Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons

[Handsome_Devil]

8 minutes ago, Ron Aldo said:

I'm not sold on Kevin Thomson. He did well at at Kelty but with a far bigger budget than their rivals. He obviously wouldn't get that with us.

I also don't understand the Valakari shouts. He seems to be linked every time the vacancy has come up and there must be a reason he's never got it. His only managerial spell outwith Finland saw him relegated with Tromso in Norway. Given we look like genuine relegation candidates this season, I'm not sure he'd be the right appointment.

If we want experience and someone who has learned from their mistakes elsewhere you need to cope with a blot on the copybook.

Afaik he's had one bad season in his managerial career. And it wasn't like they were a farce, four teams ended on the same points after Tromsø lost their last two away games by the odd goal and drew two at home.

One more goal scored or one less conceded in the last six hours of play and his worst season is only lower midtable on GD rather than relegation.

No consolation to Tromsø fans obviously but no one considering him as a candidate should ignore a promotion, a championship, a couple of cup wins, wins in Europe, being top with another club now, experience with international youths, an awareness of the UK game and everything that speaks for him because an absolute baw-hair margin went against him one year.

The fact he'd be given more time than most, support from the fans etc is a bonus after the Alexander but his CV alone merits serious consideration without sentimentality.

[thisGRAEME]

I'd like to add "not Kevin Thomson" next to "not John Hughes" on my wishlist please.

[Swello]

20 minutes ago, Ron Aldo said:

I'm not sold on Kevin Thomson. He did well at at Kelty but with a far bigger budget than their rivals. He obviously wouldn't get that with us.

I don't know if it's because I never took to him as a player, so I'm being petty - but not up for Thomson at all...

[Handsome_Devil]

Nothing against KT but a 37-year-old with one season's experience skooshing a pub league should not even be a serious consideration for us.

 

[capt_oats]

For avoidance of doubt please add me to the "Not Kevin Thomson thank you very much" list.

[Busta Nut]

I am very much in the "not Kev club".
I am passive on Simo but I think his success all came with a club throwing money at things, I know nothing about Finnish fitba but I am sure they were the equivalent of a Kelty/Cove/Gretna.

[Handsome_Devil]

SJK definitely had money to help but I'd be surprised if they were blowing HJK out the water once up.

Kuopio operate normally afaik.

[Busta Nut]

I clocked that KuPS are top of the league there.

I am quite passive on Simo as I said but I think Brexit has fucked and influx of foreign diddies if we get a foreign manager. Not that I know anything about work permit these days.

Edited August 2, 2022 by Busta Nut

[MP_MFC]

I'd love Simo to get it, he genuinely does seem to have wanted it in the past. I also wonder with our seeming new found strategy of actively looking to Northern Europe for players would also be helped by having someone more familiar with the leagues and players. 

I'd also be all on board for us reinstalling the Simo Screen between the South and Main stands for his unveiling. 

 

Kevin Thompson? Add him to the Barry Ferguson list of guys who just get linked to every job cause they're good pals wae folk in the media. Massive pass.

[crazylegsjoe_mfc]

I would be against Thomson anyway, but a further black mark for me is that he won league two at a canter and then resigned to pursue a better job. It seems to be like he was a bit afraid of tarnishing whatever reputation he had by going up a league and possibly facing challenges. I'd have more respect for him (but still not want him to get the Motherwell job) if he was still Kelty manager.

[capt_oats]

It's a slightly unusual circumstance with this recruitment process in so much as for the first time in ages we're not parachuting a manager in mid-season or asking them to oversee a massive squad overhaul.

• Baraclough was appointed 13th December 2014 after 16 games with us 10th on 11 points
• McGhee was appointed 13th October 2015 after 10 games with us 9th on 10 points
• Robinson was appointed as caretaker 28th February 2017 after 26 games with us 11th on 24 points and permanent on 15th March after 28 games on 27 points
• Alexander was appointed 7th January 2021 after 20 games with us 11th on 17 points

As it stands we've played 1 game (which we won), the window is still open for another month, though the squad is largely in place it's still incomplete - we'd have been expecting to add a few more bodies even if Alexander hadn't mutually consented and there's scope for whoever gets the job to bring in their own assistant and probably a coach.

I'd always felt that the circumstances in which we were recruiting previously had us erring on the side of caution with us looking for the safe pair of hands/familiar option which isn't a criticism but in turn it meant that someone like Simo might have been viewed as too much of a risk given he'd be coming in from Scandinavian football and from the interviews I've seen of him he's someone who seems to have an idea of how he wants to play the game rather than the more 'pragmatic' approach that's worked reasonably well for us in recent years.

I know it's generally accepted by the realists on here that in terms of the Motherwell job "style" is pretty far down our list of priorities but with the general fall out from the Graham Alexander Experience I half-wonder whether it's a point that may be discussed a bit more this time round than it has previously

Edited August 2, 2022 by capt_oats

[Londonwell]

14 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

It's a slightly unusual circumstance with this recruitment process in so much as for the first time in ages we're not parachuting a manager in mid-season or asking them to oversee a massive squad overhaul.

• Baraclough was appointed 13th December 2014 after 16 games with us 10th on 11 points
• McGhee was appointed 13th October 2015 after 10 games with us 9th on 10 points
• Robinson was appointed as caretaker 28th February 2017 after 26 games with us 11th on 24 points and permanent on 15th March 28 after 28 games on 27 points
• Alexander was appointed 7th January 2021 after 20 games with us 11th on 17 points

As it stands we've played 1 game (which we won), the window is still open for another month, though the squad is largely in place it's still incomplete - we'd have been expecting to add a few more bodies even if Alexander hadn't mutually consented and there's scope for whoever gets the job to bring in their own assistant and probably a coach.

I'd always felt that the circumstances in which we were recruiting previously had us erring on the side of caution with us looking for the safe pair of hands/familiar option which in turn meant that someone like Simo might have been viewed as too much of a risk given he'd be coming in from Scandinavian football and from the interviews I've seen of him he's someone who seems to have an idea of how he wants to play the game rather than the more 'pragmatic' approach that's worked reasonably well for us in recent years.

I know it's generally accepted by the realists on here that in terms of the Motherwell job "style" is pretty far down our list of priorities but with the general fall out from the Graham Alexander Experience I half-wonder whether it's a point that may be discussed a bit more this time round than it has previously

I don't think anyone selecting the new manager, or indeed most sane people in the support, will be asking for free flowing tiki taka. However, as you kinda point to, given what we sat through with 'Grezza', I would like to think an enquiry on whether the new candidate plans to offer any sort of excitement/entertainment for the price of admission would be made.

I don't think that's too much to expect from someone. I'm sure most of us have enjoyed games at various levels of football, some of which well below the standard that Motherwell are at. So it should be doable. 

[capt_oats]

Fwiw, here's quite a nice article from Nick McPheat about the general situation.

[YassinMoutaouakil]

I was too young to see Simo play and I don't really know enough about culturally Scandinavian football to judge him but f**k me man, just give him the job to stop him applying. I honestly feel bad for him.

[Swami]

Kevin Thomson can take a running f**k to himself and carry on with his Rangers TV career. 

[one m in Motherwell]

Remember...

 

Luc Nijholt 

Mitchell van der Gaag

Eric Garcin

Roy Essandoh

Holm Kraska

Simo Valakari

 

is only a phone call away...

 

[AsimButtHitsASix]

8 minutes ago, YassinMoutaouakil said:

I was too young to see Simo play and I don't really know enough about culturally Scandinavian football to judge him but f**k me man, just give him the job to stop him applying. I honestly feel bad for him.

Without detailed info on what went right/wrong and what other factors were in place his record with SJK was great. Scottish equivalent would be like taking.... Airdrie to 3rd in the Scottish top flight. It happened very quickly and I wonder if there was a sugar daddy behind it. After one mediocre season he was punted and went to Tromso in Norway where he spent a while being bang average before getting them relegated. He's then went back to Finland with KuPS, who are in their golden era, and has been doing grand with them but isn't the architect of their success. 

Worth a punt but part of the reason, historically, to bring a manager from foreign leagues would be their knowledge of those players but it's a lot harder to bring them over to the UK now post-Brexit

[Handsome_Devil]

What we ask of a manager is indeed intriguing because there's more than one way we can have a 'good' season and it's not necessarily exclusive on results.

If we flooded the team with youth, played exciting football and won the majority of home games while struggling/getting pasted away en route to finishing eighth, I think folk would be thrilled - for a season.

Afterwards the pendulum would swing back towards the desire for something more solid if that was more effective.

Peak Robboball in 2017/18 was joyous because of the cups but if McHugh had launched his volley into the stand and Hearts pelted us in the replay that season would be viewed very differently because of the league performances, even having reached one final.

As horrific as we've been since Xmas, 2021/22 was a cast iron success yet it still had the manager on the brink going into the next campaign.

Flow's comments that Motherwell is a very difficult job did not go nearly far enough imo. Even the 'realists' in our support, who don't demand top six or cup runs every year expect it what, once or twice every five years? That's essentially at least winning the league of our peers - despite claiming we spend less on wages - and/or hauling a city club that spend comical amounts more.   

You've to do this while making enough in transfer fees to keep the club going and bringing through youths to maintain our identity. Short-term contracts mean building a team beyond two years is impossible. Oh and we're now getting picky about how the football looks while you do it.

I'm not saying these goals are unreasonable - our continual position in Scottish football suggests they're about right - but churning it out must be bloody hard indeed. It's no wonder even our best managers tend to end in failure.

So with that in mind, if we have a talented, motivated candidate with experience I'd be tempted to chuck them a blank canvas and let them approach it as they see fit. GA was a 'results only' man, knew the risks and paid the price. The next guy might struggle to define failure in advance but we'll all know it if we see it!

[welldaft]

I suspect Hammy is doing a good job with the Academy and so would create a short term problem if he was promoted. 

Huge respect for his career at Motherwell. Probably too early for 1st team gig, but would not be averse to him becoming Assistant Manager with a view to stepping up at some point. 

In other news I noted Sligo / Viking have drawn the team formerly known as Steaua Bucharest in the play off round. That kinds of softens the blow as been there seen and done it with the Well. Had it had been Villarreal that would have hurt. Of course given we could not beat Sligo then little chance we would get past Viking ! 

[Handsome_Devil]

10 minutes ago, AsimButtHitsASix said:

Worth a punt but part of the reason, historically, to bring a manager from foreign leagues would be their knowledge of those players but it's a lot harder to bring them over to the UK now post-Brexit

Alternatively bringing in someone from the Nordics used to recruiting worldwide could now be an advantage? Signing from outside the EU into the UK used to be really hard, we've seen more non-Europeans come in at a lower level than previously already.

For whatever reason the Nordic countries had different rules, they have long fished in much broader waters. It wouldn't have to be Valikari to help with this obviously but for example his squad, according to Wiki, has two Brazilians, a Nigerian, a Ghanian and a Venezuelan.