DA Baracus Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 6 hours ago, Bob Mahelp said: The Daily Telegraph have an opinion piece today titled ' why can't Boris's critics see him for the Churchillian figure he is ?' Hahahahaha. Both are racist scumbags, so in that regard it's a fitting comparison. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 It will be funny as f**k if Kate Hoey and the DUP save us from Brexit by backing a referendum to kill the deal. https://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/latest-news/kate-hoey-the-brexit-plan-divides-the-uk-so-i-will-not-be-voting-for-it-today-1-9112203 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 (edited) The News Letter is definitely the place to go to put your finger on the pulse of Ulster Proddom's political thought. My only question is how on earth she didn't see this coming when there have been well-publicised opinion surveys showing that Conservative activists in England would prefer to lose Scotland and/or NI from the UK to not having a hard Brexit? I guess people with a nationalist mindset tend to assume that more people are true believers in their imagined community than is really the case and have naively assumed that when Tories wave the Union flag they mean it the same way that people in Belfast do during an Orange walk. Edited October 20, 2019 by LongTimeLurker 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jedi Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 Even if they could find the numbers to vote through a 2nd Ref which I doubt, chances are when it comes around, probably next summer, that it would be a narrow Remain win (maybe even 52-48). All fine in the short term but the issue won't go away...the election after that would be dominated by Tories campaigning for another Ref to Leave. Cameron is ultimately to blame for letting the genie out of the bottle in the first place. Should never have called one in the first place. Other point on a 2nd Ref if successful is that it obviously kills off any Indy Ref 2 for some time. There is no way that a Section 30 order would be granted with another EU Ref on the table. Whilst the SNP have played the game of trying to stop Brexit by whatever means possible it could still backfire spectacularly with regard to Scotland if either a 2nd Ref or less likely a revocation of A50 comes to pass. Any situation whereby the UK remains in the EU kicks Independence into the long grass for a very long time. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTJohnboy Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 32 minutes ago, Jedi said: Even if they could find the numbers to vote through a 2nd Ref which I doubt, chances are when it comes around, probably next summer, that it would be a narrow Remain win (maybe even 52-48). All fine in the short term but the issue won't go away...the election after that would be dominated by Tories campaigning for another Ref to Leave. Cameron is ultimately to blame for letting the genie out of the bottle in the first place. Should never have called one in the first place. Think you could be right about all that. My question is, are the great British public ready for another 6 months of referendum campaigning? What messages will appear on the buses this time? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beefybake Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 38 minutes ago, Jedi said: Even if they could find the numbers to vote through a 2nd Ref which I doubt, chances are when it comes around, probably next summer, that it would be a narrow Remain win (maybe even 52-48). All fine in the short term but the issue won't go away...the election after that would be dominated by Tories campaigning for another Ref to Leave. Cameron is ultimately to blame for letting the genie out of the bottle in the first place. Should never have called one in the first place. Other point on a 2nd Ref if successful is that it obviously kills off any Indy Ref 2 for some time. There is no way that a Section 30 order would be granted with another EU Ref on the table. Whilst the SNP have played the game of trying to stop Brexit by whatever means possible it could still backfire spectacularly with regard to Scotland if either a 2nd Ref or less likely a revocation of A50 comes to pass. Any situation whereby the UK remains in the EU kicks Independence into the long grass for a very long time. Given that there always has been the anti-EU gene in the Tory party, a lot of what contributed to the result of the 2016 referendum is the after effects of the 2007/8 financial crash, and the austerity/ideological policies followed thereafter. As in... blame others...., Europe, the immigrants etc, etc. Labour were not innocents in all this. But just about anyone other than the Tory/Brexit party in future government would reduce the pressure for future Brexits. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTJohnboy Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 2 minutes ago, beefybake said: Given that there always has been the anti-EU gene in the Tory party, a lot of what contributed to the result of the 2016 referendum is the after effects of the 2007/8 financial crash, and the austerity/ideological policies followed thereafter. As in... blame others...., Europe, the immigrants etc, etc. Labour were not innocents in all this. But just about anyone other than the Tory/Brexit party in future government would reduce the pressure for future Brexits. There is that element in the Labour party too. It's called Corbyn. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beefybake Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 18 minutes ago, ICTJohnboy said: There is that element in the Labour party too. It's called Corbyn. Corbyn is the guy that, at least in England, gave it back it's honesty. I wonder how many of the a*seholes who voted with the Tories for health cuts are still MP's. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacksgranda Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 36 minutes ago, ICTJohnboy said: Think you could be right about all that. My question is, are the great British public ready for another 6 months of referendum campaigning? What messages will appear on the buses this time? "Out of service due to Brexit/being in the EU"/ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 1 hour ago, Jedi said: Even if they could find the numbers to vote through a 2nd Ref which I doubt, ... If it is whipped by Labour this time and the Lib Dems, SNP, Greens and DUP are all on board it won't be too far off. At that point why would at least some of the Tories that got booted out by Boris not be willing to give it a whirl? In the final analysis a vote on a clearly set out plan is the democratic way to settle this. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpetmonster Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 What messages will appear on the buses this time?Vote leave and the 99p video of this will be discounted to 50p? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, LongTimeLurker said: The News Letter is definitely the place to go to put your finger on the pulse of Ulster Proddom's political thought. My only question is how on earth she didn't see this coming when there have been well-publicised opinion surveys showing that Conservative activists in England would prefer to lose Scotland and/or NI from the UK to not having a hard Brexit? I guess people with a nationalist mindset tend to assume that more people are true believers in their imagined community than is really the case and have naively assumed that when Tories wave the Union flag they mean it the same way that people in Belfast do during an Orange walk. The ERG were always all about deregulation and used the DUP as useful idiots. Hopefully this debacle will spur NI Unionists to find a more progressive voice, I doubt the UU are up to the task though, they're already criticising the DUP for not being staunch enough. A realignment away from the duplicitous Tories would be good for everyone imo. I think the DUP were gambling on a hard border stopping the gradual integration of the all Irish economy, and were willing for their citizens to pay the economic and social costs, however it turned out. Edited October 20, 2019 by welshbairn 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Wilson Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 5 hours ago, Lofarl said: I think the biggest problem with a second referendum may be the assumption that remain will win and many people will not bother to vote and we will be in the exact same mess. Leavers will be out in force to vote. Remainers not so much. We should have two more, make it the best of three. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 16 minutes ago, Sergeant Wilson said: We should have two more, make it the best of three. A decider between Tommy Robinson and Owen Jones with lead lined handbags. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTJohnboy Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 1 hour ago, welshbairn said: The ERG were always all about deregulation and used the DUP as useful idiots. Hopefully this debacle will spur NI Unionists to find a more progressive voice, I doubt the UU are up to the task though, they're already criticising the DUP for not being staunch enough. A realignment away from the duplicitous Tories would be good for everyone imo. I think the DUP were gambling on a hard border stopping the gradual integration of the all Irish economy, and were willing for their citizens to pay the economic and social costs, however it turned out. Hard to imagine anything else they could be used for. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 Couldn't buy a shag in brothel. Useless twats. Reminds me of the comedy about civil servants organising the London Olympics. Leave will wipe the floor with them in a referendum if they're allowed to have anything to do with the campaign. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/oct/20/peoples-vote-split-by-power-struggle-at-crucial-time-for-alliance 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highland Capital Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 Her on the right seems to get involved with everything, despite not being on telly in years. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highland Capital Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 1 minute ago, MixuFixit said: June 'wid till the heat death of the universe' Sarpong? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 Was it Channel 4 that Sarpong used to do ident voiceovers for? Made me want to take a knitting needle to my eardrums. Her pronunciation of "Goldfrapp" was the worst. Gohphwah, FFS. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 I’m assuming that Bercow will not allow Johnson to put his unamended bill to the House for a second time. It’s being suggested that the EU will approve an extension of three months that can be curtailed if legislation passes. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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