onecowden Posted November 3, 2019 Share Posted November 3, 2019 You've highlighted the Championship and League One in Scotland as examples where budgets don't translate to success. These are two leagues where the team with by far the largest budget are currently top of the league. In all four SPFL leagues at the moment, the team with the largest budget is top of the league. The Championship is probably the only league where the team with clearly the second largest budget isn't in second place at the moment. I'm sorry but trying to suggest that player budgets are not by far and away the overwhelmingly most important factor in success on the park is utterly illiterate of the facts. the few decent examples that you could come up with to show teams with lower budgets succeeding are drowned by an absolute avalanche of data showing the incredibly close correlation between budgets and performance.This 100% 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Oktober Posted November 3, 2019 Share Posted November 3, 2019 1 hour ago, Gordon EF said: You've highlighted the Championship and League One in Scotland as examples where budgets don't translate to success. These are two leagues where the team with by far the largest budget are currently top of the league. In all four SPFL leagues at the moment, the team with the largest budget is top of the league. The Championship is probably the only league where the team with clearly the second largest budget isn't in second place at the moment. I'm sorry but trying to suggest that player budgets are not by far and away the overwhelmingly most important factor in success on the park is utterly illiterate of the facts. the few decent examples that you could come up with to show teams with lower budgets succeeding are drowned by an absolute avalanche of data showing the incredibly close correlation between budgets and performance. Excellent post @Gordon EF 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamthebam Posted November 3, 2019 Share Posted November 3, 2019 16 hours ago, Muzza81 said: Genuinely thought that report was a wind up. Absolutely baffling that a club sanctions a complete illiterate loony to write their reports. Why not? Ours does... Spoiler GIRUY City Programme Editor 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Minertaur Posted November 4, 2019 Author Share Posted November 4, 2019 That Cove report :lol: No class in defeat and less so in victory apparently. Strange club. They deserved to win though and their midfield and strikers are just a class above most sides in the league. It speaks volumes that we've conceded 11 league goals in 11 games and 6 have come against Cove. We just need to forget it and move on. On a separate note - the hospitality was utterly superb with a decent buffet and plenty beers consumed. Well worth the money and my work colleagues are all wanting to organise another trip down. Well done to the club for running a great day. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marello Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 your arguement is based on a snapshot - anyone who thinks that celtic, united and falkirk (who went top only this past saturday) are home and hosed should have a wander doon their local bookies..with exception of celtic who have had no credible competition for years, how many times in past 5 seasons have the club with biggest budget won their league (and restricting arguement to Scotland which I didn't) - ross county last year, certainly not, montrose certainly not, arbroath certainly not etc etc 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonLichtie Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 1 minute ago, marello said: your arguement is based on a snapshot - anyone who thinks that celtic, united and falkirk (who went top only this past saturday) are home and hosed should have a wander doon their local bookies..with exception of celtic who have had no credible competition for years, how many times in past 5 seasons have the club with biggest budget won their league (and restricting arguement to Scotland which I didn't) - ross county last year, certainly not, montrose certainly not, arbroath certainly not etc etc I think without going into exact figures etc. it would be fair comment to say it's highly likely we had the biggest budget when we won League Two, and the second biggest budget when we won League One. There are of course exceptions to the rule, but if you took the 42 league clubs in Scotland and their positions at the end of each season they would be fairly close to where they 'should' be in terms of outgoings. Also, if a team has the biggest budget in the division their fans, and other fans, should expect them to succeed in being up the top of the division. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon EF Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, marello said: your arguement is based on a snapshot - anyone who thinks that celtic, united and falkirk (who went top only this past saturday) are home and hosed should have a wander doon their local bookies..with exception of celtic who have had no credible competition for years, how many times in past 5 seasons have the club with biggest budget won their league (and restricting arguement to Scotland which I didn't) - ross county last year, certainly not, montrose certainly not, arbroath certainly not etc etc Like I said, there will always be excpetions to 'the rule'. That's the ways statistics work. Let's for arguments sake restrict it to Scotland. If we took all four leagues over a ten year period and looked at how many times the team with the largest budget won their league, you'd find, without a shadow of a doubt, that they'd tend to win it way more than random chance would dictate. If you wanted to plot salary budget vs points or final position, you'd also find a correlation that, statistically, is much stronger than random chance would produce. It really is astounding how often fans of clubs with relatively large budgets will go to any length to try and argue that budgets don't really matter that much. Aye, that's why the guys pumping money into Cove have ensured they have th ebiggest player budget for their respective league for th epast few years. Cos budgets don't matter and they just enjoy flushing money down the drain. Edited November 4, 2019 by Gordon EF 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowden Cowboy Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 Like I said, there will always be excpetions to 'the rule'. That's the ways statistics work. Let's for arguments sake restrict it to Scotland. If we took all four leagues over a ten year period and looked at how many times the team with the largest budget won their league, you'd find, without a shadow of a doubt, that they'd tend to win it way more than random chance would dictate. If you wanted to plot salary budget vs points or final position, you'd also find a correlation that, statistically, is much stronger than random chance would produce. It really is astounding how often fans of clubs with relatively large budgets will go to any length to try and argue that budgets don't really matter that much. Aye, that's why the guys pumping money into Cove have ensured they have th ebiggest player budget for their respective league for th epast few years. Cos budgets don't matter and they just enjoy flushing money down the drain.There is an obviously strong correlation between league position and finance. It is not the only factor of course but over time the clubs with more money tend to have more success. Take Gretna as an example unless you accept Rowan Alexander's view that it was all down to his hard work and talent then they just bought the success they had. Last season Peterhead and Celtic won their leagues with the biggest budgets while in Championship Dundee United were runners up to Ross County who were also significantly bankrolled. Raith I guess had top League 1 budget and were third. None of them were anywhere near the wrong end of the league and few teams with a monetary advantage finish near the foot of their table. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyM Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 On 03/11/2019 at 03:24, Neilly said: What a minter of a football club. I had to check the official site to make sure that wasn't a wind up. I hope they die a similar death to Gretna. The boy who wrote that will have an aneurism when Cove eventually encounter a Premiership side in the cup because with their billy big baws attitude they'll get absolutely destroyed. Speaking of Gretna it reminds me of when they were on a similar trajectory to Cove and were drawn to play Hibs at Easter Road in the League Cup. All sorts of chat about how the Premiership side would struggle etc . Needless to say Gretna were two goals down and blowing out of their arses having been chasing shadows after 15 minutes. Finished 6-0. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toonsers Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 1 hour ago, AndyM said: The boy who wrote that will have an aneurism when Cove eventually encounter a Premiership side in the cup because with their billy big baws attitude they'll get absolutely destroyed. Speaking of Gretna it reminds me of when they were on a similar trajectory to Cove and were drawn to play Hibs at Easter Road in the League Cup. All sorts of chat about how the Premiership side would struggle etc . Needless to say Gretna were two goals down and blowing out of their arses having been chasing shadows after 15 minutes. Finished 6-0. And we all know how good a cup side Hibs are after this weekend 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazilianlex Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 50 minutes ago, Toonsers said: And we all know how good a cup side Hibs are after this weekend Probably better than Auchinleck tho 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toonsers Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 49 minutes ago, Brazilianlex said: Probably better than Auchinleck tho And Broxburn 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowden Cowboy Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 On 03/11/2019 at 11:33, The_Pit_Owns said: I'm quite happy for Megginson to have the goal. I don't know if Broxburn's equaliser at Central Park ended up going down as a Todd own goal but that would make it three for the season. The official recorded goalscorers for those goals are Nicholas Locke (Broxburn) and Mitch Megginson (Cove) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazilianlex Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 1 hour ago, Cowden Cowboy said: The official recorded goalscorers for those goals are Nicholas Locke (Broxburn) and Mitch Megginson (Cove) Every striker will claim the goal and every defender will let them so doesn’t clear up who actually put the ball in the net but who cares. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazilianlex Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 https://www.eveningexpress.co.uk/fp/sport/football/scottish-football/cove-rangers-fc/win-meant-a-bit-extra-for-scully/ Nearly two years ago and still not over it, poor b*****d 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HenryHill Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 3 minutes ago, Brazilianlex said: https://www.eveningexpress.co.uk/fp/sport/football/scottish-football/cove-rangers-fc/win-meant-a-bit-extra-for-scully/ Nearly two years ago and still not over it, poor b*****d They are just upset that no one is bothered about them. Have to make up rivalries and grudge matches. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marello Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 League 2 - likely largest budget highlighted 2013–14 Peterhead Annan Athletic Rory McAllister (Peterhead) 32 2014–15 Albion Rovers Queen's Park Peter Weatherson (Annan Athletic) 22 2015–16 East Fife (possibly Arbroath who finished 9th!) Elgin City Nathan Austin (East Fife) 22 2016–17 Arbroath Forfar Athletic Shane Sutherland (Elgin City) 18 2017–18 Montrose Peterhead David Goodwillie (Clyde) 25 2018–19 Peterhead Clyde League 1 Season Winner Runner-up Top scorer Player Goals 2013–14 Rangers Dunfermline Athletic Michael Moffat (Ayr United) 26 2014–15 Greenock Morton (possibly Dunfermline?) Stranraer Declan McManus (Greenock Morton) 20 2015–16 Dunfermline Athletic Ayr United Faissal El Bakhtaoui (Dunfermline Athletic) Rory McAllister (Peterhead) 22 2016–17 Livingston Alloa Athletic Andy Ryan (Airdrieonians) 23 2017–18 Ayr United Raith Rovers Lawrence Shankland (Ayr United) 26 2018–19 Arbroath (possibly Raith?) Forfar Athletic Kevin Nisbet (Raith Rovers) 30 Championship 2013–14 Dundee Hamilton Academical Rory Loy (Falkirk) 20 2014–15 Heart of Midlothian Hibernian Jason Cummings (Hibernian) 18 2015–16 Rangers Falkirk Martyn Waghorn (Rangers) 20 2016–17 Hibernian Falkirk Jason Cummings (Hibernian) Stephen Dobbie (Queen of the South) 19 2017–18 St Mirren Livingston Stephen Dobbie (Queen of the South) 18 2018–19 Ross County Dundee United Lawrence Shankland (Ayr United) 24 so probably 10 out of 18 give or take but I think that's skewed by Rangers/Hibs/Hearts and I would guess going back further the strike rate is lower 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon EF Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 2 hours ago, marello said: League 2 - likely largest budget highlighted 2013–14 Peterhead Annan Athletic Rory McAllister (Peterhead) 32 2014–15 Albion Rovers Queen's Park Peter Weatherson (Annan Athletic) 22 2015–16 East Fife (possibly Arbroath who finished 9th!) Elgin City Nathan Austin (East Fife) 22 2016–17 Arbroath Forfar Athletic Shane Sutherland (Elgin City) 18 2017–18 Montrose Peterhead David Goodwillie (Clyde) 25 2018–19 Peterhead Clyde League 1 Season Winner Runner-up Top scorer Player Goals 2013–14 Rangers Dunfermline Athletic Michael Moffat (Ayr United) 26 2014–15 Greenock Morton (possibly Dunfermline?) Stranraer Declan McManus (Greenock Morton) 20 2015–16 Dunfermline Athletic Ayr United Faissal El Bakhtaoui (Dunfermline Athletic) Rory McAllister (Peterhead) 22 2016–17 Livingston Alloa Athletic Andy Ryan (Airdrieonians) 23 2017–18 Ayr United Raith Rovers Lawrence Shankland (Ayr United) 26 2018–19 Arbroath (possibly Raith?) Forfar Athletic Kevin Nisbet (Raith Rovers) 30 Championship 2013–14 Dundee Hamilton Academical Rory Loy (Falkirk) 20 2014–15 Heart of Midlothian Hibernian Jason Cummings (Hibernian) 18 2015–16 Rangers Falkirk Martyn Waghorn (Rangers) 20 2016–17 Hibernian Falkirk Jason Cummings (Hibernian) Stephen Dobbie (Queen of the South) 19 2017–18 St Mirren Livingston Stephen Dobbie (Queen of the South) 18 2018–19 Ross County Dundee United Lawrence Shankland (Ayr United) 24 so probably 10 out of 18 give or take but I think that's skewed by Rangers/Hibs/Hearts and I would guess going back further the strike rate is lower No Premiership? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Minertaur Posted November 5, 2019 Author Share Posted November 5, 2019 12 hours ago, marello said: so probably 10 out of 18 give or take but I think that's skewed by Rangers/Hibs/Hearts and I would guess going back further the strike rate is lower But the key thing this season will be that Cove will have a far superior budget to most of the teams in the league. It's not as if there are 3 or 4 teams with a similar budget - Cove will be by far and away spending the most this season. That's why you can sign players like Fyvie, Aird etc. Your only real spending rivals this season would be Edinburgh City. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazilianlex Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Well done to luc Bollan tonight as he was in the Aberdeen team that rammed Cove Rangers 5-0 tonight. The fat controller and his lackey John Sheran no doubt would be their usual graceless selves in defeat. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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