Honest_Man#1 Posted January 1, 2015 Share Posted January 1, 2015 The English vs Scottish leagues debate pops up on here every few months. Celtic would be up near the top of the Championship as they are now, and with their fan base they'd surely be Premiership after a year or two. The other top Scottish teams would definitely have a chance of beating teams like Rotherham and Millwall, and they'd all probably hammer Blackpool who are fucking dreadful. But let's not pretend that other than Celtic the rest wouldn't be bottom half/relegation battle at best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Connor1874 Posted January 1, 2015 Share Posted January 1, 2015 While I would agree with the main principal, Forest are absolutely dreadful under Pearce so Dundee Utd would have a chance. At the end of the day they've got players which would walk into any Scottish team, Britt Assombalonga over Nadir Ciftci? No brainer for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted January 1, 2015 Share Posted January 1, 2015 Not quite on topic, but I remember seeing something once about how the English leagues would look if you re-arranged the clubs based on attendance over the past ten seasons, and sandwiched in the Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish clubs too. Main thing I remember is that Falkirk ended up in the Conference, and the part-time Scottish clubs started to appear in the Conference North/South. These things are vaguely interesting to spods like me; anyone seen anything similar during their travels on the web? Based on last season's averages Celtic & Rangers would be in EPL. Hearts would be in the Championship (just - by a whole 3 people ahead of Bradford). Aberdeen, Hibs and Dundee United would be in League 1. Motherwell, Partick, St Mirren, St Johnstone, Ross County and Dundee would be in League 2. Inverness (who only missed-out on L2 by 123 from Wycombe), Dunfermline and Falkirk would be in the Conference National. (Ayr only miss-out on the Conference National by 17 from FC United of Manchester). There would be 101 English and 15 Scottish in the 5 levels overall. Also interesting to compare the other Celtic leagues with Scotland - figures for Eire are 2013, as 2014 aren't on EFS yet. Shamrock, Sligo, Dundalk, Cork and Linfield (by only 4 from St Patrick's) would be in a Championship. St Patrick's, Bohemians, Limerick, Derry and Glentoran would be in a League One. Cliftonville, Shelbourne, Ballymena and Glenavon would be in a League Two. (Bray miss-out by 5 from Forfar). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacksgranda Posted January 1, 2015 Share Posted January 1, 2015 No Welsh League teams? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted January 1, 2015 Share Posted January 1, 2015 Good heavens no... average attendance in the Welsh top division last season was a paltry 325- ranging from Rhyl at the top on 594, to Afan Lido on 195. Overall figures were: Scottish Premiership - 10,228 Scottish Championship - 1,795 Scottish League One - 5,518 (obviously inflated due to Rangers) Scottish League Two - 469 Eire Premier Division - 1,564 Eire First Division - 402 Northern Irish Premiership - 887 no figures for lower levels Welsh Premier - 325 Preceding season (2012-13) they were: Scottish Premiership - 10,022 Scottish Championship - 1,969 Scottish League One - 687 Scottish League Two - 5,572 (obviously inflated due to Rangers) Eire Premier Division - 1,645 Eire First Division - 377 Northern Irish Premiership - 823 no figures for lower levels Welsh Premier - 279 Before that (2011-12): Scottish Premiership - 13,865 Scottish Championship - 2,290 Scottish League One - 605 Scottish League Two - 475 Eire Premier Division - 1,613 no figure for lower level Northern Irish Premiership - 835 no figures for lower levels Welsh Premier - 329 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacksgranda Posted January 1, 2015 Share Posted January 1, 2015 I didn't think their gates were very high, but I didn't realise they were that bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atfccfc Posted January 4, 2015 Share Posted January 4, 2015 Based on last season's averages Celtic & Rangers would be in EPL. Hearts would be in the Championship (just - by a whole 3 people ahead of Bradford). Aberdeen, Hibs and Dundee United would be in League 1. Motherwell, Partick, St Mirren, St Johnstone, Ross County and Dundee would be in League 2. Inverness (who only missed-out on L2 by 123 from Wycombe), Dunfermline and Falkirk would be in the Conference National. (Ayr only miss-out on the Conference National by 17 from FC United of Manchester). There would be 101 English and 15 Scottish in the 5 levels overall. Also interesting to compare the other Celtic leagues with Scotland - figures for Eire are 2013, as 2014 aren't on EFS yet. Shamrock, Sligo, Dundalk, Cork and Linfield (by only 4 from St Patrick's) would be in a Championship. St Patrick's, Bohemians, Limerick, Derry and Glentoran would be in a League One. Cliftonville, Shelbourne, Ballymena and Glenavon would be in a League Two. (Bray miss-out by 5 from Forfar). I always think its pointless comparing both countries. Scotland's population last year (2014) was 5327700, England's population was 53.5 million. So our countries population is less than a 10th of England's yet by the calucations of 101 to 15 for clubs with average attendance fitting into their system we are doing remarkably well. That works out nearly 1 Scottish club for every 7 English. Which means we are punching well above our weight. Wales population is 3.1 million. So 279 for the welsh league is dreadful. But Wales is very much rugby country and most football fans watch Cardiff and Swansea (average approx 20000 each) approx 7 and 9% of those cities population, Wrexham average 3500 approx, 6% of the towns population NI with a population of 1.8 million with an average of 830 per premier league game is also very poor. Which is far less than 1% But they probably lose a lot of fans to England/Scotland every week. Plus Ireland's main sports if the GAA. Average attendance here per championship game is 19000 http://www.gaa.ie/gaa-news-and-videos/daily-news/1/0302141105-gaa-annual-accounts-2013-published/ http://www.gaa.ie/gaa-news-and-videos/daily-news/1/0302141105-gaa-annual-accounts-2013-published/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itzdrk Posted January 4, 2015 Share Posted January 4, 2015 Supras Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
standfree1982 Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Take the money out of English Football and Scottish = England. It's not a surprise that when Sky and co came along and ruined football, the gap between Scotland and England widened. The fact that the Premiership pays teams £60M for relegation ALONE is enough to just dismiss any comparison between the two leagues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Fair. What do you mean by "take the money out", though? Even if there was no TV money, their clubs would still have more income from gates and sponsors, due to their larger population. Even half a century ago there was a 'drain' of Scottish talent to England, it was restrained only by their use of a maximum wage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
standfree1982 Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Half a century ago we were competing much closer with the top teams in England. Of course their bigger teams are going to always dwarf the majority of our teams, we've only got two clubs who are averaging more than 20k a game! When you take out the vast amounts of cash that English teams have, Scottish teams would be competing with mid-low Premiership teams, with the Old Firm competing with the top teams. Currently we're lucky to compete with Championship sides due to the waterfall effect of the money in the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cruoninga Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 There would be 101 English and 15 Scottish in the 5 levels overall. How likely is it that some entities will push for complete integration of the English and Scottish league structures in the near future? The FIFA might want to do so, in order to bring back the number of European associations and to dismantle the IFAB, which is still run by the Home Nations. Opponents of Scottish independence might want to get rid of institutions that express a separate Scottish identity. And it's no secret the Old Firm would fancy it as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 How likely is it that some entities will push for complete integration of the English and Scottish league structures in the near future? About as likely as me, a talentless middle-aged Scottish heifer, ever playing for a combined United Kingdom team. There are only two teams in the UK who might possibly benefit from such an arrangement, and the individual FAs would genuinely rather secede from FIFA than agree to any such merger, purely due to the loss of power. Combine that with the apathy towards the idea from fans in England, and the outright hostility from fans in the other Home Nations, and it's safe to say I'll be struggling through nuclear winters before that idea ever comes to fruition. It is fun to imagine though, until you realise that virtually nothing would change. There'd be a smattering of Scots teams in the existing English set-up, with the Welsh, Northern Irish, and 75% of the Scottish teams playing in regional leagues anyway. So, it'd just be a way for the bigger teams to escape to a more profitable league, is all. Until the big clubs fled to a European League, at which point teams like Hibs would be screwed too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
repeat_offender Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 RE The Chamionship it seems to me at least to be doing pretty well. 1. 2013 3 year TV deal worth £195 Million 2. Fourth Highest avg attendance in EUrope (based on 2012 data) 3. Richest non top flight league in the world. 4. 7th richest league in Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cruoninga Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 So, it'd just be a way for the bigger teams to escape to a more profitable league, is all. Until the big clubs fled to a European League, at which point teams like Hibs would be screwed too I am not actually supporting such a league merger. Having already enough problems playing in Scotland, we would probably already be screwed when the unified British league would come to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 I am not actually supporting such a league merger. Having already enough problems playing in Scotland, we would probably already be screwed when the unified British league would come to happen. It's still probably more likely than another Scottish Cup win for the Hibees TBF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moo Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 Dundee v Man City. Oh wait a minute... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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