ICTJohnboy Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 11 minutes ago, DeeTillEhDeh said: It's not stupidity but ignorance that is the problem. So why are large swathes of Northern England more ignorant than others? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
O'Kelly Isley III Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 So why are large swathes of Northern England more ignorant than others?Perhaps because these large swathes are post-industrial areas where the only growth has been in poverty and all its associated social problems. Against that backdrop everything suffers, including educational attainment. A comparison of say Burnley with Beaconsfield would throw up some stark discrepancies. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambomo Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 You've answered your own question - Scotland has the SNP to represent the country's interests, no part of England has similar. And I'd disagree that England is not a two-party nation; it is indeed that with the Lib Dems no more than an occasional pressure relief valve.I think that England is not even a two-party nation. When New Labour was around they weren’t called Red Tories for nothing, it was the lesser of two evils with both parties giving absolutely zero fucks about the interest of anyone outside the South of England. There is no creditable party to vote for if you want away from the capitalist dream. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullerene Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 16 hours ago, O'Kelly Isley III said: 17 hours ago, Boo Khaki said: This is fair enough, but why is there an apparent discrepancy between the north of England, and for arguments sake, Scotland, in terms of seeing through Brexit for what it is? Both areas suffered because of Thatcher, both areas have rejected an exposed and diminished Labour party, so why are Scots overwhelmingly rejecting Brexit while their counterparts in North England are baying for it like a pack of especially masochistic dogs? Scotland has the SNP as an alternative, but England isn't a two party system. There's no law that states that if you can't support Labour any longer, you simply must become a Tory backer and/or back Brexit. I recognise that a lot of those people on QT the other night will never vote Tory, but still, why are they so in favour of a Tory-driven misadventure that will only result in further harming their already poor prospects? You can be thoroughly fed up with Labour, have an ingrained aversion to voting Tory, and STILL see Brexit for the pile of shite it is. I just don't get why these folk are apparently incapable of seeing through it. They have access to the same info as people elsewhere in the UK, so it's not as if there's an excuse for being ill-informed either. I really dislike it when folk imply that all Brexit 'Leave' voters are simply thick, as you're dismissing over half the people who expressed a preference as stupid. That seems totally outlandish to me. I do think that voting 'Leave' when you have no idea what form leaving will take is a colossally stupid act, but it doesn't make the voters themselves stupid people. Sadly, I can only conclude that there's a huge amount of cognitive dissonance going on, and people's ignorance of the reality of the EU and what it actually does, makes the EU a handy scapegoat thanks to latent xenophobia. I take no pleasure at all in saying that, but I honestly can't see any other excuse or reason for the behaviour. You've answered your own question - Scotland has the SNP to represent the country's interests, no part of England has similar. And I'd disagree that England is not a two-party nation; it is indeed that with the Lib Dems no more than an occasional pressure relief valve. All the main parties in Scotland campaigned for Remain. Scotland does not have an identity crisis. Scottish people are Scottish. IMO, by comparison, people in the north of England do have an identity crisis going on. What does British mean if the Scots don't want to be British? What does English mean if you always have to add 'north of'? "I'll tell you what, lad, I'm not bluddy European!" Something like that. Also they all read newspapers that tell them to hate the EU. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scary Bear Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 That Oakshot woman is on again. Why would you go along to this show and just boo people? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ned Nederlander Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 Absolute shit-show tonight already, audience booing, Oakeshott being Oakeshott Switching off 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTJohnboy Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 Mairead McGuinness the only one worth listening to. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesP_81 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 Absolute shit-show tonight already, audience booing, Oakeshott being Oakeshott Switching off ^^^ has not switched off and is watching with a large bowl of popcorn. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbitterandgrumpy Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 Watched it tonight for the first time in ages. Mairead McGuinness seemed to be the voice of reason, 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesP_81 Posted November 1, 2019 Share Posted November 1, 2019 Watched it tonight for the first time in ages. Mairead McGuinness seemed to be the voice of reason,Totally out of place, actually saying both sides have a degree of right and we should meet in the middle! Can't remember the last time I heard anyone say something like that on qt, it's alway total polarity. I've applied for next week's audience and that was one of my questions, why do 2 people with very similar lives have to have such polar views when 95%of their lives and views must be the same? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbitterandgrumpy Posted November 1, 2019 Share Posted November 1, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, JamesP_81 said: 1 hour ago, oldbitterandgrumpy said: Watched it tonight for the first time in ages. Mairead McGuinness seemed to be the voice of reason, Totally out of place, actually saying both sides have a degree of right and we should meet in the middle! Can't remember the last time I heard anyone say something like that on qt, it's alway total polarity. I've applied for next week's audience and that was one of my questions, why do 2 people with very similar lives have to have such polar views when 95%of their lives and views must be the same? Dream on mate. Polarity is the way things are going right now. Mairead was on the panel as an outsider, which meant she could be a bit more open and honest in her opinions, no party line to tow. In the age of Twitter and Facebook there is only right and wrong. Both sides have a degree of right? Erm . . . aye, right. Edited November 1, 2019 by oldbitterandgrumpy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesP_81 Posted November 1, 2019 Share Posted November 1, 2019 Dream on mate. Polarity is the way things are going right now. Mairead was on the panel as an outsider, which meant she could be a bit more open and honest in her opinions, no party line to tow. In the age of Twitter and Facebook there are only right and wrong. Both sides have a degree of right? Erm . . . aye, right. I would say you are being totally bleak and depressive if It wasn't actually true [emoji17] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbitterandgrumpy Posted November 1, 2019 Share Posted November 1, 2019 1 minute ago, JamesP_81 said: I would say you are being totally bleak and depressive if It wasn't actually true Hey, I'm an upbeat kind of guy. But . . . whatever . . . politics stink. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesP_81 Posted November 1, 2019 Share Posted November 1, 2019 Have you ever watched twin peaks?....... Hey, I'm an upbeat kind of guy. But . . . whatever . . . politics stink. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbitterandgrumpy Posted November 1, 2019 Share Posted November 1, 2019 Just now, JamesP_81 said: Have you ever watched twin peaks?....... No, what's the relevance? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesP_81 Posted November 1, 2019 Share Posted November 1, 2019 No, what's the relevance? TP is basically a mirror held up to society that proves people are on a downward spiral of hate and self loathing. We have lost our balance of light and dark. as its the dark that drives our intrigue so tv is skewed towards our darker sides and becomes further and further from where we should be. This I feel is how our politics is going, either back or white, nothing in between. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbitterandgrumpy Posted November 1, 2019 Share Posted November 1, 2019 1 minute ago, JamesP_81 said: 8 minutes ago, oldbitterandgrumpy said: No, what's the relevance? TP is basically a mirror held up to society that proves people are on a downward spiral of hate and self loathing. We have lost our balance of light and dark. as its the dark that drives our intrigue so tv is skewed towards our darker sides and becomes further and further from where we should be. This I feel is how our politics is going, either back or white, nothing in between. Populism. If it knocks on your door, don't open your door. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbitterandgrumpy Posted November 1, 2019 Share Posted November 1, 2019 3 minutes ago, oldbitterandgrumpy said: Populism. If it knocks on your door, don't open your door. Or open your door and tell them to f**k Off 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbitterandgrumpy Posted November 1, 2019 Share Posted November 1, 2019 16 minutes ago, JamesP_81 said: 24 minutes ago, oldbitterandgrumpy said: No, what's the relevance? TP is basically a mirror held up to society that proves people are on a downward spiral of hate and self loathing. We have lost our balance of light and dark. as its the dark that drives our intrigue so tv is skewed towards our darker sides and becomes further and further from where we should be. This I feel is how our politics is going, either back or white, nothing in between. First World problems. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieThomas Posted November 1, 2019 Share Posted November 1, 2019 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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