Dee Man Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 There's a difference between expecting someone to take responsibility and understanding what happened. For example, I'd imagine in your hypothetical there, he'd be charged with a good number of counts of manslaughter, and rightly so. I'd still be saying the same things about his frame of mind though, and would be more than aware of why he'd be ignorant to the consequences. Because to do otherwise just adds to the complete ignorance shown to depression and suicide that the likes of you show. EXACTLY! So he would have to take responsibility and pay the price for his actions, therefore you're agreeing with me that what he did was wrong. I can't see why you're getting so offended by my POV when you've just admitted he would be punished in court for his selfish act. It's one thing to have sympathy for his illness and completely another to sympathise with his actions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Phoenix Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Don't know about trains, platforms and signals but this thread has sure hit the buffers with an almighty thump. Don't worry about it. This thread will hit the buffers before long.Do keep up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjc Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Whilst I have empathy with anyone that attempts to take their own life I would argue that suicide itself is a selfish act when you consider the impact on your loved ones you leave behind. Using an unwitting 3rd party to end your life is an extension of this selfishness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dee Man Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 And your point is? You stated prisons were full of people not of sound mind. I pointed out that criminals not of sound mind are actually incarcerated in hospitals. My point is that depression is not enough of an excuse to deliberately potentially ruin someone else's life. Is Charles Bronson in a mental facility? Is Charles Manson in a mental facility? The list is endless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Phoenix Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 My point is that depression is not enough of an excuse to deliberately potentially ruin someone else's life. You genuinely are stupid, aren't you? The inclusion of the word "deliberately" in the above is all the evidence required. Which bit of "not of sound mind" are you having trouble comprehending. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1320Lichtie Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Whilst I have empathy with anyone that attempts to take their own life I would argue that suicide itself is a selfish act when you consider the impact on your loved ones you leave behind. Using an unwitting 3rd party to end your life is an extension of this selfishness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dee Man Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 You genuinely are stupid, aren't you? The inclusion of the word "deliberately" in the above is all the evidence required. Which bit of "not of sound mind" are you having trouble comprehending. So he didn't deliberately step out in front of the truck? You'd be better sticking to spamming up threads with shite puns, tbh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Phoenix Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 So he didn't deliberately step out in front of the truck? You'd be better sticking to spamming up threads with shite puns, tbh. You're really not very good at this, are you? No one is denying that he deliberately stepped out in front of the lorry. The point in question - in your own words - is whether he deliberately set out to potentially ruin someone else's life. Clearly, that was not the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dee Man Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 You're really not very good at this, are you? No one is denying that he deliberately stepped out in front of the lorry.The point in question - in your own words - is whether he deliberately set out to potentially ruin someone else's life. Clearly, that was not the case. Did he deliberately step out in front of the truck and potentially ruin someone's life? Yes. I don't see how anyone can argue any different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShawfieldAggro Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 The lack of contrition, and the me-me-me sketch in the posted interview, should suffice as all the evidence required of where the welfare of an unwitting 3rd party is concerned and especially after the care and attention he has recieved from similar individuals just doing their job. Countless footballers have spoken about their demons, about the difficulty in adjusting to life after twenty years in a goldfish bowl being a fairly common theme, if only a symptom in itself rather than the cause. Neil Lennon and Stan Collymore are among the highest profile to have went public, and continually have opened up about its effects, in the hope others wont have to suffer. That interview serves enough notice that he'll only do the same when he's back on the fucking telly. What a gent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Phoenix Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Did he deliberately step out in front of the truck and potentially ruin someone's life? Yes. I don't see how anyone can argue any different. Anyone of sane mind can and will argue different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjc Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Anyone of sane mind can and will argue different. Sane mind? Has Clarke Carlisle actually been Sectioned? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Phoenix Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Sane mind? Has Clarke Carlisle actually been Sectioned? Still in one piece, as far as I know, despite his best efforts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Whilst I have empathy with anyone that attempts to take their own life I would argue that suicide itself is a selfish act when you consider the impact on your loved ones you leave behind. Using an unwitting 3rd party to end your life is an extension of this selfishness. It's selfish to expect someone to suffer on and live in utter misery and pain surely? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjc Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 It's selfish to expect someone to suffer on and live in utter misery and pain surely? So you'd recommend suicide rather than treatment for depression? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 So you'd recommend suicide rather than treatment for depression? Yes. No, of course not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Anyway, as someone who has felt suicidal before and has had pretty strong thoughts about doing it to the point of having a rough plan, I have to say Carlise WAS selfish by involving an innocent stranger. I had utterly mental thoughts and was in a right state and was definitely not of sound mind, but I would never have considered doing something that would harm an innocent person such as jumping in front of a vechicle. There is no excuse for that. Obviously I have a lot of sympathy that he felt so bad he felt like dying, but that does not make involving someone else in any way excusable. It seems to me that this wasn't planned and was a spur of the moment thing, but I can only repeat that it isn't an excuse. I've often read stories from survivors of suicide attempts that they actually felt calm and almost at peace as they knew their pain was ending. They describe it often as the most in control they have felt in a long time. I must stress that this is from those who have decided to kill themselves and have made plans and 'arrangements' and not desperate spur of the moment attempts, which is what Carlise's attempt strikes me as. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Did he deliberately step out in front of the truck and potentially ruin someone's life? Yes. I don't see how anyone can argue any different. Phoenix has pointed out the glaring error in your argument. He deliberately walked into the road to commit suicide. Accusing him of deliberately setting out to ruin the driver's life is a totally different thing. This is not a black or white issue and you, and many others, are seeing it as such. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Excellent post from da baracus (who I previously thought only capable of high quality knob jokes. Apologies for underestimating you big man). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Excellent post from da baracus (who I previously thought only capable of high quality knob jokes. Apologies for underestimating you big man). Underestimating?! You just said my knob jokes were 'of high quality'. That's far from underestimation! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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