well fan for life Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 Make no mistake, this was a bottle job of the highest order. Our complete lack of any game management is what lost us the game. As soon as it went to 3-1 we collectively lost our head. We've been fairly naive this whole tournament and there's definite scope for upping our shithousery game when we head for the next euros. It was blatantly obvious that a few folk were totally blowing out their arse, particularly Smith, yet we didn't make a sub until the 86th minute. Also the referee was abysmal. A performance that was on par with Andrew Dallas in last year's league cup final. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Moomintroll Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 Scotland deserve to go out.The competence of VAR is a completely different topic. I've said it before, and I'll keep saying it. VAR is a fantastic concept that I am 100% behind, but is horribly put into practice. There are so many things that FIFA could be doing that would prevent confusion, both for officials and fans - big screen replays, timer stopping, challenge system, a GENUINE plan of when to use it - but they insist on adding shitey wee rules like this goalkeeper one (don't get me started on handball) that just enhance confusion. It's almost as if they are deliberately making the system worse.Now if we are getting persnickety about penalties. What about encroachment? Almost every other penalty has a player inside the box as it is being taken. These are rarely retaken, and I certainly can't think of an instance where VAR has led to it being retaken. My point is, you can't enforce some rules and ignore others.And if you think we got shafted... go check the highlights of France v Nigeria.As you said VAR alongside the rule changes are a different topic, however the first few weeks of the EPL are going to be hilarious until they quietly forgot the whole thing & start backing the on field decisions more often than not & scrap the constant nit picking referrals. Sadly, we were 3-0 up last night & did not have the necessary game intelligence to close it down & see the game out, VAR cannot take the blame for that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charger29 Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 Watching it back again, she was likely off her line by 5-10cm. Her foot was in the air (it can be in the air as long as it's in line with the goal) so it makes it difficult to tell from the different camera angles. They had a replay in the VAR room parallel with the goal line. Presumably the VAR people aren't blind and came to the correct decision, just.The main issue for me is the general poor quality of refereeing. It's incredibly off putting when every time you watch a women's game you have to say, "that's one of the worst decisions I've ever seen".There are other mens tournaments played this summer as well. It's not like these rule changes were dumped on women's football as some comments here suggested. Copa America, AfCoN, Gold Cup and Euro u21 are all using the new rules this summer. Not to mention all the leagues which play through the summer and have presumably had there rules changed too. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayrmad Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 I just hope that the staff and players don't all agree with the captain, if you honestly think you played superlyduperly after that then you ain't going to improve on your poor bits. How the lassie at right back lasted so long is beyond me, never mind the goals, she'd have 5 Scottish players in front of her and them proceed to f**k about and lose the ball in their final third, just stay at right back if you can't do it at the other end. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonHMFC Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 1 hour ago, Adam101 said: Anyone know when and where they are flying back into I might head along to the airport Why? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage Henry Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 4 minutes ago, charger29 said: Watching it back again, she was likely off her line by 5-10cm. Her foot was in the air (it can be in the air as long as it's in line with the goal) so it makes it difficult to tell from the different camera angles. They had a replay in the VAR room parallel with the goal line. Presumably the VAR people aren't blind and came to the correct decision, just. The main issue for me is the general poor quality of refereeing. It's incredibly off putting when every time you watch a women's game you have to say, "that's one of the worst decisions I've ever seen". There are other mens tournaments played this summer as well. It's not like these rule changes were dumped on women's football as some comments here suggested. Copa America, AfCoN, Gold Cup and Euro u21 are all using the new rules this summer. Not to mention all the leagues which play through the summer and have presumably had there rules changed too. I don't think the standard of refereeing has been that bad in general. Last night was absolutely terrible, and the France/Nigeria game was a shambles, but at heart it's the handball laws which are ridiculous. You could make a case that the goalkeeper rule is unfair, but at least it's unambiguous. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 6 minutes ago, LondonHMFC said: Why? Why not? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat(The most tip top) Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 Ok,accept the penalty decision but that doesnt explain how the game lost 10 minutes.It takes a particularly shite referee to leave both sides feeling robbed 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayrmad Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 Just now, topcat(The most tip top) said: It takes a particularly shite referee to leave both sides feeling robbed That shouldn't afford our team any excuses, we'd already lost 3 goals and would most likely have lost another if the correct time had been played. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 Just now, topcat(The most tip top) said: It takes a particularly shite referee to leave both sides feeling robbed Stephen Finnie was expert at it, has he taken up a referee coaching role in N.Korea? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage Henry Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 53 minutes ago, craigkillie said: If it worked perfectly then we would have been provided with conclusive evidence that the biggest call of the night was actually correct. If, as appears to be the case, a massive game-changing and tournament-changing decision has been made on the basis of footage from a series of questionable angles, then the system is clearly not working. If they had an angle that actually proved it was right then I suspect FIFA would have shared it by now. Rightly or wrongly, fans aren't entitled to after-the-fact evidence. It'd be helpful, and it'd reflect unusually well on FIFA, but in the end referees don't have to justify their decisions to the fans. The players and staff arguably are, but the fans aren't. It's one of the problems with the way football uses it, as opposed to say, cricket, in which the off-field umpire talks the crowd through his decision making process. Even the NFL has the referees make an announcement on why the call has been made. The trouble with VAR is the expectation that everything used by the referees is shared to the television audience. I'm assuming, like in American sports, this isn't always the case. I'm also assuming that the referee/VAR saw a different angle. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage Henry Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 5 minutes ago, topcat(The most tip top) said: It takes a particularly shite referee to leave both sides feeling robbed Or a very good one. But in this case, you are correct. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottmcleanscontacts Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 Having really thought about this I'm not entirely sure that Kerr is to blame. I think that throughout the team there is some very good players and then there are a few poor players who might be the best of a bad bunch in their position. There's plenty to be positive about. Unlucky and narrow defeats against England and Japan are sure signs of improvement and the way Scotland played for much of the game against Argentina is very encouraging. It just seems to be similar issues with the same players on a regular basis and that was the case in the Jamaica friendly that I went to last month too.Cut out the mistakes and there's a very good side there. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayrmad Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salvo Montalbano Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 I assume that the end of the game will bring back calls for a "play clock" - in American Football the referee can ask for the clock to be reset - so that there would be no confusion about how long should be getting played. On VAR, there are clearly a few issues about whether the "clear and obvious" thing is still an actual thing, about the length of time it takes, about whether referees should get to look again (I think it will take a brave ref to be asked to look at an incident again and stand by their original decision anyway), and about what it is used for. As someone who had been against VAR for a while, I'm not surprised that there are these issues and I'll go further and predict that at some point this season in the English Premier League there will be a goal scored as a direct result of a free kick in an innocuous position being awarded or a throw in being given to the wrong team or a corner given when it should have been a goal kick and almost immediately the manager, players and pundits will be saying "we have VAR, why not use it?" which will then lead to it being used for more and more decisions and the game will get even worse. On the game itself, it's hard to see why changes weren't made sooner, especially at right back and also possibly with Clelland coming on in a forward position (maybe for Evans) to get some fresh legs on, especially after Argentina scored their first. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage Henry Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 8 minutes ago, ayrmad said: That's fairly conclusive. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayrmad Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 16 minutes ago, Savage Henry said: That's fairly conclusive. Yes, it's a 2 second decision once you see it, there needs to be more time spent on the users of VAR to get it right, if done properly it could add to the game and the matchday experience, it's an utter shambles in it's current guise. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charger29 Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 I don't think the standard of refereeing has been that bad in general. Last night was absolutely terrible, and the France/Nigeria game was a shambles, but at heart it's the handball laws which are ridiculous. You could make a case that the goalkeeper rule is unfair, but at least it's unambiguous. I can't say I've watched that many games tbh. Only Scotland games, France v Nigeria and some other highlights. In the last two Scotland games I've seen one of the worst offside calls ever, a ref blowing the whistle to restart the game before the sub was even off the park and at least 2-3 minutes go missing from stoppage time during the most important moment in all their careers.Agreed on the handball rule. They've went the opposite ditection from where they should've got with that. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeadowArab Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 Going these by pictures she was still on the line after the ball was struck. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 (edited) 42 minutes ago, Savage Henry said: That's fairly conclusive. How is it fairly conclusive? Each frame is less than 1/20th of a second! The law doesn't say the keeper can't leave the line until the ball is struck. Alexander was judged to the standard of a false start in a sprint race. We have seen other penalties saved since this rule came in where goalkeepers moved further and earlier which weren't called. Edited June 20, 2019 by Detournement 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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