well again Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 24 minutes ago, JamesP_81 said: Quick selective look through some of the more likely leagues for us to look at talent from and the cream of the crop would appear to be : Gary Madine Dwight Gayle Cillian Sheridan Joseph Efford! tbh right now I'd take bazooka Joe back but unsure what the returns policy is on SK's ban-cannon.  This will be the Joe efford that played 3 games for his previous club and they have binned him after half a season then he is either injured or shite or both . We are far better going with Luca Ross than wasting money on him 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MurrayWell Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 When Cillian Sheridan and Joe Efford are the big hitters of the free transfer market, we're maybe better no bothering eh? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capt_oats Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 (edited) 36 minutes ago, well fan for life said: I am barely even whelmed by yesterday. It's a fair point that one of the real drop offs from last season was going from Johnston/Furlong to SOD/Spencer tying himself in knots to get onto his right foot. So with that in mind it's probably not awful that we've got a few extra options out there. However I don't think it was our biggest problem. Biereth is involved in the majority of our goals scored this season and left on the 18th. Alongside emptying Wilkinson & Shaw it's left us with Bair who has a total of 5 career goals(who I'm also convinced isn't a striker) and a complete unknown quantity in Vale. Obika might surprise us by being fit for a game at some point but I'm not exactly confident. Ketts must be confident that Butcher, Casey & Blaney will improve but as it stands I'd be playing McGinn & SOD as 2/3 of our back 3 from here on out. Who knows if we missed out on a defender. From what we're hearing about missing out on forwards to other teams, and I don't mean the alleged duffel bag full of used bank notes for KVV, it suggests we're skint. I don't think we're struggling to keep the lights on skint, but we're certainly struggling to attract players. Not helped by the last couple of years of bullshit we've been pulling around managerial appointments/sackings, botched stadium renovations and an even more botched attempt to have a CEO I'd imagine. Tbh, I think there are probably two different conversations. Broadly speaking our January window was fine we addressed some areas that needed addressing, we added a bit of depth and we didn't resort to the sort of trolley dash we've seen in other windows. Our first team squad as it stands sits at 24 as opposed to the sort of numbers we've seen in previous seasons(which are arguably coming back to bite us now). As others have said we're probably one decent senior striker away from having had a decent enough window. That's fine. But here's the rub...that striker was pretty much the one thing we had to get right given the impact Biereth has had on our season to date. We had Kettlewell sat in front of the press last week talking about how a striker was a priority going into this window, Frail did the media call yesterday explaining about how we needed to add in that area (or words to that effect). We obviously didn't have much choice in Biereth's recall however we sold Wilkinson and returned Shaw to sender....we effectively cleared the decks to facilitate getting someone in and...didn't. Regardless of what happens, who knows maybe we find this year's Scott McDonald equivalent in free agency or Jack Vale turns out to be the second coming of Alan Shearer, you can't dress the fact that we went into the final day of the window having not adequately addressed the striker situation (which was apparently a priority) as anything other than a failure. That's not me looking for a pound of flesh or whatever but there has to be some accountability as far as what happened and why we didn't manage to get someone in. The optics of this window haven't been great between having the rug pulled from under us with Biereth to whatever yesterday was to being gazumped by Hibs for a striker in the final hours we've looked like the football club equivalent of Charlie Brown. Edited February 2 by capt_oats 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KirkySuperSub Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 Saw last night that Annan Athletic have taken a young 20 year old striker from Newcastle United, Michael Ndiweni, on loan to the the end of the season. Now, I wouldn't know Michael Ndiweni unless he walked into my kitchen, smacked me on the mouth and proclaimed, "that's from Michael Ndweni". But if he's been playing with Newcastle United, and according to his wiki - (yeah, I know!) - was on the subs bench for the PSG Champions League game at St. James' Park last November, then he must have something about him. It begs the question, why then did he end up at Annan Athletic? Reasons of locale perhaps? Is there an inner sanctum with loan deals such as this? Is there a "database" to tap into? Or is it mates simply calling in favours? Like I said, not a clue about the guy, whether he's any good or another one in a very long line of haddies who'll forge out a career in the lower leagues. But on the face of it, you've got to imagine the bold Michael would have been happier if he'd been offered a shot at the SPL, rather than seeing the season out playing for Annan Athletic? Just feels a strange one for me. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casagolda Posted February 2 Author Share Posted February 2 12 hours ago, Stevie Kirk said: I hear you. I’d just like us to show some fucking ambition, you know just once. I’ll be honest, I am completely disillusioned with the club at the moment . It’s been one boot in the stones after another this season . To be fair just a few years ago we spent nearly 500k on players under Alexander and pushed the wage structure to breaking point. What did we have to show for it? We scraped a top 6 finish and got a trip to Ireland. Long term we were left with a bloated squad, full of average players on big contracts that in the end very nearly got us relegated the following season. Once this summers gone, the last of contracts dished out during Alexander’s big spending era will be gone and we will have very few players under contract for next season. We should also have a new chairman, a new CEO and possibly even a new manager. So I think you have to separate the short term nature of this season and the longer term changes coming. This season is a result of several years of mismanagement. The fact we’ve not signed anyone this window beyond the end of the season should tell you everything you need to know about what this season is all about. Minimise the spending, finish 10th and start afresh next season. We absolutely should have signed another striker no doubt but honestly, how we go about filling the 3 key roles outlined above over the next few months is the bigger concern for me going forward. 12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigkillie Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 3 minutes ago, KirkySuperSub said: Saw last night that Annan Athletic have taken a young 20 year old striker from Newcastle United, Michael Ndiweni, on loan to the the end of the season. Now, I wouldn't know Michael Ndiweni unless he walked into my kitchen, smacked me on the mouth and proclaimed, "that's from Michael Ndweni". But if he's been playing with Newcastle United, and according to his wiki - (yeah, I know!) - was on the subs bench for the PSG Champions League game at St. James' Park last November, then he must have something about him. It begs the question, why then did he end up at Annan Athletic? Reasons of locale perhaps? Is there an inner sanctum with loan deals such as this? Is there a "database" to tap into? Or is it mates simply calling in favours? Like I said, not a clue about the guy, whether he's any good or another one in a very long line of haddies who'll forge out a career in the lower leagues. But on the face of it, you've got to imagine the bold Michael would have been happier if he'd been offered a shot at the SPL, rather than seeing the season out playing for Annan Athletic? Just feels a strange one for me. If Newcastle decided to send him to Annan Athletic then it seems unlikely to me that he'd be good enough for Motherwell. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Handsome_Devil Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 Just now, Casagolda said: We absolutely should have signed another striker no doubt but honestly, how we go about filling the 3 key roles outlined above over the next few months is the bigger concern for me going forward. Would double greenie your post, a million times this. I don't know if it's too much football manager, the rush for immediate success or simply the internet making some odd views more well-known but there seems to be the refusal to accept bad decisions have medium-tern consequences, paying emergency money to avoid disaster needs paid back etc. We had three managers and a supermarket sweep January last season, the bill was always in the post. This term - and yes, the ridiculous end to last season and good start falsely inflated expectations for some - was always about taking the medicine, ensuring survival and starting afresh. A new CEO and improved board is by far the bigger issue than a striker. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KirkySuperSub Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 3 minutes ago, craigkillie said: If Newcastle decided to send him to Annan Athletic then it seems unlikely to me that he'd be good enough for Motherwell. Â Yet he was on the bench against PSG - allegedly? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RostokMcSpoons Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 Just now, KirkySuperSub said:  Yet he was on the bench against PSG - allegedly? Yeah but honestly what does that mean? They could have had an injury list as long as ours, so had to put the boot / tea boy on the bench just to make up the numbers. Wee Al is on the bench for Millwall every match, doesn't get a sniff of a run-out even from there these days, so benches can be full of good and bad players, need to know some breakdowns before we could make any judgement about it 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MurrayWell Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 7 minutes ago, KirkySuperSub said:  Yet he was on the bench against PSG - allegedly? Was that not when Newcastle had the biggest injury list they've ever known? We've had plenty of academy products in the bench who have not kicked on at any level. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KirkySuperSub Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 4 minutes ago, RostokMcSpoons said: Yeah but honestly what does that mean? They could have had an injury list as long as ours, so had to put the boot / tea boy on the bench just to make up the numbers. Wee Al is on the bench for Millwall every match, doesn't get a sniff of a run-out even from there these days, so benches can be full of good and bad players, need to know some breakdowns before we could make any judgement about it Fair enough - I'll get back in my cave! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
well fan for life Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 I cannot take any mention of Newcastle seriously in this thread. Unless there's a nominal fee of course. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fat_tony Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 32 minutes ago, MurrayWell said: When Cillian Sheridan and Joe Efford are the big hitters of the free transfer market, we're maybe better no bothering eh? We should at least consider offering Cillian Sheridan a joint role where he runs our social media. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayMFC Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Casagolda said: To be fair just a few years ago we spent nearly 500k on players under Alexander and pushed the wage structure to breaking point. What did we have to show for it? We scraped a top 6 finish and got a trip to Ireland. Long term we were left with a bloated squad, full of average players on big contracts that in the end very nearly got us relegated the following season. Once this summers gone, the last of contracts dished out during Alexander’s big spending era will be gone and we will have very few players under contract for next season. We should also have a new chairman, a new CEO and possibly even a new manager. So I think you have to separate the short term nature of this season and the longer term changes coming. This season is a result of several years of mismanagement. The fact we’ve not signed anyone this window beyond the end of the season should tell you everything you need to know about what this season is all about. Minimise the spending, finish 10th and start afresh next season. We absolutely should have signed another striker no doubt but honestly, how we go about filling the 3 key roles outlined above over the next few months is the bigger concern for me going forward. This is spot on for me. There's two issues here - the basic expectation that should fall upon any club to be able to fill a squad with the numbers required to navigate a season/half a season, and the whole KVV thing. On the latter, I'm quite relaxed - if folk genuinely do want us to compete with what Kilmarnock are (reportedly) paying (and what St. Mirren (reportedly) wanted to be paying), then I think there's perhaps a wider discussion about fan-ownership & safeguarding the financial future of the club through strict wage structures, budgeting etc to be had. However, on the former, I think it's a massive failing to be going into a second half of a season where relegation is still a possibility with three strikers that includes an untried young loanee, a long-term injury worry, and a guy who - albeit decent so far this season - was only ever brought in as a 4th choice project. As always with these things, hindsight will be a wonderful thing in the summer and hopefully then we'll be in a place where that failure to ensure a suitable squad in terms of attackers hasn't actually cost us. But criticism for that at the moment is, for me, entirely justified, and is a separate issue from the KVV stuff. We should have been able to bring in another forward - I don't believe that the choice should ever have been a binary one between obliterating your entire wage structure or bringing in nobody. Edited February 2 by JayMFC 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
real-name-hidden Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 Diego Costa - do it Ketts you coward. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londonwell Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 Should have signed a striker but content with the rest of our business. The club was completely right not to break the bank for KVV. Unfortunately, as could be seen in the St J game, Bair is playing through injury. Hopefully his hamstring holds up for the rest of the season. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alanos Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 Heard we tried to get Stevie May last minute. Similar to Brophy, St Johnstone didn’t want him going to a relegation rival. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cloontang Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 1 minute ago, Alanos said: Heard we tried to get Stevie May last minute. He shaved his ponytail off, not interested. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke92 Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 When I say 'the fan ownership model is not working' I don't mean that it risks us going out of business or we aren't finacially secure. What I mean is that the current model is not enabling us to financially compete and meet my and many other fans ambitions/expectations Where we are just now is we probably have the 2nd lowest budget in the league. We are regularly being outfought for players by clubs of a lesser/similar size. I think this started with O'Hara and co at St Mirren but it appears to be getting worse and worse. KVV is an emotive subject. Should we be contributing 80% of 10k a week to his wages? No. The point is that it encapsulates the current state of play of and where we are just now. We are behind the majority of clubs in the league in the pecking order for players. Personally I don't think getting another 500/1k fans in the well society is going to get us to the level we need to be financially and so I think the strategy to look a financial beneficiary is the right one. I don't think most fans want us to splurge money on players but the player budget at the moment isn't adequate to meet a lot of fans ambitions. On the striker situation more specifically, it is just a really bad look for all involved. If someone gets injured we are going to completely humped It feels like we are betting on Livi being relegated rather than trying to secure any kind of financial safety ourselves. I really hope we can pull a rabbit out the hat in free transfers because this is a bad look for recruitment and the manager 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KirkySuperSub Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 St. Mirren are fan owned as well, so where they getting this endless pot of money from? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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