Andy groundhopper Posted January 1, 2021 Share Posted January 1, 2021 21 hours ago, DiegoDiego said: If Dalbeattie can handle the extra traveling I'm sure Clydebank and Kilwinning will be able to cope. I was jumping on another post about the current East/North current junior clubs and the possibility of another league being set up to cater for that side of Scotland. Think all the West clubs will be happy to progress toward the spfl promised land ! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiegoDiego Posted January 1, 2021 Share Posted January 1, 2021 I was jumping on another post about the current East/North current junior clubs and the possibility of another league being set up to cater for that side of Scotland. Think all the West clubs will be happy to progress toward the spfl promised land ! Ah, got you now! Apologies. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bestsinceslicebread Posted January 1, 2021 Share Posted January 1, 2021 On 29/12/2020 at 12:33, Burnieman said: I guess it's hitting home just what a mistake it was to be "loyal" to the SJFA. Broxburn and Penicuik last season, Tranent this season, Dundonald on telly (who very nearly decided against moving) and one from Bonnyrigg/Bo'ness playing at Dens Park. Whitburn, Armadale, Fauldhouse and Bathgate all had the potential to emulate them. The first two are big clubs who, if run well, can get hundreds through the gate and compete at the top end of the Premier. Now they're miles behind. How much are Dundonald Bluebell expected to make from last week's televised match against Queens Park. If its a lot then obviously it will make the rest of the junior teams sit up and take notice of the potential possibilities 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parsforlife Posted January 1, 2021 Share Posted January 1, 2021 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Bestsinceslicebread said: How much are Dundonald Bluebell expected to make from last week's televised match against Queens Park. If its a lot then obviously it will make the rest of the junior teams sit up and take notice of the potential possibilities the early round tv money is £3-4k I believe Edited January 1, 2021 by parsforlife 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Patterson Posted January 1, 2021 Share Posted January 1, 2021 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Bestsinceslicebread said: How much are Dundonald Bluebell expected to make from last week's televised match against Queens Park. If its a lot then obviously it will make the rest of the junior teams sit up and take notice of the potential possibilities @Skyline Drifter is the poster to ask on this, but I believe it's around £12k in total. Nowhere near as much as it used to be, but not a insignificant amount. Would be surprised if any teams are still left in the Junior Leagues by 2025. Edited January 1, 2021 by ArabAuslander 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimi Shandrix Posted January 1, 2021 Share Posted January 1, 2021 11 minutes ago, ArabAuslander said: @Skyline Drifter is the poster to ask on this, but I believe it's around £12k in total. Nowhere near as much as it used to be, but not a insignificant amount. Would be surprised if any teams are still left in the Junior Leagues by 2025. There wont be. Not sure it'll take that long to be honest. Can't speak for the Lothians teams but I don't think any of the Tayside teams are still junior because they feel any great attachment to the junior cause. As soon as a system is in place you'll get the same situation as happened in the west. A few will jump then everybody else will have to follow whether they want to or not. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted January 1, 2021 Share Posted January 1, 2021 2 hours ago, parsforlife said: the early round tv money is £3-4k I believe The early BBC Scotland games I think are around that. Then when it gets shown on Premier(?) now or it's around the £30k mark. Once upon a time I think a TV game was meant to be £82.5k. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 10 hours ago, Jimi Shandrix said: ...A few will jump then everybody else will have to follow whether they want to or not. Hopefully Tayport's EoS move will prompt other Dundee area clubs to put in applications as well, so there will be clarity on whether there is a viable LL catchment pyramid entry pathway available for clubs that are only a few minutes further than the bridge. Luncarty got in despite having a registered ground north of the line of latitude for Club 42 relegation. Brechin City getting relegated to the HL at the end of this season (if they fail to stagger past the equally woeful Albion Rovers) would probably help resolve matters as well where more distant Angus clubs are concerned that are in Montrose Roselea sort of territory. The current HL tier 6 negotiations do extend into northern Angus. If the HL doesn't want the Dundee area and EoS clubs are willing to take the clubs from there, maybe there won't be a one size fits all solution. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pipedreamer Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 13 hours ago, Bestsinceslicebread said: How much are Dundonald Bluebell expected to make from last week's televised match against Queens Park. If its a lot then obviously it will make the rest of the junior teams sit up and take notice of the potential possibilities Going on last seasons numbers, about £2k in tv payments from the bbc/sfa. I think the tv payments have gone down this season from round 3 also as it was £36k for a televised game in rd4 onwards previously. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pipedreamer Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 1 hour ago, LongTimeLurker said: Hopefully Tayport's EoS move will prompt other Dundee area clubs to put in applications as well, so there will be clarity on whether there is a viable LL catchment pyramid entry pathway available for clubs that are only a few minutes further than the bridge. Luncarty got in despite having a registered ground north of the line of latitude for Club 42 relegation. Brechin City getting relegated to the HL at the end of this season (if they fail to stagger past the equally woeful Albion Rovers) would probably help resolve matters as well where more distant Angus clubs are concerned that are in Montrose Roselea sort of territory. The current HL tier 6 negotiations do extend into northern Angus. If the HL doesn't want the Dundee area and EoS clubs are willing to take the clubs from there, maybe there won't be a one size fits all solution. If the Highland League objects to clubs in their catchment being a feeder to their league then would the sfa step in and remove them from the pyramid playoff as they would no longer be complying with the rules they agreed on. Dundee clubs saying they are in no mans land cos the HL doesn’t want them is nonsense. They’ve sat with theyre heads up their arse hoping someone would force them into LL catchment rather than engaging with the HL to sort a solution, they already play in a cup with clubs in the NRSJFA so this bleating on about being hard done by is pish. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigkillie Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 The early BBC Scotland games I think are around that. Then when it gets shown on Premier(?) now or it's around the £30k mark. Once upon a time I think a TV game was meant to be £82.5k.I think this reduction is because more of the money is being chucked into the overall prize pool, which I think is fairer. The TV fee should basically only exist to compensate the clubs involved for the loss of income through the gate. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spyro Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 4 hours ago, pipedreamer said: If the Highland League objects to clubs in their catchment being a feeder to their league then would the sfa step in and remove them from the pyramid playoff as they would no longer be complying with the rules they agreed on. Dundee clubs saying they are in no mans land cos the HL doesn’t want them is nonsense. They’ve sat with theyre heads up their arse hoping someone would force them into LL catchment rather than engaging with the HL to sort a solution, they already play in a cup with clubs in the NRSJFA so this bleating on about being hard done by is pish. Nail on the head. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 (edited) 5 hours ago, pipedreamer said: If the Highland League objects to clubs in their catchment being a feeder to their league then would the sfa step in and remove them from the pyramid playoff as they would no longer be complying with the rules they agreed on.... Think ye ken fine weel that no is the answer to that and that SFA officeholders saw no problem with the entirety of the east region winding up as a tier 6 feeder to the LL, so obviously don't see the Tay Bridge boundary as in any way definitive and final. Also interesting to note that sorting out where Brechin go if relegated, wound up boiling down to something as petty as compensation for extra travel: On 09/05/2020 at 12:45, pipedreamer said: Yes, the lowland league was told by the spfl that if they didn’t alter their rules to allow Brechin to drop into the league If relegated, that they would lose their places in spfl competitions (league cup and challenge cup). The spfl was asked to supply funding to compensate clubs for the increased travel to Angus but point blank refused. Since it shows that the LL were only looking for some relatively minor concessions before signing off on a Club 42 relegation rule change that would have moved Dundee into their catchment, and that the SPFL weren't exactly backing Brechin to the hilt if unwilling to compromise on that when their bluff was called on the cup competition participation. Edited January 2, 2021 by LongTimeLurker 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pipedreamer Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 2 hours ago, LongTimeLurker said: Think ye ken fine weel that no is the answer to that and that SFA officeholders saw no problem with the entirety of the east region winding up as a tier 6 feeder to the LL, so obviously don't see the Tay Bridge boundary as in any way definitive and final. Also interesting to note that sorting out where Brechin go if relegated, wound up boiling down to something as petty as compensation for extra travel: Since it shows that the LL were only looking for some relatively minor concessions before signing off on a Club 42 relegation rule change that would have moved Dundee into their catchment, and that the SPFL weren't exactly backing Brechin to the hilt if unwilling to compromise on that when their bluff was called on the cup competition participation. Since then and the nonsense that ensued the SPFL have been told that no change in the rules will happen and The boundary is still in place and Brechin if relegated would go to the HL. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stag Nation Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 25 minutes ago, pipedreamer said: Since then and the nonsense that ensued the SPFL have been told that no change in the rules will happen and The boundary is still in place and Brechin if relegated would go to the HL. AIUI Brechin's reluctance to go to the HL was because they tend to rely on players from the Central Belt. How could they abandon such a successful strategy? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 1 hour ago, Stag Nation said: AIUI Brechin's reluctance to go to the HL was because they tend to rely on players from the Central Belt. How could they abandon such a successful strategy? It got them to the second tier in the not so distant past, so that doesn't stand up to close scrutiny. We are where we are because: (i) The HL (Cove Rangers excepted) saw the pyramid concept as a central belt issue that had nothing much to do with them when it was implemented and hence never seriously expected to have to take on Dundee junior clubs. (ii) The Angus SPFL clubs were way too complacent about potentially being relegated in future when the Club 42 rule was being drafted and hence did not object to being in the HL catchment at that point. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parsforlife Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 (edited) 17 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said: It got them to the second tier in the not so distant past, so that doesn't stand up to close scrutiny. We are where we are because: (i) The HL (Cove Rangers excepted) saw the pyramid concept as a central belt issue that had nothing much to do with them when it was implemented and hence never seriously expected to have to take on Dundee junior clubs. (ii) The Angus SPFL clubs were way too complacent about potentially being relegated in future when the Club 42 rule was being drafted and hence did not object to being in the HL catchment at that point. Angus complacency or not (Montrose didn’t seem as complacent). The HL signed up to the pyramid in full knowledge they would have clubs potentially joining them from anywhere north of the Tay. They also weren’t bystanders waiting on the lowland area clubs working it out. They had fair few strong conversations about joining the pyramid and what it would look like( including choosing to join as a unit over the SFA creating a 10 club highland league in which clubs would apply to join) Edited January 2, 2021 by parsforlife 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 The HL ultimately had to be cajoled by Stewart Regan into joining the pyramid with Alan McRae pulling the strings and insisted on keeping their existing 18 club format as a condition of doing so. Very few people were expecting junior clubs to join the senior grade to the extent that they subsequently have. As things stand the HL is only negotiating with the NCL and north region. They were happy with the idea of Brechin City or Forfar Athletic possibly joining one day as they probably saw that as a net gain but that does not appear to extend to possibility of regularly playing against Lochee United and Broughty Athletic in future. The HL have to sign off on tier 6 feeders as changes to their own league constitution are involved. This isn't something the SFA can dictate any more than they could force the EoS to accept the east region as a fellow tier 6 feeder to the LL when there was a rule change involved that could only be made with EoS approval. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parsforlife Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 (edited) 12 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said: Very few people were expecting junior clubs to join the senior grade to the extent that they subsequently have. I can’t see that being true. LL was at the beginning and always has been since been very open about Junior sides being part of it. They have always been able to apply and join and were given plenty of info about it. The fact a handful of self indulgent arseholes actively prevented such info coming through, put a lot of effort campaigning against the pyramid and that so many fell for their lies was a far bigger surprise. Edited January 2, 2021 by parsforlife 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 26 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said: The HL ultimately had to be cajoled by Stewart Regan into joining the pyramid with Alan McRae pulling the strings and insisted on keeping their existing 18 club format as a condition of doing so. Very few people were expecting junior clubs to join the senior grade to the extent that they subsequently have. More opinion as fact. As for why they insisted coming in as 18. Where do the 8 other clubs go? The SFA from Smith to Regan and McLeish's report had their nice little idea on paper of 10 team leagues with everyone signing up underneath. Except the reality was not everyone was interested (Juniors) and they've then got to work with what they've got. Hell, by the time the pyramid was becoming a reality, 10 team leagues were done as far as most of those planning it were concerned. The SPFL was going to be 12-12-18 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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