cmontheloknow Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Pollok v Shettleston was a Saturday. Is that not the point? Grim weather in late November, poor crowd. But still higher than the nice August nights for two run-of-the-mill Sectional games. Bad weather = a drop in the expected crowd. More midweek games = smaller crowds over the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue manalishi Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Is that not the point? Grim weather in late November, poor crowd. But still higher than the nice August nights for two run-of-the-mill Sectional games. Bad weather = a drop in the expected crowd. More midweek games = smaller crowds over the season. Nice try at bending the facts there. This game was the ONLY game on. Your comparing it with a sectional cup game when there's a full card ie everyone playing at the same time. 410 punters turned up for a Glasgow Derby for a top tier game when it's the only fixture available for junior punters to attend. Are you seriously trying to say that if this game was played in May - August & there were no other games on that the crowd would be less than 410? I'd put money on there being approx double this figure in attendance , but that's a bet that'll sadly never be placed , because a change in the season will never happen unfortunately. Sad really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larky55 Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 I think the season is pretty good as it is. On a nice summers night, I would rather do other things than stand watching a football game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vollyman Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 All the evidence I've seen is that a midweek summer crowd comes nowhere near a winter Saturday crowd. There isn't much of that evidence around though - happy to concede that. Most clubs don't count their gate. Jamie has definite evidence for Pollok who are one of the better supported clubs though and it's not good reading for midweek. And to be clear, a summer season would need a lot of midweek fixtures. Far more than we use at the moment. The impact on playing squads would be significant I suspect and would require clubs to push towards using the full 25 available.There would be less postponements therefore less mid week games the situation needs to be addressed and the season planned to eliminate the farce that happens at the end of season. Last season my club played 5 games in 10 days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuart87 Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 I think the season is pretty good as it is. On a nice summers night, I would rather do other things than stand watching a football game. On a nice summers night, there's nothing I'd rather do than stand watching the football. On a winters day I'd rather sit in and watch the football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vollyman Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 I don't disagree, but I don't think a full summer season can work as it stands. What can work is that we have a winter break and we start the season earlier and end it later so we play more football in the summer months. This would also help towards the holy grail of a fixture list. If fans knew months in advance that they would be playing a few league games midweek, they could make plans to attend the game. Tell them 7 days in advance and that's where you have problems, and that's where we are just now. I agree, what you are proposing is feasible it would lead to better fixture planning. Last season my club played Saturday,Monday,Wednesday,Saturday and Monday, 5 games on 10 days which makes junior football a joke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clash city rocker Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 I don't disagree, but I don't think a full summer season can work as it stands. What can work is that we have a winter break and we start the season earlier and end it later so we play more football in the summer months. This would also help towards the holy grail of a fixture list. If fans knew months in advance that they would be playing a few league games midweek, they could make plans to attend the game. Tell them 7 days in advance and that's where you have problems, and that's where we are just now. Correct no matter the pro's of summer fitba it ain't gonna happen...the clubs don't want it. There has to be a compromise though and starting earlier taking more advantage of the better weather makes sense. The 1st round of the Scottish is last week in September...far too late, should be at least a month earlier..all early rounds have to be moved forward, the earlier in the season the more chance of getting them played first time of asking. The sectional league cup in the West is horrendous and takes up Saturday's that would be better for league games...all league games should be scheduled for Saturdays ..ideally there should be no Scottish ties whatsoever during the months of December and January. A fixture list in the juniors is near impossible only until the Scottish cup gets underway is it feasible...people can scream blue murder about it but its not going to happen. Postponements, replays, holidays etc ...forget it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archieb Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 All the proponents of summer football and of a shorter close season consistently fail to provide a solution for the issue of pitch maintenance/recovery/reseeding which HAS to take place during a substantial summer break. All the other arguments in favour are a waste of effort without a solution to THIS problem - which (as far as I can see) can only be for EVERY club to play on artificial turf! If anybody has another better suggestion, let's hear it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmontheloknow Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 There would be less postponements therefore less mid week games the situation needs to be addressed and the season planned to eliminate the farce that happens at the end of season. Last season my club played 5 games in 10 days. But that isn't true - if you adopted a Mar-Nov season you have two months less playing time. It's a fallacy that midweek games only occur because of postponements - the teams that play the most are involved in cups and that in turn means their opponents, who may well have been out early, end up having to play when asked, and that could be a Tuesday in June. In the East you've gone for a league-heavy programme which is fair enough but cup ties still have to be squeezed in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 All the proponents of summer football and of a shorter close season consistently fail to provide a solution for the issue of pitch maintenance/recovery/reseeding which HAS to take place during a substantial summer break. All the other arguments in favour are a waste of effort without a solution to THIS problem - which (as far as I can see) can only be for EVERY club to play on artificial turf! If anybody has another better suggestion, let's hear it! Well for a start, playing less games on heavy wet pitches reduces the damage. Secondly, pitch maintenance is a year round thing, not just a few weeks in summer. You can re-seed areas of a park from April onwards and all the way upto September. You can also re-turf goalmouths instead of seeding. Thirdly, pitches that are looked after throughout the season don't need major maintenance anyway. A 4 or 5 week close season is ample time to treat an area of a pitch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sancho Panza Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Correct you could still have a 3 week break in July. ANYTHING is better than this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Wilson Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 I think the season is pretty good as it is. On a nice summers night, I would rather do other things than stand watching a football game. What?To be fair, we pretty much have summer football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
energyzone Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 We don't have much more than 3 weeks summer break as it is. Some teams had started their pre-season training this year before the finals of the Ayrshire and Central cups of last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOA Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Not particularly but the number of teams who actually have to do that across the entire structure is tiny. The vast majority complete their season easily enough. Now, if you'd like to explain how many midweek games we'd need to schedule to guarantee an end of November finish ... I'm not arsed to get into this - there must be a dozen threads with the same arguments. I do agree with your follow up post - junior football is dying. Like the rest of football, the gap between top and bottom is now a chasm. Part of the problem here is too many clubs have shite drainage. But they haven't got a button in the plate to do anything about it. Drainage is a bigger concern than dealing with frost. And drainage is an issue all year round. I don't think anyone could guarantee finishing a season in November in current circumstances unless all the games from about September onwards were less important, run of the mill fixtures. The definition of junior against that of amateur has become blurred to the point of non existent for a large number of clubs. At the other end of the scale, you have about 15 - 20 teams at the top who would be better served in more professionally run set up. And you'll have some just below that level with an aspiration to get there. The whole non league structure needs fixed and clubs playing at a more realistic but interchangeable level. If the whole game goes across to the summer then the senior leagues will cope easily - much more so than this grade would. Yep,I agree with most of what you said there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loughal Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 And so the argument goes on season after season. I feel that there are important points missed in this discussion. The Scottish causes major chaos in league fixtures. To date November to now around 140 fixtures have fallen to the weather. The Scottish takes precedence, and this week sees Arniston v Neilston occupying five weeks (That's if they manage to get it off this Saturday. Have a look at the West Super Division.Pollok Played 11 Auchinleck/Kilbirnie Played 6.Petershill were finished last season with Talbot around half way in fixtures many pointless with the outcome already clear. The seniors are to start (on a regional basis) League cup sectional in mid-July '16. Top teams involved are seeded to miss the early sections.Why? To save travel expense.Meantime the SJFA continue to ask their top clubs to join in at R1. We are the only organisation in Europe not to consider the top leagues while £thousands are wasted in travel costs when North v South ties occur.. With a wee bit of thought the leagues could be kept in balance and allow the Scottish to commence early March. The SJFA should be told to come up with some alternatives. Clubs could stop moaning annually here if they come together and discuss the problem. Waste of time though since the SJFA are still in the 19th century. Just waiting to ease in the pyramid system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pride_of_the_Clyde Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 And what is summer football? Mar-Nov? We currently play Jul-Jun so if Dec-Feb is a no go, you will have to find space for those additional 2 months off from playing which means more midweek games. Midweek games mean smaller crowds and more hassle for committee getting the park ready etc... Can I come back on this point by offering for thought that May and June and part of July have no SPFL football which junior clubs might be able to attract with a little work. Difficult to scientifically determine numbers on that but could it offset a significant enough number? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Can I come back on this point by offering for thought that May and June and part of July have no SPFL football which junior clubs might be able to attract with a little work. Difficult to scientifically determine numbers on that but could it offset a significant enough number? It's an interesting point, which also raises the issue of experimenting with Friday night games (in the summer months) and even Sunday games. There a fans out there who also like to go to senior games and would go to both if given opportunity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sancho Panza Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Here we sit again waiting wondering if the game will be on, meantime folks make other arrangements,yet folk say there are poor crowds at midweek games. Yet players or committee are left to the last kick just in case. Has to be a better system than this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmontheloknow Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Can I come back on this point by offering for thought that May and June and part of July have no SPFL football which junior clubs might be able to attract with a little work. Difficult to scientifically determine numbers on that but could it offset a significant enough number? To be fair it is already the case. The three lower leagues finish by the end of April yet the Juniors play into mid June. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sancho Panza Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Just seen the forecast for tomorrow,sure to be more casualties this week again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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