at the end,

Pretty embarrassing 

[ScottishLoon]

2 minutes ago, Tattie36 said:

You want Campbell back?…… please.

Absolutely, at least he has unrivaled success for a few years before it goes turgid.

We hit turgid after just 3 months of McKinnon and has stayed like that since February.

Edited November 18, 2023 by ScottishLoon

[Godlovessmokedhaddock]

I believe that all those who defended the Campbells suggested that we needed to give them until now before considering if they should go.

The squad quality is better than last year. The idea of having scouts, Sellars and co, is a groundbreaking policy and has secured improvement. I imagine it might catch on with other teams. The quality improvement is shallow, and the size of the squad, particularly defensively has left us exposed too often. Good management builds in capacity for parts of the system, ie players, to be faulty, (injured).

The quality of football continues to decline. The position of strength of the freak season has been squandered. That Ian Campbell admits that they took their eye off the recruitment ball at that time is noble. However, it is a director's job to ensure that all parts of a business are running effectively and in this respect are culpable. The board have made huge strides with the club and on the whole invested very well. But they have left too many football policy decisions solely to the management team. The majority of the team that season was on the wrong side of thirty. The quality of Nouble and Jack Hamilton took defensive pressure off the rest of the team. The players knew that was their moment in time and that the era that took them from Division 2 had ended.

Despite having the talent to pass the ball, we launch it. The midfield talents recruited to potentially build a team around have gone on loan as they had RSI from following the ball launched over his head. Young players, other than Steele should avoid Gayfield in terms of their development. The Aberdeen FC comment was telling and evidenced by our lack of loan signings. Bluffed away by our manager, who changes his "long-held" views whenever the situation doesn't look favourable to him. 

Loyalty is admirable, but a blind belief that some of these players are "the best in the league" is folly and we are suffering.

Crowds are noticeably down, the kids are not coming any more, hospitality appears not to sell out and on the current form why would anyone buy a half-season ticket? The poor football is no entertainment and many of the recent season ticket purchasers may think differently next summer.

Change now gives a new manager, the scouts and the directors a month to look at recruitment and gives a chance for improvement. Otherwise, I fear we will struggle in a playoff and potentially be stuck in League 1 for a spell, losing our best part-time team status.

The Campbells have changed the club, but it's time to go.

 

Edited November 18, 2023 by Godlovessmokedhaddock

[Tattie36]

3 minutes ago, Godlovessmokedhaddock said:

I believe that all those who defended the Campbells suggested that we needed to give them until now before considering if they should go.

The squad quality is better than last year. The idea of having scouts, Sellars and co, is a groundbreaking policy and has secured improvement. I imagine it might catch on with other teams. The quality improvement is shallow, and the size of the squad, particularly defensively has left us exposed too often. Good management builds in capacity for parts of the system, ie players, to be faulty, (injured).

The quality of football continues to decline. The position of strength of the freak season has been squandered. That Ian Campbell admits that they took their eye off the recruitment ball at that time is noble. However, it is a director's job to ensure that all parts of a business are running effectively and in this respect are culpable. The board have made huge strides with the club and on the whole invested very well. But they have left too many football policy decisions solely to the management team. The majority of the team that season was on the wrong side of thirty. The quality of Nouble and Jack Hamilton took defensive pressure off the rest of the team. The players knew that was their moment in time and that the era that took them from Division 2 had ended.

Despite having the talent to pass the ball, we launch it. The midfield talents recruited to potentially build a team around have gone on loan as they had RSI from following the ball launched over his head. Young players, other than Steele should avoid Gayfield in terms of their development. The Aberdeen FC comment was telling and evidenced by our lack of loan signings. Bluffed away by our manager, who changes his "long-held" views whenever the situation doesn't look favourable to him. 

Loyalty is admirable, but a blind belief that some of these players are "the best in the league" is folly and we are suffering.

Crowds are noticeably down, the kids are not coming any more, hospitality appears not to sell out and on the current form why would anyone buy a half-season ticket? The poor football is no entertainment and many of the recent season ticket purchasers may think differently next summer.

Change now gives a new manager, the scouts and the directors a month to look at recruitment and gives a chance for improvement. Otherwise, I fear we will struggle in a playoff and potentially be stuck in League 1 for a spell, losing our best part-time team status.

The Campbells have changed the club, but it's time to go.

 

Agree with all of this. A+ for your first ever post.

[ExiledLichtie]

Sadly, I have to agree with all of the above.   

[Blablabla]

Thank f**k I haven't bought my ticket for The Spartans match yet, not wasting any more money travelling to watch that shite

[Buddie Holly]

4 hours ago, DD11 said:

Are New Saints a team?

fify 

[SmokeyJoe]

I personally feel this will be the Campbells last season with us if they even make it to the summer. But If Arbroath were to move on from the Campbells who’s actually available or would be a decent appointment of the top my head Stewart Petrie obvious candidate, Darren young? Kevin Thomson? Other than that slim pickings. 

[DUAFC]

2 hours ago, Godlovessmokedhaddock said:

I believe that all those who defended the Campbells suggested that we needed to give them until now before considering if they should go.

The squad quality is better than last year. The idea of having scouts, Sellars and co, is a groundbreaking policy and has secured improvement. I imagine it might catch on with other teams. The quality improvement is shallow, and the size of the squad, particularly defensively has left us exposed too often. Good management builds in capacity for parts of the system, ie players, to be faulty, (injured).

The quality of football continues to decline. The position of strength of the freak season has been squandered. That Ian Campbell admits that they took their eye off the recruitment ball at that time is noble. However, it is a director's job to ensure that all parts of a business are running effectively and in this respect are culpable. The board have made huge strides with the club and on the whole invested very well. But they have left too many football policy decisions solely to the management team. The majority of the team that season was on the wrong side of thirty. The quality of Nouble and Jack Hamilton took defensive pressure off the rest of the team. The players knew that was their moment in time and that the era that took them from Division 2 had ended.

Despite having the talent to pass the ball, we launch it. The midfield talents recruited to potentially build a team around have gone on loan as they had RSI from following the ball launched over his head. Young players, other than Steele should avoid Gayfield in terms of their development. The Aberdeen FC comment was telling and evidenced by our lack of loan signings. Bluffed away by our manager, who changes his "long-held" views whenever the situation doesn't look favourable to him. 

Loyalty is admirable, but a blind belief that some of these players are "the best in the league" is folly and we are suffering.

Crowds are noticeably down, the kids are not coming any more, hospitality appears not to sell out and on the current form why would anyone buy a half-season ticket? The poor football is no entertainment and many of the recent season ticket purchasers may think differently next summer.

Change now gives a new manager, the scouts and the directors a month to look at recruitment and gives a chance for improvement. Otherwise, I fear we will struggle in a playoff and potentially be stuck in League 1 for a spell, losing our best part-time team status.

The Campbells have changed the club, but it's time to go.

 

You've totally nailed it with this. 

Considered and insightful, I suspect you’ve got more than a fair bit of inside knowledge of the workings of the club. 

[Blablabla]

52 minutes ago, DUAFC said:

You've totally nailed it with this. 

Considered and insightful, I suspect you’ve got more than a fair bit of inside knowledge of the workings of the club. 

That's what I was thinking

[DD11]

3 hours ago, Godlovessmokedhaddock said:

I believe that all those who defended the Campbells suggested that we needed to give them until now before considering if they should go.

The squad quality is better than last year. The idea of having scouts, Sellars and co, is a groundbreaking policy and has secured improvement. I imagine it might catch on with other teams. The quality improvement is shallow, and the size of the squad, particularly defensively has left us exposed too often. Good management builds in capacity for parts of the system, ie players, to be faulty, (injured).

The quality of football continues to decline. The position of strength of the freak season has been squandered. That Ian Campbell admits that they took their eye off the recruitment ball at that time is noble. However, it is a director's job to ensure that all parts of a business are running effectively and in this respect are culpable. The board have made huge strides with the club and on the whole invested very well. But they have left too many football policy decisions solely to the management team. The majority of the team that season was on the wrong side of thirty. The quality of Nouble and Jack Hamilton took defensive pressure off the rest of the team. The players knew that was their moment in time and that the era that took them from Division 2 had ended.

Despite having the talent to pass the ball, we launch it. The midfield talents recruited to potentially build a team around have gone on loan as they had RSI from following the ball launched over his head. Young players, other than Steele should avoid Gayfield in terms of their development. The Aberdeen FC comment was telling and evidenced by our lack of loan signings. Bluffed away by our manager, who changes his "long-held" views whenever the situation doesn't look favourable to him. 

Loyalty is admirable, but a blind belief that some of these players are "the best in the league" is folly and we are suffering.

Crowds are noticeably down, the kids are not coming any more, hospitality appears not to sell out and on the current form why would anyone buy a half-season ticket? The poor football is no entertainment and many of the recent season ticket purchasers may think differently next summer.

Change now gives a new manager, the scouts and the directors a month to look at recruitment and gives a chance for improvement. Otherwise, I fear we will struggle in a playoff and potentially be stuck in League 1 for a spell, losing our best part-time team status.

The Campbells have changed the club, but it's time to go.

 

100% this. Great post.

[vikingTON]

3 hours ago, Godlovessmokedhaddock said:

The squad quality is better than last year. The idea of having scouts, Sellars and co, is a groundbreaking policy and has secured improvement. I imagine it might catch on with other teams. The quality improvement is shallow, and the size of the squad, particularly defensively has left us exposed too often. Good management builds in capacity for parts of the system, ie players, to be faulty, (injured).

If the squad quality is better than last season then why are you surprised that squad depth is weak? That's the direct trade-off that any professional manager and football club has to account for. You cannot have the best of both unless you also have the largest budget in your division. 

We are seeing the same circumstances that you describe playing out to a more extreme degree at the moment, but it doesn't make Dougie Imrie or indeed Dick 'dick' Campbell total clowns who don't actually know how to manage a football team. Regression to the mean - both in terms of performance levels to budget as well as risky signings paying off - are much more powerful forces that explain the results in both cases IMO. 

 

[Leicesterlichtie]

After such a bright start with the early goal (which was a piece of quality), it soon transgressed into a very poor performance.

It looked to me like a back 3 in the first half without wing backs fulfilling their defensive duties and ended up getting pulled from pillar to post. We lacked bite in midfield and allowed the taffs too much time and space. As has been said before by quite a few, we are missing a big hard b*****d in the centre of the park.

Also a lack of creativity in the attacking third without Hylton playing.

Fair play to all the Lichtie fans who, for a change, had to travel further than me for a game. A great turnout.

[keptie]

For a cup game that a lot people on here couldn't care less about the reaction to the performance of a totally rejigged team is a bit over the top imo. 

[CALDERON]

I'm sure Arbroath have improved from last season, but the overall league has too.  There aren't teams like Cove and Hamilton who were decent shouts for relegation from the off. 

It's a very tight league, and will be for the rest of the season, but I'm not sure you could look at the squads in this league and pick out anyone who Arbroath should finish ahead of other than perhaps Morton.

[lichtiekev]

The biggest frustration for me is the level of performance, 

You aren't gonna suddenly get Campbell to play free flowing attacking football, But what we have to watch is really bad at times and the constant changing formation and positions, Scott Stewart played in about 3 positions alone yesterday, also the absolute glaring lack of reinforcements and cover for an already short and ageing defence for years now is starting to really show.

I thought we had got past this and got back to what we are good at but the last 5 or so games has been a mess again,  you can blame loosing ToB to Injury all you want but a squad should of been built to deal with Injuries and suspensions, 

It's also really disappointing to get absolute no feedback from the club regarding Injuries and that, seem to get more Information on here, the club have done a great job in the last few years to get where they are but they wouldn't be in this position without the supporters and we certainly deserve better

Edited November 19, 2023 by lichtiekev

[SimonLichtie]

I totally get how people are moving towards a 'Dick out' situation with the last few weeks being poor and the good run of form we previously had completely evaporating. I don't completely disagree, especially with comments regarding things turning a bit stale and with last season being an extremely turgid one which people are very worried we're going to get another full campaign of. As someone who has felt game management and tactical outlook has been one of Dick's biggest weaknesses throughout his time at the club, I also understand why people are beginning to get very frustrated with this side of things.

However - I am absolutely amazed that a loss to a team we were 7/1 to beat, with a team stacked with injuries to some of our best players, is the straw that broke the camels back for some. I can only assume yesterday is a tipping point for some people who were basically on the edge anyway as opposed to it swinging anyones mind. If we had just lost 4-1 to Spartans (I really hope I'm not tempting fate here) then I could fully understand the reaction as that's a game we're favourites to win and Spartans are two levels below us. However, as it is we lost a game we were big underdogs in...... it doesn't really phase me that much to be honest. I'm much more concerned about performances against teams around us like Morton and Ayr who we need to be looking to finish ahead of in order to stay up.

The reality is we're never, ever going to consistently pick up results at this level, because apart from a once in a generation season which we've already had, we're not going to be challenging anywhere near the top. This means that we're going to lose more games than we win every season, and we will eventually get relegated. It's also ludicrous for us to be going into games against full time teams as massive outsiders and be furious at not getting results. It's not an Arbroath thing, it's a reality thing and would be/ has been/ will be the same for any other part time team at this level. Why should we be any different?

We definitely have a much better squad than last season in my opinion (when injury free) but the division is a lot stronger than last year as well. It's going to be a real struggle to stay up whoever is in charge. We're currently 4 points off the bottom of the table with a game in hand - if prior to the start of the season I was offered that position a third of the way into the campaign I'd have taken it, it would be very naive not to.

People refer to 'turning the corner' etc after a few wins, and how we're back to square one after a couple of defeats, and in my opinion this is just a hugely short term view on things. If we 'turned the corner' and were on form for the majority of the season we'd be up the top end, which is just completely unrealistic. Form and confidence are massive and if we put three good runs of form together over the campaign we stay up.

The Ayr Utd and Morton games at the start of December are very important in my opinion - if we were to lose both of them (and the Dunfermline away game) then my opinion would probably move towards a change in management.

[1320Lichtie]

I don’t have any high expectations and understand what’s been said in regards to every team being decent this season etc and we’ve no right to stay in league etc etc etc 

 

However it’s just the nature of defeats and the vibe around the team that is pissing me off 

 

I feel like we have good players, definitely good enough to stay in the division anyway.
 

In my opinion if things are going well, playing for Dick would probably be quite fun and enjoyable, but see as soon as things got hard I could imagine it being a fucking nightmare and bad vibes everywhere. A stubborn older guy who does not like criticism and is easy to fall out with - that is a recipe for disaster

 

Nouble himself said that Dick is no tactics just vibes and it’s easy to see that isn’t it. 
 

When we’re on a good run we make football look simple, when things aren’t going well we look a total shambles 

 

All the things that made DC have that wee bit of magic that made players want to play for him also surely long gone after the last 18 months. The personality and the jokes and the banter etc etc, that was what set him apart. It surely is no longer there it can’t be when we’ve producing what we have on the park.
 

Also some of the decisions he’s made in regards to the squad are mind boggling. The Balde situation probably sums it up in a microcosm, guy wanting to play, falls out with him and sends him out on loan purely because Balde probably had the audacity to make that clear. Leaving us with a tiny squad after a couple of injuries. That can’t be happening. That is quite simply poor man management. 

 

I am definitely edging towards a change in management. I am about 70 percent of the way there. I cannot be arsed with the negativity again. You can only use so much goodwill up before people just get sick fed up. 

Edited November 19, 2023 by 1320Lichtie

[JoseMarooniho]

18 hours ago, SmokeyJoe said:

Hope some fans didn’t put too much money on Arbroath today  

Froze it on sky bet as soon as the opener went in. The highlight of the day by a long way. 

Following Arbroath is more than ever an endurance sport. Most of the play and much of the player body language was awful yesterday. Spartans, Dunfermline and Ayr are big for DC.