Brexit slowly becoming a Farce.

[Loondave1]

 

"I will not have my voice ignored Loondave1 did not vote to leave etc etc " yada yada yada. "Loondave1 will make his own decisions about his future in P&B etc etc " "Loondave1 will have his voice heard..." zzzzzzz

[Enigma]

Believing a second referendum kills Brexit is like thinking 19 September 2014 killed independence.

[dorlomin]

 

 

 

 

 

This is our politics for the next decade or two. 

 

 

[oldbitterandgrumpy]

42 minutes ago, dorlomin said:

Sorry but that is nonsense. This has been a deeply polarised debate from the off. And it was a "leave" voter who started the original petition for a second vote assuming there would be a narrow leave loss, while before the election Farage was talking about the need for a second referendum before they won the first. 

 

Since June 17 we have been locked in a political dead heat, with a slight tory lead (though you will only see polls with a Labour lead posted here.) We now have both main parties disintegrating and two new political entities, Change UK and the Brexit Party, picking up 5-10% of the votes where they are included in the polling. Its not the boldest of predictions to suggest that in such circumstances an election might not resolve the issues of a country split something like 48/52 on an issue that splits both main parties. Our political system is in gridlock exacerbated  by the demographics that will likely shift towards a remain majority but with a strong majority of parliamentary seats being leave. 

FPTP.   Gotta love it eh?

[oldbitterandgrumpy]

2 hours ago, Granny Danger said:

Remain would win a second referendum.  We would stay in the EU.  

If the Tories tried to raise Leave at the following election it would tear them apart and the public would not want it rehashed.

Further change would not form any part of Labour’s next manifesto.

There would be a slight increase in support for a UKIP type party, however given FPTP that would amount to nothing and soon fizzle out.

That’s what would happen.

 

FPTP.  Gotta love it eh?

[Michael W]

38 minutes ago, dorlomin said:

Sorry but that is nonsense. This has been a deeply polarised debate from the off. And it was a "leave" voter who started the original petition for a second vote assuming there would be a narrow leave loss, while before the election Farage was talking about the need for a second referendum before they won the first. 

 

Since June 17 we have been locked in a political dead heat, with a slight tory lead (though you will only see polls with a Labour lead posted here.) We now have both main parties disintegrating and two new political entities, Change UK and the Brexit Party, picking up 5-10% of the votes where they are included in the polling. Its not the boldest of predictions to suggest that in such circumstances an election might not resolve the issues of a country split something like 48/52 on an issue that splits both main parties. Our political system is in gridlock exacerbated  by the demographics that will likely shift towards a remain majority but with a strong majority of parliamentary seats being leave. 

It appears I am indeed mistaken RE the people's vote campaign- founded in 2018. The politicians behind it were certainly on about it long before then however. 

An election is an interesting one. Broadly speaking, I think we'd end up with little change of note in numbers but certainly no majority government. Coupled with a few vocal opponents of their party (Hoey, Grieve, Boles etc.) being removed for a more compliant figure, tough to see what would gather a majority then that won't now. 

The numbers preventing a breakthrough are frustratingly small. 

[oldbitterandgrumpy]

34 minutes ago, dorlomin said:

This is a day dream that has no relation to polling or the general depth of polarised antipathy currently in the political system. Anti EU has been deeply baked into the mindset of the right for 3 decades now. 

 

 

It was not going to go away if we had won the June 16 election and will not go away after a second referendum. More over the majority of seats in the UK poll towards Leave, or at least did. 

This is going to fester, either way for a decade or three more. 

Depressing as f**k. 

[Granny Danger]

44 minutes ago, dorlomin said:

This is a day dream that has no relation to polling or the general depth of polarised antipathy currently in the political system. Anti EU has been deeply baked into the mindset of the right for 3 decades now. 

 

 

It was not going to go away if we had won the June 16 election and will not go away after a second referendum. More over the majority of seats in the UK poll towards Leave, or at least did. 

This is going to fester, either way for a decade or three more. 

If it makes you happier to think that please do so.

 

[Melanius Mullarkey]

36 minutes ago, Loondave1 said:

10 hours ago, Melanius Mullarkey said:

So what’s the solution? 

As far as the current problem goes I don't know but I doubt Blackfords kiddy on Indy2 threats will solve it.

So you have no alternative other than "but Indy wont solve anything".

Excellent.

[oldbitterandgrumpy]

2 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

If it makes you happier to think that please do so.

 

So you think Brexit is not going to fester for years to come?

[Granny Danger]

1 hour ago, John Lambies Doos said:

No, you're accusing WB of pedaling shite when, on this occasion, he clearly wasn't. In your angry state you then again refuse to accept you were wrong. You are a decent poster but you need to stop picking fights at every occasion. Anyway quote below from EU leaders clearly complimenting the points WB and myself were making.

:She said EU leaders were also questioning the logic of arguing over things like a customs union or Common Market option at this stage, because right now, the UK has only three options as they see it - no deal, no Brexit or Theresa May's deal - and anything else is a matter for future talks once the UK has actually left.'

If the WA was a completely separate and inconsequential document Parliament would already have passed it.  It’s not.

 

[Granny Danger]

6 minutes ago, oldbitterandgrumpy said:

So you think Brexit is not going to fester for years to come?

It might fester but that’s all that will happen and it will be of no real consequence.

The older bigots and xenophobes will die off and it’s relevance will become less and less.

 

[Guest Bob Mahelp]

1 hour ago, Loondave1 said:

10 hours ago, John Lambies Doos said:

It really wasn't. We can do better than this clusterfuck and you know it.

All I saw was a wee puffed up blowfish waiting to put in his well rehearsed but dull "Scotland ignored" speach. "Ignored" and "not getting our own way" being fairly interchangeable with the SNP. Not sure the way out of the impasse but empty windbaggery isn't it.

I love how the fanatical Yoons in Scotland are ignoring the UK's biggest political crisis in 70 years, and concentrating on the minutae of what the SNP said and did.

It's fascinating, hilarious and pathetic, all in one go.

 

 

[Loondave1]

I love how the fanatical Yoons in Scotland are ignoring the UK's biggest political crisis in 70 years, and concentrating on the minutae of what the SNP said and did.
It's fascinating, hilarious and pathetic, all in one go.
 
 

Here's me thinking the SNP were obliged and involved in finding said solution. Blackford self declares as "speaking for Scotland" and then has a pointless hissy fit about Indy when he should be looking at the bigger mess that's relevant now cross party. He is a downgrade on his predecessor and predictable every time he gets up to speak.

[DeeTillEhDeh]

Here's me thinking the SNP were obliged and involved in finding said solution. Blackford self declares as "speaking for Scotland" and then has a pointless hissy fit about Indy when he should be looking at the bigger mess that's relevant now cross party. He is a downgrade on his predecessor and predictable every time he gets up to speak.

I think you'll find that they have but the Maybot and the Mumbleclown have chosen to stick to their tribal politics.

[sergie's no1 fan]

Here's me thinking the SNP were obliged and involved in finding said solution. Blackford self declares as "speaking for Scotland" and then has a pointless hissy fit about Indy when he should be looking at the bigger mess that's relevant now cross party. He is a downgrade on his predecessor and predictable every time he gets up to speak.

They do have a solution. They have had a few actually, even the most looniest on yoons could see that.

There is only one solution that saves Scotland now, England and Wales appear to be too far gone.

[Bairnardo]

predictable every time he gets up to speak.

Oooft

[John Lambies Doos]

Here's me thinking the SNP were obliged and involved in finding said solution. Blackford self declares as "speaking for Scotland" and then has a pointless hissy fit about Indy when he should be looking at the bigger mess that's relevant now cross party. He is a downgrade on his predecessor and predictable every time he gets up to speak.

He's speaking for Scotland a hell of a lot more than May is.
His speech last night was excellent.

[Wee-Bey]

Loondave not even trying anymore.

[Loondave1]

He's speaking for Scotland a hell of a lot more than May is.
His speech last night was excellent.

Havers. He should have a string to pull coming out his back. If Indy was imminent he might have had a point but for now it was an "If your auntie had baws" speech based in a different reality.