The Arbroath Thread

[Housecaptain]

56 minutes ago, lichtiekev said:

I think Slaters name will be one of the first names on the managers team sheet,

It's been clear as day for a long time we have been in massive need of improvement in the middle of the park and it's never happened,

He will get the first 1/4 but he needs to stick to a settled 442 formation like was said, if Gallagher isn't to start then play Murray upfront and get 2 wide players, we looked so much better last week and the last part of today's game when we had 2 upfront, it's hard to believe but the defenders at this level so why make it easy for them,

Massive game next week

I can't believe that Slater would be one of the first names on the team sheet, if that is the case then we are in a worse situation than I thought. 

If he left tomorrow we would be no worse off, League 2 or below is his level. 

[glasgowlichtie23]

McAdams - Few big saves but looked pretty shaky with his kicking a couple of times

Bisland- Pretty meh couple of good recoveries and balls down the line but nothing exceptional to comment on 

Watson - Composed and looked good on the ball, couple of big tackles too

ToB - Solid and unlucky not to get a goal, few shaky moments where he played a poor pass across the back line or nearly got caught in possession but overall good performance

Wilkie - Wasn’t convinced on him today looked shaky and nervous nearly stitched our other defenders up a couple of times, still okay though and a couple of good recoveries especially in the first half

Spalding - Was okay, few loose touches and a few times he held on to the ball a bit too long but was doing a good bit of running in the midfields and broke up play a few times. 

Slater - Anonymous. 

Callaghan - Good deliveries and a few good balls in behind, however not convinced on him defensively got caught napping a few times (in the first 30 seconds when they nearly went through after he lost the ball) 

Murray - Pretty poor first half from him but improved in the second half with a couple of good dribbles beating 1 or 2 men. 

Stewart - Worked like an absolute dog on the right hand side today and got into a few good positions around the box, some really good running too. 

Reilly - Not a lot of service but he should’ve had a goal at least with that header he put over. Some good linkup play especially in the second half when Gallagher and Coulson came on. 

Gallagher - Some good running in the channels and always looked to want the ball, linked up nicely with Reilly and Coulson at times. 

Coulson - Probably our best player today for the time he was on, looked a real live wire on the right hand side and beat his man nicely a good few times. Great free kick for the goal too would like to see him get a start next week. 

Stowe - Won the free kick for the goal, but I really don’t see what he offers to us at this point and wouldn’t be surprised if we see him leave. 

 

[SimonLichtie]

11 hours ago, SimonLichtie said:

Ultimately I agree with this - as I'd expect us to have set number of points required after the first 9 games. In terms of achieving that target, if it becomes impossible then I'd expect that would be that....

I've been having a wee think about this - and ultimately I don't think anyone would disagree that if we aren't at a set target after 9 games a change is required.

The big question is - what should the points total that needs to be achieved be? I think around 14ish points? Personally I'm going to view it very simply - by the end of today I want to have a fair points target for after those 9 games, and then if it's not achieved there's no excuses, there's no 'unlucky' there's no if's or but's, and it becomes very simple.

[1320Lichtie]

Just now, SimonLichtie said:

I've been having a wee think about this - and ultimately I don't think anyone would disagree that if we aren't at a set target after 9 games a change is required.

The big question is - what should the points total that needs to be achieved be? I think around 14ish points? Personally I'm going to view it very simply - by the end of today I want to have a fair points target for after those 9 games, and then if it's not achieved there's no excuses, there's no 'unlucky' there's no if's or but's, and it becomes very simple.

I get that that’s obviously a basic and simple way of measuring how he’s getting on but I think people have a limit and it’s going to really get pushed if we do not beat Montrose at Gayfield next week. 
 

If we do not I don’t think he can come back from it in the eyes of supporters. He’d have to be near enough perfect and win multiple games in a row afterwards and I can’t see that happening. Win or bust for him next week rightly or wrongly, obviously won’t get sacked next week but the opinion within the support will be cemented next week with a defeat. 
 

If we got a good win however….

 

And I do think that’s possible think there’s so much to like on paper and seen flashes of it on the park, then it could really start a big turn around for him. 
 

I think he needed a good start, yes Annan was not a big game but supporters aren’t reasonable and only care about the results. Result that day and the way that day happened, on opening home game of the season a disaster. Then yesterday on opening league game of season…. Again not much in the game really but we were poor and more importantly we got beat.
 

A really bad start when I think he very much needed a good one. 

[RedLichtie86]

13 minutes ago, SimonLichtie said:

I've been having a wee think about this - and ultimately I don't think anyone would disagree that if we aren't at a set target after 9 games a change is required.

The big question is - what should the points total that needs to be achieved be? I think around 14ish points? Personally I'm going to view it very simply - by the end of today I want to have a fair points target for after those 9 games, and then if it's not achieved there's no excuses, there's no 'unlucky' there's no if's or but's, and it becomes very simple.

14 points is a bit low. I would be looking for at least 17 points out of a possible 27 after 9 games.

[ExiledLichtie]

We have to go by board expectations.  The board have said they expect to be challenging for the league title.  Looking at recent seasons, that's been between 90 and 70 points, with cases of teams coming second with 72 and 70 points.  So lets say 76 points.

That's 19 points per quarter. 

 

Edited to clarify, my expectations are considerably lower, but its the board who set the targets, not me.

Edited August 4 by ExiledLichtie

[SimonLichtie]

4 minutes ago, 1320Lichtie said:

I get that that’s obviously a basic and simple way of measuring how he’s getting on but I think people have a limit and it’s going to really get pushed if we do not beat Montrose at Gayfield next week. 
 

If we do not I don’t think he can come back from it in the eyes of supporters. He’d have to be near enough perfect and win multiple games in a row afterwards and I can’t see that happening. Win or bust for him next week rightly or wrongly, obviously won’t get sacked next week but the opinion within the support will be cemented next week with a defeat. 
 

If we got a good win however….

 

And I do think that’s possible think there’s so much to like on paper and seen flashes of it on the park, then it could really start a big turn around for him. 
 

I think he needed a good start, yes Annan was not a big game but supporters aren’t reasonable and only care about the results. Result that day and the way that day happened, on opening home game of the season a disaster. Then yesterday on opening league game of season…. Again not much in the game really but we were poor and more importantly we got beat.
 

A really bad start when I think he very much needed a good one. 

Don't really disagree with any of this to be honest. At the end of the day, as I've always said on anything AFC related, my own opinion is irrelevant, it's that of the overall support that matters. Currently we have a vocal minority absolutely against the manager, and as you say I think a large amount of the quieter majority are very easily turned over the next few weeks/ next week. We can argue the rights and wrongs of it, but ultimately if the majority of the fans turn that's always a curtains situation....

Average points required to win the division is roughly 68

Average points required to come 4th is roughly 55

Based on that I think 14 is my absolute minimum, though I can understand others have it a point or two higher. I see anything less than top 4 as unacceptable (and if getting top 4 is off the back of a strong second half to the season type thing, it's going to be under a different manager). I'd have our halfway minimum as 30 - if the 14 were scraped we'd be looking at 16 from the next quarter.

As I say, there's no 'ach, 13 points and those injuries, that blatant penalty we didn't get, that bad luck in that other game' etc. It's an absolute minimum, nothing else comes into the equation.

I guess we should all be thankful that this is a conversation we can actually have, unlike Cove Rangers where the Director of Football employs his son in law to do an absolutely horrific job, see them finish 5th out of 10 teams while full time and with a very good budget, and he keeps his job with no threat to it.  

[ExiledLichtie]

68 points would have finished 3rd in two of the last 3 seasons, and 2nd in one.  Also 68 points is 17 per quarter...

[lichtie23]

Lads, we are only 3 points off top

[1320Lichtie]

3 minutes ago, SimonLichtie said:

Don't really disagree with any of this to be honest. At the end of the day, as I've always said on anything AFC related, my own opinion is irrelevant, it's that of the overall support that matters. Currently we have a vocal minority absolutely against the manager, and as you say I think a large amount of the quieter majority are very easily turned over the next few weeks/ next week. We can argue the rights and wrongs of it, but ultimately if the majority of the fans turn that's always a curtains situation....

Average points required to win the division is roughly 68

Average points required to come 4th is roughly 55

Based on that I think 14 is my absolute minimum, though I can understand others have it a point or two higher. I see anything less than top 4 as unacceptable (and if getting top 4 is off the back of a strong second half to the season type thing, it's going to be under a different manager). I'd have our halfway minimum as 30 - if the 14 were scraped we'd be looking at 16 from the next quarter.

As I say, there's no 'ach, 13 points and those injuries, that blatant penalty we didn't get, that bad luck in that other game' etc. It's an absolute minimum, nothing else comes into the equation.

I guess we should all be thankful that this is a conversation we can actually have, unlike Cove Rangers where the Director of Football employs his son in law to do an absolutely horrific job, see them finish 5th out of 10 teams while full time and with a very good budget, and he keeps his job with no threat to it.  

I am absolutely desperate to see Jim do well and turn it around, I really like most of the business he’s done too, but the man right now just doesn’t seem to be very good at winning football matches for whatever reason.

There’s no excuses with players we have now and the teams we are up against. We are now not the only PT team in a FT division and we will have one of if not biggest budget in league.  

 

I thought yesterday again - first half was non event subs should’ve been made at the start of the second half.. 

Putting Stewart to RB when he was our only positive player going forward up until that point when making sub

Keeping Murray on the park when making sub 

 

3 things that nobody I talked to seemed to understand not just after the event but when they happened

He has to start winning football matches ASAP. 

 

2 minutes ago, lichtie23 said:

Lads, we are only 3 points off top

No many people will have had a cake delivered to them by Hammy on their birthday…

It’s a shame Cove v Annan never just finished a draw so it was basically a non event for everyone but Stenny. 

[timlichtie]

The game really turned on the missed header by Reilly. They went up the pitch and scored straight after. Goals change games. They looked vulnerable in the last 10 after we scored.

With the benefit of hindsight, the subs should have come on at halftime. I agree that Stewart should have stayed at right wing especially as Coulson plays well on the left.

Stenny probably deserved the points but were pretty ordinary. We’re going to have to really raise our game, and soon.

[Gall09]

Just now, 1320Lichtie said:

I am absolutely desperate to see Jim do well and turn it around, I really like most of the business he’s done too, but the man right now just doesn’t seem to be very good at winning football matches for whatever reason.

Cannae stop laughing at this. 

[Leicesterlichtie]

A very disappointing result yesterday. Obviously another poor performance. 

I actually feel that it didn't really matter what the result was yesterday, Jim is a dead man walking. I think a chunk of fans were waiting for a defeat so they can start nailing down the coffin. 

Obviously he's brought in a number of players who should be good enough at this level. What I want to know from the discontented fans are, names of:

1- Who do you replace Jim with if you punt him after Montrose 

2- What players who were available in the summer should we have brought in that would make us certain title contenders. (CDM, CF)

[1320Lichtie]

1 hour ago, Gall09 said:

Cannae stop laughing at this. 

 

He just seems to make it all look and feel so difficult and it is breaking my heart () cause I can see the despair in the man’s eyes and feel like he’s a good lad too but a win record of 10 percent is utterly appalling 

 

 

Edited August 4 by 1320Lichtie

[relichtie]

2 hours ago, Leicesterlichtie said:

A very disappointing result yesterday. Obviously another poor performance. 

I actually feel that it didn't really matter what the result was yesterday, Jim is a dead man walking. I think a chunk of fans were waiting for a defeat so they can start nailing down the coffin. 

Obviously he's brought in a number of players who should be good enough at this level. What I want to know from the discontented fans are, names of:

1- Who do you replace Jim with if you punt him after Montrose 

2- What players who were available in the summer should we have brought in that would make us certain title contenders. (CDM, CF)

Norrey and Lyons did well for us even when played out of position and imo are better than Callaghan. We could have tried harder to keep McIntosh as he fills a striker role as well as being useful wide left where we were very weak yesterday. 

[lichtiekev]

2 hours ago, Leicesterlichtie said:

A very disappointing result yesterday. Obviously another poor performance. 

I actually feel that it didn't really matter what the result was yesterday, Jim is a dead man walking. I think a chunk of fans were waiting for a defeat so they can start nailing down the coffin. 

Obviously he's brought in a number of players who should be good enough at this level. What I want to know from the discontented fans are, names of:

1- Who do you replace Jim with if you punt him after Montrose 

2- What players who were available in the summer should we have brought in that would make us certain title contenders. (CDM, CF)

Ian Murray

Edited August 4 by lichtiekev

[relichtie]

5 minutes ago, relichtie said:

Norrey and Lyons did well for us even when played out of position and imo are better than Callaghan. We could have tried harder to keep McIntosh as he fills a striker role as well as being useful wide left where we were very weak yesterday. 

JMac probably wanted to bring in his own players, but to replace better players with inferior replacements is not good management imo. Gallagher and Reilly look quality, but some of the other recruits don't look as good .

[ExiledLichtie]

That's Ian Murray punted from Raith after one game....can't wait to hear the football experts on here dissect that.

[Lichtie78]

5 minutes ago, ExiledLichtie said:

That's Ian Murray punted from Raith after one game....can't wait to hear the football experts on here dissect that.

Not sure this makes much sense. Pretty much everyone I’ve seen thinks Raith sacking Murray is a terrible decision

[ExiledLichtie]

1 minute ago, Lichtie78 said:

Not sure this makes much sense. Pretty much everyone I’ve seen thinks Raith sacking Murray is a terrible decision

From the outside it seems pretty odd, but if Raith can punt a manager after 1 game....