Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons

[crazylegsjoe_mfc]

There was rumours at one point that Shields was close to going out on loan to Dunfermline and that in a reserve game he played, James McPake was there watching and left when Shields got subbed. It probably transpires that he was watching Robbie Mahon given he went there after all - but even still - I think we can see that you don't go from being linked with a league one side on loan to playing every week without good reason.

When Tierney was getting a run in the 10 role, we started the Hearts game with Spittal and Efford on the wings and Van Veen up top, then we had Aarons, McKinstry and Moult on the bench as attacking options, with Shields and Morris not even in the squad. That array of options that day lasted less than 15 minutes until Aarons became broken - but on paper having all of these options at their best probably wouldn't have seen us in this predicament. Even just having all available to push one another might have given us a lift. Other than Tierney warming the bench most weeks now, be that through performance, size, experience or whatever, a lot of those options have been taken away.

I've said it a few times - but we probably gambled on both Aarons and Moult due to them being a significant improvement (if fit) on the other options available. Perhaps a double gamble was too much and we should have chosen one. The alternative was maybe that we signed, using this level of player as an example, a Justin Amaluzor and a Christy Manzinga instead. We'd then just have a bloated squad and any changes would just be for changes sake and lead us back to the Grezza tombola days.

The thing that annoys me about our recruitment since Alexander's days is that we seemed to get worse window to window. With each player at their best, Chrissy Long being replaced by Woolery was a downgrade and then Woolery being replaced by Morris was yet another downgrade. The same with the centre-back situation. We went far and wide last season and scouted two centre-backs from Scandanavia, only for Alexander to be back playing two centre-backs who were there when he arrived this summer. 

I think the recruitment under Alexander and the recruitment under Robinson may be a closer run thing. 

 

[crazylegsjoe_mfc]

31 minutes ago, Desp said:

Interesting point this.  As far as I'm aware, Alexander hasn't taken another job since leaving us and we haven't really replaced Hammell as Academy Director, have we?

So are we still paying Alexander?  Effectively having him on gardening leave and our staff wage bill would be exactly the same now, give or take, as it was in June.  Would give substance to the "cheapest option" patter surrounding appointing Hammell over splashing out to get Valakari out of his contract.

Is that not Kettlewell's job? 

[YassinMoutaouakil]

Reckon Alexander can still play at right back?

[Blink182]

2 minutes ago, crazylegsjoe_mfc said:

Is that not Kettlewell's job? 

He's the u18s head coach. Not overall head of youth. Clarkson was u18s with Brian Kerr so I'd be surprised if Clarkson isn't the next head of youth. 

[capt_oats]

8 minutes ago, crazylegsjoe_mfc said:

Is that not Kettlewell's job? 

Nah, as @Blink182 says Kettlewell took Kerr’s position.

The Academy director role vacated by Hammell hasn’t been filled as yet.

Edited January 5, 2023 by capt_oats

[Neil86]

I am a big Ross Tierney Fan and would have him in as often as possible. He is exciting in a way no one else is, other than Van Veen occasionally. 

Shields attributes are pace and power and weirdly enough he never seems to be able to use them, always slows down. 

['WellDel]

26 minutes ago, Neil86 said:

Shields attributes are pace and power and weirdly enough he never seems to be able to use them, always slows down. 

He's not a winger, so has being played out of position as a bit of a defence (not much, i know), and as you say he all too often slows down to look for a pass inside or back the way rather than take men on. It seems his legs are too fast for the footballing component of his brain at times, and he either gets into a good shooting position, panics and misses wildly, or on the occasions he does hit the byeline, rather than look up he just sclaffs in a weak as piss cross that the first defender easily cuts out.

Edited January 5, 2023 by 'WellDel
Typo

[rowsdower]

The problem with shields is that he has shown absolutely no proficiency in front of goal, which doesn't bode well if his preferred position is center forward.

These kind of projects don't always work out, but I don't have a problem with us taking this approach to try and find lower league gems. He could still figure something out, who knows.

[Desp]

I think it's just the case of wrong club/wrong time for Shields at Motherwell.  You can't really fault his effort, but it's just not happening for him.  I'm sure he'll go on to have a decent career somewhere else, whether that be at this level or in the Championship.

We've seen it happen with the likes of Jordan White, where he's shit with us but does a decent job up at County.  Likewise with John Sutton at Hearts & Motherwell.  Sometime it just doesn't work.

Who knows? We might get a wide player in this week, Shields spends time out of the side and comes back in after the split and makes a contribution.  I still think back to that goal against St. Mirren in the 4-2 game and wonder what we could've had with him.  I always think a 3-5-2 with him and van Veen could work, but I doubt we'll ever see it.

I'll never, ever understand fans in the stand hurling abuse at players playing for their team, though.  What are they actually hoping to achieve with it?

[ropy]

18 minutes ago, Desp said:

 

I'll never, ever understand fans in the stand hurling abuse at players playing for their team, though.  What are they actually hoping to achieve with it?

I’ve always assumed it’s an alternative to slapping their wives when they get home.

[Doctor Manhattan]

11 minutes ago, ropy said:

I’ve always assumed it’s an alternative to slapping their wives when they get home.

I somehow doubt it's an "either/or" thing.

[Mr Hahn]

26 minutes ago, Desp said:

 

I'll never, ever understand fans in the stand hurling abuse at players playing for their team, though.  What are they actually hoping to achieve with it?

This. And the boos when a player other than the one they want is being subbed off can get in the bin as well. Pretty sure footballers know better than most when they're not playing well and I'm sure there are some characters that might get a "prove them wrong" kind of attitude but they are all human so to then hear a chorus of booing from those who are supposed to give them the most backing must kill confidence.

['WellDel]

35 minutes ago, Desp said:

'll never, ever understand fans in the stand hurling abuse at players playing for their team, though.  What are they actually hoping to achieve with it?

Aye, targeting and booing players is moronic behaviour which can only serve to exacerbate the situation and dent confidences further. How can they not see that? 

I'm probably guilty of many an "Oh, for f**k's sake!!" when things aren't going to plan, but as a general frustration and never directed at an individual. I'll also, like most of us, use this place to spout shite and lay bare my lack of real footballing knowledge (and if any player is mental enough to be reading the ill-informed ramblings on here, then he'll mend them). I will never though, understand the seemingly fair amount of nutters within our support who appear to be there solely to shout abuse and find fault. No' happy unless they're moaning some of them. Bizarre. 

[Swello]

54 minutes ago, ropy said:

I’ve always assumed it’s an alternative to slapping their wives when they get home.

I've always assumed it's them that gets slapped when they're home and they take it out on twenty year olds.

[rowsdower]

I'm a bit soft when it comes to player abuse, and more of a benefit of the doubt kind of guy, especially now I'm an age where the players are young enough to be my weans. I'll shout and swear with the best of them, but it's usually just sending general frustration into the ether, and not directed to anyone. I'm the same with opposition players.

The same goes with the online stuff. Saying someone is shite on a fans forum is fine and expected, as long as it doesn't get personal, but harassing folk on social media like hijacking media posts and birthday messages is way over the line and is way too common thesedays. I know it's not exclusive to us, but it is beyond cringeworthy.

Fans should also realize that just about every one of the players they abuse could absolutely kick the f**k out of them. 

[crazylegsjoe_mfc]

38 minutes ago, rowsdower said:

The same goes with the online stuff. Saying someone is shite on a fans forum is fine and expected, as long as it doesn't get personal, but harassing folk on social media like hijacking media posts and birthday messages is way over the line and is way too common these days. I know it's not exclusive to us, but it is beyond cringeworthy.

I agree with this 100%. I think it's fine to come on to a forum and subjectively discuss a player's performances / abilities in a respectful manner (I doubt Connor Shields spends his evenings on p&b anyway) but I saw the post Motherwell put on Facebook yesterday about his 50th appearance and some of the replies were ridiculous, both from the perspective of what they're hoping to achieve by posting it and the fact that social media is a place where if not a player, a family member may see it. The club, I think, should have a bit of savvy on when to put a post on social media where comments are disabled.

 

[capt_oats]

"hopefully"... "a few..."

Yes, I just had a dip into Steelmen and was alerted to this information.

Edited January 5, 2023 by capt_oats

[thisGRAEME]

4 hours ago, crazylegsjoe_mfc said:

I agree with this 100%. I think it's fine to come on to a forum and subjectively discuss a player's performances / abilities in a respectful manner (I doubt Connor Shields spends his evenings on p&b anyway) but I saw the post Motherwell put on Facebook yesterday about his 50th appearance and some of the replies were ridiculous, both from the perspective of what they're hoping to achieve by posting it and the fact that social media is a place where if not a player, a family member may see it. The club, I think, should have a bit of savvy on when to put a post on social media where comments are disabled.

 

Aye, I mean, Shields is a good example of this. We've had various shiftless c***s over the years who drove me daft. Shields grafts like f**k and is short of a bit of quality. If we can't figure out a way to utilise it, it isn't his fault.

[boozyBJ]

Feels dirty going into Steelmenonline. Always delete my browsing history after it in case anyone finds out I’ve been on the site

[eliphas]

11 hours ago, thisGRAEME said:

Aye, I mean, Shields is a good example of this. We've had various shiftless c***s over the years who drove me daft. Shields grafts like f**k and is short of a bit of quality. If we can't figure out a way to utilise it, it isn't his fault.

Defintley agree with the social media nonsense needing to stop. It won't, but it should. I don't see it really as I bombed my facebook account years ago, and my Twitter followed when I turned 40 last year (I'd thoroughly recommend it by the way, life is nicer).

It's a bit of a shite situation for club and player so there's not really much blame for me either way. He's clearly not good enough for this level yet.  Two managers, multiple different positions and 18 months later he still looks the same as he arrived (i.e. a championship player). He'd be best utilised off the bench for me to come on later in the game with his speed and strength but things haven't panned out that way and he's unfortunately being a bit exposed as needs must really.