Brexit slowly becoming a Farce.

[WhiteRoseKillie]

1 hour ago, NotThePars said:

 

Dependent on how much of a mad one they have at the weekend?

Trust me, no matter how much you calculate you'll make on exes by being at a big court job, you're crying for your own bed and decent scran by the end of the first week.

I did an attempted murder trial a few years back that went on for just short of four weeks. I was fucking homicidal myself  by the end of it.

[welshbairn]

Telling off a judge for looking sceptical won't go down well.

[SweeperDee]

4 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

Telling off a judge for looking sceptical won't go down well.

He's asking him to not be sceptical because the point he was making was a fact, in the written evidence, that was in front of Lord Reed. 

Edited September 18, 2019 by SweeperDee

[SweeperDee]

2 minutes ago, SweeperDee said:

He's asking him to not be sceptical because the point he was making was a fact, in the written evidence, that was in front of Lord Reed. 

Moreover it's up to the Government to prove good faith in their actions; Lord Reed was appearing (by his look of scepticism) to give them good faith blindly. 

[grumswall]

I must be missing something here but what exactly would be the point of Westminster being recalled now anyway? Johnson's hands are already pretty much tied from the votes held in the quickfire sessions last week. Obviously Johnson being humiliated yet again in the courts (and best of all, by Jocko upstarts) is a good thing and there's a constitutional issue at stake as well, but bringing it back just for four more weeks of rehashing the same debate lines may not play well in the longer term. 

The short answer: it makes him look even weaker than he already does.

[welshbairn]

Did well I think, but raising the excuse of having to drive back from Devon from his holidays as an excuse for not asking the Scottish court for a "reduction" sounded a bit like the dog ate my homework.

P.S. If I had been a Supreme Court judge this would have settled the case for me on behalf of the Government. For this and many other reasons, thankfully I'm not, and they'll decide on the facts.

Quote

We’ve got hear the mother of parliaments being shut down by the father of lies. Rather than allowing lies to triumph, listen to the angels of your better nature and rule that this prorogation is unlawful and an abuse of power which has been entrusted to the government.

 

Edited September 18, 2019 by welshbairn

[UsedToGoToCentralPark]

I must be missing something here but what exactly would be the point of Westminster being recalled now anyway? Johnson's hands are already pretty much tied from the votes held in the quickfire sessions last week. Obviously Johnson being humiliated yet again in the courts (and best of all, by Jocko upstarts) is a good thing and there's a constitutional issue at stake as well, but bringing it back just for four more weeks of rehashing the same debate lines may not play well in the longer term. 

Maybe the anti no deal majority in parliament could agree on a way forward to solve this instead of just getting endless extension requests and contributing nothing towards an orderly Brexit.

[Detournement]

It's quite pleasing that the Lib Dems have droned on about a People's Vote for ages then when an election looks like coming round they abandon it and gift Labour a monopoly on a second referendum.

Wonderful leadership from Swinson.

 

[ICTJohnboy]

16 minutes ago, Detournement said:

It's quite pleasing that the Lib Dems have droned on about a People's Vote for ages then when an election looks like coming round they abandon it and gift Labour a monopoly on a second referendum.

Wonderful leadership from Swinson.

 

 

At least Swinson knows what she wants.

I honestly don't think there would be any point in another referendum - the result would be more than likely, very close to 50:50 and the arguments would just rage on and on.

 

 

Edited September 18, 2019 by ICTJohnboy

[cyderspaceman]

26 minutes ago, ICTJohnboy said:

 

At least Swinson knows what she wants.

I honestly don't think there would be any point in another referendum - the result would be more than likely, very close to 50:50 and the arguments would just rage on and on.

 

 

I doubt it, more like 20M to 15M but that's just my opinion.  I wouldn't want to see the leave vote decrease, just the remain vote to increase but there must be SOME leavers who now see the error of their ways.

The arguments could rage on and on for all I care, we would still be IN and an independence vote would clinch the deal.

Edited September 18, 2019 by cyderspaceman

[cyderspaceman]

I was reading up on some history and found this mildly amusing

Quote

James I insisted that English and Scots should "join and coalesce together in a sincere and perfect union", but his ambitions were greeted with very little enthusiasm, as one by one members of parliament rushed to defend the ancient name and realm of England. All sorts of legal objections were raised: all laws would have to be renewed and all treaties renegotiated.

Doesn't seem to be bothering them now.  Now that they want to leave a union.

[ICTJohnboy]

1 minute ago, cyderspaceman said:

I doubt it, more like 20M to 15M but that's just my opinion.  I wouldn't want to see the leave vote decrease, just the remain vote to increase but there must be SOME leavers who now see the error of their ways.

It would be good to see that, but I don't think the margin would be as big as that. 

I agree you might think some leave voters must now seeing the error of their ways - I keep asking those I have contact with "Would you still have voted Leave if you had seen that government produced Yellowhammer document during the referendum campaign?"

Believe it or not, they have all said yes to that - often they will qualify that by saying - We just want England to be given back to the English. It's become some kind of a cult thing, and I'm still trying to get my head around it.

If you suggest to any of them that they didn't know, or understand what they were voting for, you're liable to end up with a black eye and a bloody nose.

[cyderspaceman]

19 minutes ago, ICTJohnboy said:

 

Believe it or not, they have all said yes to that - often they will qualify that by saying - We just want England to be given back to the English. It's become some kind of a cult thing, and I'm still trying to get my head around it.

 

I agree with that. Up until April, I lived 6 months in Somerset, 6 months in France (I've now abandoned the UK) and several of the folk I spoke to regularly in the pub would often say 'England this' and 'England that' when it should have been  'UK'. Their appreciation of the UK appeared to be zero. One old geezer (older than me, even) who regularly took his holidays in Jersey,  would not believe me when I told him it isn't part of the UK.  

All in all, I'm glad to be away from them, even though my immediate neighbour was a remainer and a good guy despite being a Tory voter. He did have a Czech wife though. (wid)  

I dearly hope that Scotland gets independence soon.

 

 

Edited September 18, 2019 by cyderspaceman
typo

[Pet Jeden]

19 minutes ago, cyderspaceman said:

I agree with that. Up until April, I lived 6 months in Somerset, 6 months in France (I've now abandoned the UK) and several of the folk I spoke to regularly in the pub would often say 'England this' and 'England that' when it should have been  'UK'. Their appreciation of the UK appeared to be zero. One old geezer (older than me, even) who regularly took his holidays in Jersey,  would not believe me when I told him it isn't part of the UK.  

All in all, I'm glad to be away from them, even though my immediate neighbour was a remainer and a good guy despite being a Tory voter. He did have a Czech wife though. (wid)  

I dearly hope that Scotland gets independence soon.

 

 

So do I. But how the f**k do we expect any Yes vote to be respected? We'll have the Slippery Dems campaigning to revoke. We'll have Labour saying they can only accept a "jobs first" independence. We'll have Phil Hammond and the Changelings claiming that there will be economic catastrophe if Scotland goes it alone - unless we sign an Agreement that negates our independence. We'll have hard-line Britishers claiming that there must, just must be no hint of an actual border etc etc. One third of SNP voters voted Brexit and are sickened by the way MPs and the EU have behaved. The case for a calm, sensible, friendly independence has not been helped by the establishment's reaction to the surprise Brexit vote.

[CaspianChris]

One rather sour and bitter Lord it appears, would rather lies be told in court and Boris praised.

My Lord Boris is a fantastic PM,humanitarian and all round human.  The poroguing of Parliament is the correct course of action for him to take .

 

[welshbairn]

So do I. But how the f**k do we expect any Yes vote to be respected? We'll have the Slippery Dems campaigning to revoke. We'll have Labour saying they can only accept a "jobs first" independence. We'll have Phil Hammond and the Changelings claiming that there will be economic catastrophe if Scotland goes it alone - unless we sign an Agreement that negates our independence. We'll have hard-line Britishers claiming that there must, just must be no hint of an actual border etc etc. One third of SNP voters voted Brexit and are sickened by the way MPs and the EU have behaved. The case for a calm, sensible, friendly independence has not been helped by the establishment's reaction to the surprise Brexit vote.

So pretty well exactly the Better Together campaign of 2014. Thankfully this time we'll have the example of Boris's frictionless Irish border to quote.

[ICTJohnboy]

41 minutes ago, cyderspaceman said:

 

I dearly hope that Scotland gets independence soon.

 

 

Don't we all.

Hopefully you'll consider a return to Scotland when Independence Day dawns.

I know I will - in fact I'll probably return to Scotland long before it happens!

[UsedToGoToCentralPark]

European Parliament have voted in favour of giving the UK an extension if it asks for one. 

Contradicts this:

[Detournement]

The Parliament, the Commission and the Council are all different bodies.

[Pet Jeden]

36 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

49 minutes ago, Pet Jeden said:

So do I. But how the f**k do we expect any Yes vote to be respected? We'll have the Slippery Dems campaigning to revoke. We'll have Labour saying they can only accept a "jobs first" independence. We'll have Phil Hammond and the Changelings claiming that there will be economic catastrophe if Scotland goes it alone - unless we sign an Agreement that negates our independence. We'll have hard-line Britishers claiming that there must, just must be no hint of an actual border etc etc. One third of SNP voters voted Brexit and are sickened by the way MPs and the EU have behaved. The case for a calm, sensible, friendly independence has not been helped by the establishment's reaction to the surprise Brexit vote.

So pretty well exactly the Better Together campaign of 2014. Thankfully this time we'll have the example of Boris's frictionless Irish border to quote.

I don’t think the English will be as petty and vindictive about Scottish independence as the EU has been with UK over Brexit. In fact, if the EU had had any say, there would never have been a Brexit referendum allowed. Compare that to Parliament’s relative cooperation with Indyref1. And compare also with the EU’s complete silence over Spain’s outrageous treatment of the Catalan people. European Arrest Warrants for the crime of holding a referendum FFS