Sergeant Wilson Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 I still find it strange that stuff like this is reported on the news before he's even been found guilty. Even if he's innocent, his reputation will be tarnished and his name will forever be associated with beastly behaviour. It shouldn't be so easy. I could quite easily say that Mary Berry stuck her finger up my bum when I was a toddler, but that doesn't mean it should be in the public domain from the moment I report it. She told me that was chocolate under her nails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Rational Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 The only real story is that it is a story. There's been rumours about Heath for yonks now, everybody was suppose to have been aware that there was something going on but turned a blind eye to it at the time. The Russians used to have a fishing trawler near his yacht every time He went out, I'm sure he would have been under constant surveillance. If anything was going on, it would certainly have led to blackmail..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Wilson Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 The Russians used to have a fishing trawler near his yacht every time I went out,Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Archer (Raconteur) Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 The only real story is that it is a story. There's been rumours about Heath for yonks now, everybody was suppose to have been aware that there was something going on but turned a blind eye to it at the time. The Russians used to have a fishing trawler near his yacht every time I went out, I'm sure he would have been under constant surveillance. If anything was going on, it would certainly have led to blackmail..... Whatever his proclivities, it didn't involve him remotely smelling of fish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Rational Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 Why? Very good, should have typed 'he'..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 Agree. This is well dodgy. #WestmonsterIrvine WelshVerified account @IrvineWelsh Irvine Welsh retweeted Slate The fact that establishment are prepared to throw corpse of ex Tory PM under a bus suggests hiding something big. Only thing bigger than Heath is the Royal Family and David Icke has had plenty to say on them beyond the bonkers reptilian angle that I suspect is probably his libel suit avoidance strategy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorlomin Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 No evidence has been brought forward against Heath in public. Everyone going "definite beast" and all that kind of chat are prejudging someone (albeit dead) before they have a chance to be defended. Heath was a known homosexual and the rumours that went round were he frequented gay pick up sites like Hampstead Heath and may have used male prostitutes. Some rumours of being into younger men float around but back then they floated around about most gay men. Homosexuality was very closely associated with pederasty. It may not be popular but he still is entitled to be considered innocent until proven guilty or as there will be no trial until some compelling evidence emerges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Rational Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 It's pie and bovril, wild accusations, slander and conspiracy theories are what we do best.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Archer (Raconteur) Posted August 5, 2015 Share Posted August 5, 2015 Any word from his orchestra? Was there any tromboning involved? Everyone is mute in this concern. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacksgranda Posted August 6, 2015 Share Posted August 6, 2015 Everyone is mute in this concern. Probably because they were all on the fiddle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crùbag Posted August 6, 2015 Share Posted August 6, 2015 No evidence has been brought forward against Heath in public. Everyone going "definite beast" and all that kind of chat are prejudging someone (albeit dead) before they have a chance to be defended. Heath was a known homosexual and the rumours that went round were he frequented gay pick up sites like Hampstead Heath and may have used male prostitutes. Some rumours of being into younger men float around but back then they floated around about most gay men. Homosexuality was very closely associated with pederasty. It may not be popular but he still is entitled to be considered innocent until proven guilty or as there will be no trial until some compelling evidence emerges. Graham Spiers on the other hand is banned from Ibrokes for the heinous crime of having a different opinion on the running of Sevco. Not like your lot to be so even handed? Sorry, but the London establishhment is full of beasts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elixir Posted August 6, 2015 Share Posted August 6, 2015 The Orcs will be shitting it that their beloved culture/identity is run by a place hoaching with "bheasts". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross. Posted August 6, 2015 Share Posted August 6, 2015 There was a really good interview from his private secretary (88-92) on Breakfast this morning. He basically said, even long after he was PM, Special Branch / the police / the secretary himself kept an extremely tight diary on Heath and will know where he is, and exactly who was with him, at all points. Visitors to his house were logged on time of entry and exit. Even on weekends off, the local police around his house had to know exactly what was happening and when. The implication being that if he is guilty of these things it must predate his time as PM, or even as a minister you would imagine. Otherwise, it raises the very real specter of the police, special branch, his secretary perpetrating a detailed cover up over a number of years. He argued this was unlikely given Heath was, according to him, never part of the establishment and actively hated by much of it. I have no idea if this was the case or not, but any Politician will have plenty of enemies and if there were winks of these allegations when he was alive plenty would benefit from airing it as loud as possible. Have watched that awful Kay Burley interview yesterday, this was actually really insightful. I guess we will wait and see the outcome of the respective investigations but it did give me a bit to think about and the (lack of) private life for current and former PMs. I've read more than a few conspiracy theories that suggest Special Branch/MI5/MI6/James Bond(Delete as applicable) were aware of many of the beasts, and in some cases encouraged it in order to give themselves leverage when it came to influencing UK politics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted August 6, 2015 Share Posted August 6, 2015 Could Jimmy Saville have got away with what he got away with, if there hadn't been a wider issue among the establishment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland B Posted August 6, 2015 Share Posted August 6, 2015 Could Jimmy Saville have got away with what he got away with, if there hadn't been a wider issue among the establishment? Big Irvine Knew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Septentrional Wasp Posted August 6, 2015 Share Posted August 6, 2015 I still find it strange that stuff like this is reported on the news before he's even been found guilty. Even if he's innocent, his reputation will be tarnished and his name will forever be associated with beastly behaviour. I guy who works for a company that regularly does work for mine (I`ve never met him) was lifted at work a few months ago. The cops made him go into his locker to get his phone and apparently went to his house and confiscated his laptop. Now he could be getting lifted for anything - but presumably something computer related, maybe extreme trolling, I don`t know. The problem is my automatic thought, which was similar to those who voiced an opinion on the matter, was Beast and that he must have pictures of kids. As I said I`ve never met the guy so I see this as an unfair judgement of him but it doesn`t change my initial reaction on hearing of his arrest. Another problem for him is, even if he is cleared of any wrong doing, this will undoubtedly follow him around and change most peoples opinions of him before they ever meet him. Would you pre judge someone in this situation - honestly? ETA - The question isn`t aimed at you T R S. An open question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 By putting it in the public domain it makes it easier for other potential victims to come forward. Since it essentially comes down to one person's word versus another it's much easier to find guilt if multiple people come forward and establish a pattern. Bear in mind the sheer trauma involved in being a victim of crimes like this and the further trauma in pursuing a charge and it's better all round that this is discussed as openly as possible. I think it's a really difficult situation. I know from my own profession how damaging allegations can be. Yes the victims need protected but sometimes it can result in new victims. http://www.theguardian.com/education/2009/oct/25/teachers-fight-false-allegations-assault http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/9194130/Prosecute-children-over-false-allegations-say-teachers.html How you strike a balance between the rights of alleged victims and the rights of alleged abusers is one that is going to come back time and time again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strichener Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 I think it's a really difficult situation. I know from my own profession how damaging allegations can be. Yes the victims need protected but sometimes it can result in new victims. http://www.theguardian.com/education/2009/oct/25/teachers-fight-false-allegations-assault http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/9194130/Prosecute-children-over-false-allegations-say-teachers.html How you strike a balance between the rights of alleged victims and the rights of alleged abusers is one that is going to come back time and time again. Or people just have to start accepting that there can be smoke without fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AUFC90 Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 I wonder who they're protecting if they're willing to throw an ex PM to the lions ? It's going to be big and we may never find out. Same with the guy from the lords. He must've pissed someone off, your dirty laundry rarely comes out unless you've pissed off the wrong person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 Or people just have to start accepting that there can be smoke without fire. I wish that were true though. Unfortunately our press are notorious for sensationalising these sorts of allegations and report them as fact. Social media too doesn't help where mud can be thrown anonymously by anyone with an axe to grind. We seem to be in an era where people are guilty until proven innocent instead of the other way round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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