New clubs in the East of Scotland

[FairWeatherFan]

17 minutes ago, Pyramidic said:

Agreed. Regionalisation would be essential at Tier 9 if all the East Juniors move across. Would 3 smaller conferences work at that level? 

3 way split could probably work since there would be a glut of Borders and Tayside teams with the Lothians/FIfe in the middle. Just about number of games.

Based on current EoSFL & East Juniors you'd have 31 teams below 3x16 leagues. You've then got the possibility of the next Inverkeithing/Edinburgh South to bump those numbers up over time.

[Burnieman]

It all depends who is willing to compromise and identify a sensible way forward - HL, LL, EOSFL and Tayside clubs themselves. Sadly real leadership is lacking from the SFA to help resolve the issue.

The LL and EoS don't need to compromise on anything. The LL have made it clear in the past that they abide by the dividing line, and the EoS - whilst willing to consider applications from anyone - would probably go along with the demarcation line as well. Luncarty were a unique case as we know.

I can't see there being much desire for EoS clubs in the Lothians and Borders to travel to Angus for league games (vice versa?) There was no desire in the Juniors for that either.

There was an opportunity to re-work the EoS structure regionally to accommodate all East Region Junior clubs, as you know I posted something up here a while back, but that opportunity has passed.

[leomessi1984]

Cupar Hearts looking to make the step up next season by all accounts. Would be a decent addition. Some very good players there right now with the likes of McBride & Sibanda.

[FairWeatherFan]

2 minutes ago, leomessi1984 said:

Cupar Hearts looking to make the step up next season by all accounts. Would be a decent addition. Some very good players there right now with the likes of McBride & Sibanda.

Didn't they do a link up with someone in the last year? That's the last I heard about them and people speculated about it leading somewhere down the line.

[Burnieman]

18 minutes ago, leomessi1984 said:

Cupar Hearts looking to make the step up next season by all accounts. Would be a decent addition. Some very good players there right now with the likes of McBride & Sibanda.

Does their ground meet requirements? never been.

[LongTimeLurker]

19 minutes ago, leomessi1984 said:

Cupar Hearts looking to make the step up next season by all accounts. Would be a decent addition. Some very good players there right now with the likes of McBride & Sibanda.

Guess Austin MacPhee has more time on his hands again these days for his "AM Soccer Club". They were said to be interested in doing a Broomhill Sports Club type application where the LL was concerned at one point and are now very much involved with Cupar Hearts.

http://cupar-hearts.co.uk/category/season-2019-2020/

[Pyramidic]

1 hour ago, Burnieman said:

The LL and EoS don't need to compromise on anything. The LL have made it clear in the past that they abide by the dividing line, and the EoS - whilst willing to consider applications from anyone - would probably go along with the demarcation line as well. Luncarty were a unique case as we know.

I can't see there being much desire for EoS clubs in the Lothians and Borders to travel to Angus for league games (vice versa?) There was no desire in the Juniors for that either.

There was an opportunity to re-work the EoS structure regionally to accommodate all East Region Junior clubs, as you know I posted something up here a while back, but that opportunity has passed.

As always BM has his finger on the pulse and most importantly has informed connections. 

East Region Junior clubs via the ERJFA had a wonderful opportunity en masse to work with the EOSFL on re-structuring. That opportunity was unfortunately spurned. The boat has sailed and I can now see it is most unlikely that the boat will turn around. A life buoy ring may be on offer to Tayport and Scone Thistle but no more.

The Tayside clubs must now swim in another direction towards the North Region clubs and together construct a strong life raft/boat in HL seas. If they do not they will continue to flounder outside the pyramid.

Hope I have read the situation correctly.

[Burnieman]

1 minute ago, Pyramidic said:

As always BM has his finger on the pulse and most importantly has informed connections. 

East Region Junior clubs via the ERJFA had a wonderful opportunity en masse to work with the EOSFL on re-structuring. That opportunity was unfortunately spurned. The boat has sailed and I can now see it is most unlikely that the boat will turn around. A life buoy ring may be on offer to Tayport and Scone Thistle but no more.

The Tayside clubs must now swim in another direction towards the North Region clubs and together construct a strong life raft/boat in HL seas. If they do not they will continue to flounder outside the pyramid.

Hope I have read the situation correctly.

Just for the benefit of the doubt, these are my opinions and hee haw to do with how the EoS Board/clubs may or may not view it.

[Pyramidic]

14 minutes ago, Burnieman said:

Just for the benefit of the doubt, these are my opinions and hee haw to do with how the EoS Board/clubs may or may not view it.

In response I suppose I could have added that the EOSFL clubs could always vote to turn the boat around to pick up the Tayside survivors but such a scenario has become increasingly unlikely.

[FairWeatherFan]

6 minutes ago, Pyramidic said:

In response I suppose I could have added that the EOSFL clubs could always vote to turn the boat around to pick up the Tayside survivors but such a scenario has become increasingly unlikely.

To keep that metaphor going. The Tayside teams first have to shout for help to get the attention of the passing ship.

Right now, it's a bit more like the man on top of their house during a flood saying no to help as "God will save me". The initial PWG meetings there was the suggestion of new West & Tayside leagues. Then there was at least one meeting between EoS & the East Region. Then there was over a month's notice giving by the Fife teams & Luncarty that they were applying to the EoS after the PWG had collapsed. As things got worse there were chances to change their situation. 

[LongTimeLurker]

28 minutes ago, Pyramidic said:

In response I suppose I could have added that the EOSFL clubs could always vote to turn the boat around to pick up the Tayside survivors but such a scenario has become increasingly unlikely.

A Dundee club needs to put an application in to find out for sure what would actually happen if the EoS membership ever voted on it. They are only two or three miles over the boundary from Tayport so Luncarty (a few hundred yards north of the line of latitude in the Perth area) isn't necessarily as unique in logistical terms as is being implied above. If Jeanfield in Perth isn't an issue, it is difficult to see from a map of Scotland why Downfield in Dundee would be mission impossible for anyone:

Edited December 23, 2020 by LongTimeLurker

[Burnieman]

Let's all  just remember the "Highland Boundary Fault" isn't the demarcation line just to avoid confusion.  It's irrelevant.

Jeanfield are south of the HL/LL line, the Dundee/Angus/Perthshire clubs are north of the line. The only two clubs in the Tayside Juniors that are south of the line are Tayport and Scone Thistle.

[FairWeatherFan]

12 minutes ago, Burnieman said:

Let's all  just remember the "Highland Boundary Fault" isn't the demarcation line just to avoid confusion.  It's irrelevant.

Jeanfield are south of the HL/LL line, the Dundee/Angus/Perthshire clubs are north of the line. The only two clubs in the Tayside Juniors that are south of the line are Tayport and Scone Thistle.

All that needs known about the line is that it was clearly drawn with the intention of Dundee clubs to the North. They didn't care about anything else. Which is why it cuts right through Luncarty. 

Which is a concept that predates the Lowland League actually existing. 

Highland League signed up for it. Said all the right things about Lochee United and Broughty Athletic applying if they were licensed. There's then been radio silence since from both parties officially as Tayside has sought acceptance to the Lowland League. 

They probably did nothing last summer hoping Brechin's attempt to scrap the boundary entirely passed. 

 

[Cyclizine]

With the PWG disbanded, it's up to the Tayside clubs to decide on their future. At the moment, they don't have a recognised body that negotiates for the lot of them, other than the ERJFA. In a way, if the rump West Lothian juniors move to the EoSFL, then the ERJFA becomes the de facto "Midland League" so often mentioned (possibly a way for some of the East Junior blazers to save a bit of face...)

I don't think it's up to the Highland League to offer a solution. Their mandate is to be the Tier 5 league above the Tay boundary which means all member clubs must be licenced.

The NCL and NRJFA are in discussions about becoming Tier 6 feeders in the North. It's here the North of Tay clubs need to look, either joining up with the North Region or negotiating to be a third North feeder. A licenced club, above the boundary line, applying to the HFL would have to be accepted. The HFL risks its status as a Tier 5 league if not.

As much as LTL loves banging on about Luncarty, it is clear they are in a unique geographical situation. I cannot see the EoSFL accepting a North of Tay club. I might be wrong about this, but it opens a huge can of worms for them with the fixed boundary. Perhaps one of them needs to try it and see. Although rumour suggests this has already happened and a polite refusal given.

 

Edited December 23, 2020 by Cyclizine

[Ginaro]

6 hours ago, FairWeatherFan said:

Didn't they do a link up with someone in the last year? That's the last I heard about them and people speculated about it leading somewhere down the line.

6 hours ago, Burnieman said:

Does their ground meet requirements? never been.

They basically became the adult team for AM Soccer. Their ground is part of a larger playing field at Duffus Park, it has a railing around the pitch but nothing separating it from the two rugby pitches - both of which are close and would make it difficult to add a boundary fence.

As for Luncarty's situation, the boundary can easily be moved to from 56.4513 to 56.46 which would include their park and not have any affect on any other club (unless someone wanted to build a licensed ground next to Dundee airport).

[Burnieman]

They basically became the adult team for AM Soccer. Their ground is part of a larger playing field at Duffus Park, it has a railing around the pitch but nothing separating it from the two rugby pitches - both of which are close and would make it difficult to add a boundary fence.
As for Luncarty's situation, the boundary can easily be moved to from 56.4513 to 56.46 which would include their park and not have any affect on any other club (unless someone wanted to build a licensed ground next to Dundee airport).

Had a look on Google maps, they'd need quite a bit of work to become EoS compliant by the look of it. I wonder if sharing with Howe of Fife is an option, just need a fence covering.

[Ginaro]

2 hours ago, Burnieman said:

2 hours ago, Ginaro said:

They basically became the adult team for AM Soccer. Their ground is part of a larger playing field at Duffus Park, it has a railing around the pitch but nothing separating it from the two rugby pitches - both of which are close and would make it difficult to add a boundary fence.
As for Luncarty's situation, the boundary can easily be moved to from 56.4513 to 56.46 which would include their park and not have any affect on any other club (unless someone wanted to build a licensed ground next to Dundee airport).

Had a look on Google maps, they'd need quite a bit of work to become EoS compliant by the look of it. I wonder if sharing with Howe of Fife is an option, just need a fence covering.

Not sure the pitch would cope with that. If there was no 2ndXV game on at the same time then they could put up a temporary fence at a distance, similar to Inverkeithing. Bigger problem is the railing on the other side is right at the car park, which would need to be eaten into. At least there's floodlights though.

Hopefully it can be done as 6/6 +28 in the Fife Amateur League and 3rd as AM Soccer in the last two seasons shows they should be ready to step up.

[FairWeatherFan]

10 hours ago, Ginaro said:

As for Luncarty's situation, the boundary can easily be moved to from 56.4513 to 56.46 which would include their park and not have any affect on any other club (unless someone wanted to build a licensed ground next to Dundee airport).

You jest but what's this? Zoom in...

Pesky students!!!

[LongTimeLurker]

The possible Dundee airport anomaly (when I have raised it in the past the Dutch guy from Lochee has claimed the line is a stone's throw south and I could never be bothered checking if he was right) and what happens once you start to go west of Invergowrie shows how absurd the use of a line of latitude was.

There were no EoS rules that stopped Luncarty entering with a registered ground north of the line because the only rule that exists anywhere on this applies only to the relegation of Club 42 from the SPFL, so it really does boil down to how EoS clubs would vote at the AGM if a Dundee club put an application in.

Edited December 24, 2020 by LongTimeLurker

[patriot1]

9 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

The possible Dundee airport anomaly (when I have raised it in the past the Dutch guy from Lochee has claimed the line is a stone's throw south and I could never be bothered checking if he was right) and what happens once you start to go west of Invergowrie shows how absurd the use of a line of latitude was.

There were no EoS rules that stopped Luncarty entering with a registered ground north of the line because the only rule that exists anywhere on this applies only to the relegation of Club 42 from the SPFL, so it really does boil down to how EoS clubs would vote at the AGM if a Dundee club put an application in.

2nd paragraph is spot on in it's entirety.