The Vaughan Derby: Sons v Raith

[Jan Vojáček]

3 minutes ago, DumbartonTheSons said:

I just don't see a possible reason for them not doing so.

We're in such a mess right now and it's only going to continue under Aitken.

I'm presuming he's not stepped down post-match, now it's up to the board.

 

There are two reasons why we won't sack him imo. The first is money. We don't have very much, and I'd imagine it'll cost a decent whack to terminate his contract early.

The second is options. Assuming Duffy wouldn't take it there's no 'plug-in-and-play' alternative out there, and any managerial appointment comes with an element of risk.

To be brutally honest, it's now a gamble worth taking in my opinion. The home end was pretty quiet pre-match today, and I there must've only been about 100 folk left by full-time. It's like watching something disintegrate in front of your eyes, and it's damn painful. An ever growing number of people seem to be pretty vocal about not coming back until Stevie is emptied too.

[FifeSons]

There’s only one thing we could do that would be worse than not sacking Aitken. Appointing Durrant.

[O'Kelly Isley III]

I just don't see a possible reason for them not doing so.

We're in such a mess right now and it's only going to continue under Aitken.

I'm presuming he's not stepped down post-match, now it's up to the board.

Today was a salutory example of two clubs headed in very differing directions. Raith looked like a Championship side whilst we continue to look like a team in free fall. In those circumstances the result was hardly a surprise.

The hellish toll exacted by Dumbarton's off-field travails over the summer is now being written large on the park, and there will be more to come. Stevie Aitken will no doubt walk and the Directors will take flak, but rest assured other b*****ds skulking in the shadows have contributed hugely to all of this.

As for Raith, they were a grand example of teamwork, fitness, cohesion and everything you want from your team.

[Beastie Russell]

6 minutes ago, O'Kelly Isley III said:

As for Raith, they were a grand example of teamwork, fitness, cohesion and everything you want from your team.
 

This week aye, previous weeks naw.

[Boghead ranter]

7 hours ago, Boghead ranter said:

Will Lewis Vaughan wave to Aitken's Army  today, and will they get upset if he doesn't?

Well, did he?

[FifeSons]

13 minutes ago, O'Kelly Isley III said:

Today was a salutory example of two clubs headed in very differing directions. Raith looked like a Championship side whilst we continue to look like a team in free fall. In those circumstances the result was hardly a surprise.

The hellish toll exacted by Dumbarton's off-field travails over the summer is now being written large on the park, and there will be more to come. Stevie Aitken will no doubt walk and the Directors will take flak, but rest assured other b*****ds skulking in the shadows have contributed hugely to all of this.

As for Raith, they were a grand example of teamwork, fitness, cohesion and everything you want from your team.
 

Will he no doubt walk? Of his own accord?

[DumbartonTheSons]

There are two reasons why we won't sack him imo. The first is money. We don't have very much, and I'd imagine it'll cost a decent whack to terminate his contract early.
The second is options. Assuming Duffy wouldn't take it there's no 'plug-in-and-play' alternative out there, and any managerial appointment comes with an element of risk.
To be brutally honest, it's now a gamble worth taking in my opinion. The home end was pretty quiet pre-match today, and I there must've only been about 100 folk left by full-time. It's like watching something disintegrate in front of your eyes, and it's damn painful. An ever growing number of people seem to be pretty vocal about not coming back until Stevie is emptied too.

I appreciate that money may be an issue. But surely this would be a prime situation for one of the mystery investors to be consulted. The need now for financial assistance is far greater than another 'externally financed' signing a la Forbes or Loy.

Your 'plug-in' argument doesn't sit well with me albeit I understand what you're meaning. Not having a guaranteed better replacement cannot possibly be an argument for sticking with the status quo.

A new manager may well be a gamble, but nobody can tell me we can get any worse.

I think Duffy would be interested for what it's worth, but hey, we've a fair bit to go before that's a discussion worth having...

Today was a salutory example of two clubs headed in very differing directions. Raith looked like a Championship side whilst we continue to look like a team in free fall. In those circumstances the result was hardly a surprise.

The hellish toll exacted by Dumbarton's off-field travails over the summer is now being written large on the park, and there will be more to come. Stevie Aitken will no doubt walk and the Directors will take flak, but rest assured other b*****ds skulking in the shadows have contributed hugely to all of this.

As for Raith, they were a grand example of teamwork, fitness, cohesion and everything you want from your team.

There absolutely are background issues which are hindering us, I and I'm sure others appreciate that, however none of those affect the direction of the team, the drive and confidence of the manager, the effort of the players and the shambolic tactical decisions. All of those are affected by and imposed by Stevie Aitken.

[Frank conner]

Will the sponsors step in to get rid of Aitken?

[DumbartonTheSons]

Will the sponsors step in to get rid of Aitken?

That's kind of what I asked above. Surely now is a time for the board to beg to these investors for a helping hand. We're only going in one direction until we do.

[Broken Algorithms]

The second is options. Assuming Duffy wouldn't take it there's no 'plug-in-and-play' alternative out there, and any managerial appointment comes with an element of risk.

I know this was mentioned a few weeks back, but there's plenty of young managers who would look at Dumbarton and see their potential. Plenty of folk like Barry Robson who'd fancy it. Also, some like Novo and Donati.

[Jan Vojáček]

1 minute ago, DumbartonTheSons said:

I appreciate that money may be an issue. But surely this would be a prime situation for one of the mystery investors to be consulted. The need now for financial assistance is far greater than another 'externally financed' signing a la Forbes or Loy.

Your 'plug-in' argument doesn't sit well with me albeit I understand what you're meaning. Not having a guaranteed better replacement cannot possibly be an argument for sticking with the status quo.

A new manager may well be a gamble, but nobody can tell me we can get any worse.

I think Duffy would be interested for what it's worth, but hey, we've a fair bit to go before that's a discussion worth having...

 

I fully get that. The 'who else would you get in' line is probably the worst reason possible for keeping someone in a job. From the board's point-of-view I get it though, what if they punt Stevie and appoint a rookie who turns out to be the next Gary Locke? They'll be the ones getting hammered - both financially and by the fans.

When Stevie does leave though whoever we appoint will be a risk. Who knew Ian Murray (a guy who was coaching kids in the US) would be such an upgrade on Alan Adamson? Likewise who knew that Adamson (a guy with no managerial experience, and a very limited playing career) would be able to get so much more out of Jim Chapman's squad?

We're eighth in League One having already been relegated, and now need a win next week to meet the target we set ourselves in a full-time league to avoid relegation. It's not a pretty picture, and I'm sure that there's someone out there who could freshen things up and get more out of this squad. I don't think we're expecting the world, but being able to string together a consistently decent run of form (maybe 5 wins 2 draws and 3 defeats in ten games) would make a huge difference.

[DumbartonTheSons]

I know this was mentioned a few weeks back, but there's plenty of young managers who would look at Dumbarton and see their potential. Plenty of folk like Barry Robson who'd fancy it. Also, some like Novo and Donati.

Absolutely. And while I wouldn't want Novo or Donati anywhere near it, your point is entirely valid.

And nobody can tell me that any manager would would or might be interested (Duffy, for example) would look at our squad and think they're performing to the best of their ability and they couldn't get more out of them if they were manager. Not a chance. We are an attractive proposition for a number of managers. But there needs to be a vacancy for that discussion to progress...

[Jan Vojáček]

3 minutes ago, Broken Algorithms said:

I know this was mentioned a few weeks back, but there's plenty of young managers who would look at Dumbarton and see their potential. Plenty of folk like Barry Robson who'd fancy it. Also, some like Novo and Donati.

I'm shocked we haven't signed him to be honest. About as staunch as it gets.

I'd be interested in us speaking to Donati. I think I mentioned it on here a while back, but I really liked what I saw of him in his interview with Si Ferry. Whether or not he'd be willing to work with a part-time team though could be the deal-breaker.

Robson's based up north I think, so I doubt he'd fancy it. If he's desperate to make a career in management though he could do a lot worse than take on a seriously under-performing side with a squad that should allow us to compete for the playoffs.

[Beachbum]

 

[Wee Sandy]

Noted there were only 756 at today's match, according to Raith Rovers FC site.

Wonder how many were Raith fans?

[Bring Back Paddy Flannery]

There are two reasons why we won't sack him imo. The first is money. We don't have very much, and I'd imagine it'll cost a decent whack to terminate his contract early.
The second is options. Assuming Duffy wouldn't take it there's no 'plug-in-and-play' alternative out there, and any managerial appointment comes with an element of risk.
To be brutally honest, it's now a gamble worth taking in my opinion. The home end was pretty quiet pre-match today, and I there must've only been about 100 folk left by full-time. It's like watching something disintegrate in front of your eyes, and it's damn painful. An ever growing number of people seem to be pretty vocal about not coming back until Stevie is emptied too.

I'd honestly be astounded if Duffy wasn't interested. A certain Sons supporting poster on here told me earlier today there's no chance we could afford Duffy but I just can't see why not.

Say we pay him the same/a little less than we are paying Aitken he would surely fancy it? He seems keen to get back into it based on what he's saying in the media and we are absolutely an attractive job - a squad that is far better than the current league position who have been performing woefully. It's a win win for him because he can't do much worse than Aitken is. Robson and Donati would also interest me and are affordable IMO.

Aitken's pay off would be what? Three month's wages? I don't think that would break the bank. We could also agree a deal whereby we half it and announce that he has resigned rather than been sacked.

I reckon if we really wanted to sack him and appoint a decent replacement we could. I'm just not convinced our board have the balls to act before it's too late.

[Frank conner]

35 minutes ago, DumbartonTheSons said:

 

That's kind of what I asked above. Surely now is a time for the board to beg to these investors for a helping hand. We're only going in one direction until we do.

 

Apologies I didn't read your post just thought with the influence your sponsors must have they would want some return on their investment. 

[FifeSons]

4 minutes ago, Bring Back Paddy Flannery said:

I'd honestly be astounded if Duffy wasn't interested. A certain Sons supporting poster on here told me earlier today there's no chance we could afford Duffy but I just can't see why not.

Say we pay him the same/a little less than we are paying Aitken he would surely fancy it? He seems keen to get back into it based on what he's saying in the media and we are absolutely an attractive job - a squad that is far better than the current league position who have been performing woefully. It's a win win for him because he can't do much worse than Aitken is. Robson and Donati would also interest me and are affordable IMO.

Aitken's pay off would be what? Three month's wages? I don't think that would break the bank. We could also agree a deal whereby we half it and announce that he has resigned rather than been sacked.

I reckon if we really wanted to sack him and appoint a decent replacement we could. I'm just not convinced our board have the balls to act before it's too late.

I’d absolutely love to think Duffy would take it, but I don’t think he would. Just a feeling. But there undoubtedly would be options for something different. They certainly couldn’t do much worse, given we’re currently riding the Cowden Express to L2.

When the ‘who could we get in that’s better’ argument comes up, it’s basically a sign the manager’s time is up.

[Bring Back Paddy Flannery]

Apologies I didn't read your post just thought with the influence your sponsors must have they would want some return on their investment. 

If you are referring to C&G they haven't invested in the squad. They are stadium sponsors. They offer players jobs but that's hardly an investment, they are getting young fit guys to graft on the railways whilst they play part time with us.

If you are referring to the sponsors who paid for the 3 late signings (not C&G as far as I know) then they donated that money knowing fine well an inept, clueless, diddy, who had barely won a league game against credible opposition for the best part of a year, was going to spend it.

[Bring Back Paddy Flannery]

I’d absolutely love to think Duffy would take it, but I don’t think he would. Just a feeling. But there undoubtedly would be options for something different. They certainly couldn’t do much worse, given we’re currently riding the Cowden Express to L2.
When the ‘who could we get in that’s better’ argument comes up, it’s basically a sign the manager’s time is up.

He's hardly getting better offers, why wouldn't he take it? Realisticly we're probably one of the best jobs he could get at this point in time IMO. It's an absolute myth that we're paying peanuts FWIW.