Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[coprolite]

2 hours ago, virginton said:

The main reason why social distancing can’t be maintained outside isn’t joggers: it’s family groups straddling their fat arses across the entire pavement for their daily slither, with a bunch of screaming weans and usually a dug off the leash as well. If you want to make it more effective then you would remove the exemption for household groups and make it one person outside for ‘exercise’ at a time.

Excellent idea, i'll send the seven year old out in the city by herself. Nothing could go wrong there. 

Most families I see out are fairly keen to keep their kids away from other people. 

I don't doubt there are irresponsible families but most aren't.  It's mainly young men that don't make an effort to move, probably because they think they're invincible. But that's relative. There are ignorant c***s of all types. 

[bendan]

2 hours ago, Todd_is_God said:

I said quite a few pages back I couldn't understand why China went to the bother of welding people in to their flats to stop the spread, to then allow people from outside China to fly in once they appeared to have it controlled.

China didn't weld people into their flats. Just because the Daily Mail/Twitter etc say something doesn't make it true. They controlled access to buildings and communities by limiting access points, which included welding some doors and gates.

[Adders]

39 minutes ago, VladimirMooc said:

It’s about balancing harm. The mental health (and physical) harm caused by an indefinite lockdown without an hour’s exercise a day could be greater in the longer-term than maintaining the current level of lockdown. It’s easy to say ‘stay indoors all day’ to people with decent houses and gardens. It’s a lot more difficult to say that to families living in overcrowded flats with no outdoor space. 

Running/walking/cycling whilst maintaining social distance is fine and safe. And the authorities shouldn’t pander to the “just stay inside all day in your shite flat for an indefinite length of time” brigade, most of whom are most likely pontificating from the comfort of their spacious suburban homes with gardens. 

The majority of people in lockdown don't have large fancy house's, to use that as a generalisation is wrong as is saying its safe to go out and exercise, unless you know something the rest of the world doesn't, the risk is slightly lower, but not safe! The point of the whole thing is being missed totally from your view point, we're not being told to just stay in our flats all day, we're being told to stay at home to help protect our own lives the lives of others and to ease the strain on the NHS, as i said earlier the benefits to mental health and well-being come from exercising which can be done at home weather in a flat a house or dare i say a cell, not going outside! What are we actually saying when we claiming that self harm and mental health will be an issue because we're having to stop at home, it's where we live ffs, fair enough it's not ideal,, neither is 10 000 deaths, n counting. 

[Todd_is_God]

10 minutes ago, bendan said:

How many of those 1000 deaths a day are being caused by people going to parks? I don't doubt a few people will catch the virus in a park, but this idea that we have to stop all activity that could conceivably result in a transmission is too much. We need to get Ro below 1.0 as a society. Aiming for 0.0 isn't realistic.

I don't disagree with you overall.

The liklihood of a person who has not been sent a letter to shield (or who lives with / cares for someone who has) catching the virus when out exercising and also going on to develop a serious or deadly infection is probably very slim, but if they do catch it they will spread it through their household and so on.

Really we are talking about stopping people going to parks etc to exercise for a few short weeks.

It could have been the first thing eased once cases and deaths started to drop.

[Todd_is_God]

1 minute ago, bendan said:

China didn't weld people into their flats. Just because the Daily Mail/Twitter etc say something doesn't make it true. They controlled access to buildings and communities by limiting access points, which included welding some doors and gates.

I definitely saw a video on twitter where flats had metal bars welded across the outside to stop them opening.

Was it widespread? I have no idea.

[VladimirMooc]

8 minutes ago, Adders said:

The majority of people in lockdown don't have large fancy house's, to use that as a generalisation is wrong as is saying its safe to go out and exercise, unless you know something the rest of the world doesn't, the risk is slightly lower, but not safe! The point of the whole thing is being missed totally from your view point, we're not being told to just stay in our flats all day, we're being told to stay at home to help protect our own lives the lives of others and to ease the strain on the NHS, as i said earlier the benefits to mental health and well-being come from exercising which can be done at home weather in a flat a house or dare i say a cell, not going outside! What are we actually saying when we claiming that self harm and mental health will be an issue because we're having to stop at home, it's where we live ffs, fair enough it's not ideal,, neither is 10 000 deaths, n counting. 

I think you’re missing the point, actually. I’m not criticising the current measures. I’m criticising the idea that people going out for a socially-distanced hour of exercise each day is what is responsible for rising death rates, and that people should be prevented from doing that. 

Edited April 13, 2020 by VladimirMooc

[superbigal]

Again looking at Belgiums reporting of deaths.

Here is todays information.  Somehow we struggle in the UK to replicate the Belgian approach on care homes.

 

The last 24 hours saw 303 new fatalities, bringing the total to 3,903 since the outbreak began. Of the total number of fatalities, 53% died in hospital, 43% in a care home, none at home and 3% in another location.

The deaths in hospital are all confirmed cases, while the deaths in care homes include confirmed cases of coronavirus and presumed cases together.

[bendan]

13 minutes ago, Todd_is_God said:

I definitely saw a video on twitter where flats had metal bars welded across the outside to stop them opening.

Was it widespread? I have no idea.

There were a few cases of crazy neighbours boarding up the doors of people they thought had the virus, but the only welding I've seen on the internet was of apartment buildings having some entrances welded so that a single manned entrance/exit was used and thus people's movement was controlled.

[doulikefish]

9 minutes ago, superbigal said:

Again looking at Belgiums reporting of deaths.

Here is todays information.  Somehow we struggle in the UK to replicate the Belgian approach on care homes.

 

The last 24 hours saw 303 new fatalities, bringing the total to 3,903 since the outbreak began. Of the total number of fatalities, 53% died in hospital, 43% in a care home, none at home and 3% in another location.

The deaths in hospital are all confirmed cases, while the deaths in care homes include confirmed cases of coronavirus and presumed cases together.

Simple answer is it would make them look bad 

900 odd deaths a day isnt a reason for mass graves and refrigerated units being used 

[Adders]

3 minutes ago, VladimirMooc said:

I think you’re missing the point, actually. I’m not criticising the current measures. I’m criticising the idea that people going out for a socially-distanced hour of exercise each day is what is responsible for rising death rates, and that people should be prevented from doing that. 

sho

Why wouldn't everyone want to do absolutely everything possible to get out of this situation as quickly and as painless as possible! The one thing we do know is the safest way is to stay at home end of, exercising for an hour brings risk as well as people abusing the guidelines, do you not think other nations would have had the same idea? Or have we all of a sudden became a nation full of obsessed joggers? I don't recall seeing the residents of whuhan, China, running around? Which happens to be the only place where the light at the end of the tunnel can be seen! 

3 minutes ago, VladimirMooc said:

I think you’re missing the point, actually. I’m not criticising the current measures. I’m criticising the idea that people going out for a socially-distanced hour of exercise each day is what is responsible for rising death rates, and that people should be prevented from doing that. 

sho

 

[bendan]

22 minutes ago, Todd_is_God said:

I don't disagree with you overall.

The liklihood of a person who has not been sent a letter to shield (or who lives with / cares for someone who has) catching the virus when out exercising and also going on to develop a serious or deadly infection is probably very slim, but if they do catch it they will spread it through their household and so on.

Really we are talking about stopping people going to parks etc to exercise for a few short weeks.

It could have been the first thing eased once cases and deaths started to drop.

The unfortunate reality is that many of the current transmissions are coming from untested, asymptomatic PPE-starved NHS staff. If we want to reduce transmissions, we should focus on the biggest sources.

[Steven W]

1 minute ago, Adders said:

Why wouldn't everyone want to do absolutely everything possible to get out of this situation as quickly and as painless as possible! The one thing we do know is the safest way is to stay at home end of, exercising for an hour brings risk as well as people abusing the guidelines, do you not think other nations would have had the same idea? Or have we all of a sudden became a nation full of obsessed joggers? I don't recall seeing the residents of whuhan, China, running around? Which happens to be the only place where the light at the end of the tunnel can be seen! 

 

"Risk" is the key word though isn't it. If the aim is to get to a riskless situation then we should consider banning, among other things, cars. There are many fatal car accidents every day, but we all take the "risk".

[NotThePars]

5 hours ago, expatowner said:

Labour had many allies in the press when Blair came to power, or did you not want to mention that?

 

Edited April 13, 2020 by NotThePars

[VladimirMooc]

8 minutes ago, Adders said:

Why wouldn't everyone want to do absolutely everything possible to get out of this situation as quickly and as painless as possible! The one thing we do know is the safest way is to stay at home end of, exercising for an hour brings risk as well as people abusing the guidelines, do you not think other nations would have had the same idea? Or have we all of a sudden became a nation full of obsessed joggers? I don't recall seeing the residents of whuhan, China, running around? Which happens to be the only place where the light at the end of the tunnel can be seen! 

 

If we wanted to do literally everything humanly possible to end the virus then we’d all stay in one room and never leave the house, however we are dealing with human beings not robots. 

Anything we do brings risk; driving a car, going on an airplane, watching shite football teams. It’s about how to manage that risk. Telling people they cannot walk outside their house once a day whilst keeping socially distanced is not proportionate and not a credible response to risk. 

[eez-eh]

I went out for a run the other day and kept a wide berth from anyone I passed - often going onto the road or stopping to ensure there was enough room for people to get past. Does that make me scum @JTS98?

[Adders]

10 minutes ago, Steven W said:

"Risk" is the key word though isn't it. If the aim is to get to a riskless situation then we should consider banning, among other things, cars. There are many fatal car accidents every day, but we all take the "risk".

Well could go on couldn't we, don't go on planes, don't go on roller-coasters don't walk up the stairs, but we're actually diverting from the point, i mean if it's not a big risk why not tell the elderly n vulnerable to also relax the rules, after all, the virus has proved it don't descrimnate, this is the problem we don't know enough detail about this at the moment, the sacrifice is really not that much when we look at the sacrifices been made in the past, the proof will be in the pudding and in the final numbers of lives lost, n by the looks of things we not doing that great, in fact we're doing appallingly! 

[madwullie]

I mean, we have people on here pontificating about risk, and harm and mental health. We are top of the league in Europe for daily deaths ffs. Looking like we'll win the European championship outright when the dust finally settles, and people are still using the "but we couldn't get away with that in Britain" nonsense. 

 

Noone is saying the government haven't seriously fucked this up and will hopefully pay the price for it in the aftermath, but for now, not going outside can help to keep the death rate down, dare I say even keep a few folk alive who don't need to die. Both the govt and the ojbkic can be to blame for what is happening. 

And still the arguments on fb about how everyone is an exception to the rule because x, y and z, yet everyone else is a disgrace for doing the same thing, as deaths climb towards a 4 figure daily level with little hope of dropping from that height till May. 

It's bloody depressing, and the thing is, the longer people fight against these measures, the longer they're going to have to be in place. 

[Adders]

1 minute ago, madwullie said:

I mean, we have people on here pontificating about risk, and harm and mental health. We are top of the league in Europe for daily deaths ffs. Looking like we'll win the European championship outright when the dust finally settles, and people are still using the "but we couldn't get away with that in Britain" nonsense. 

 

Noone is saying the government haven't seriously fucked this up and will hopefully pay the price for it in the aftermath, but for now, not going outside can help to keep the death rate down, dare I say even keep a few folk alive who don't need to die. Both the govt and the ojbkic can be to blame for what is happening. 

And still the arguments on fb about how everyone is an exception to the rule because x, y and z, yet everyone else is a disgrace for doing the same thing, as deaths climb towards a 4 figure daily level with little hope of dropping from that height till May. 

It's bloody depressing, and the thing is, the longer people fight against these measures, the longer they're going to have to be in place. 

Absolutely spot on! 

[Adders]

13 minutes ago, eez-eh said:

I went out for a run the other day and kept a wide berth from anyone I passed - often going onto the road or stopping to ensure there was enough room for people to get past. Does that make me scum @JTS98?

How badly did you need the run? N be careful of running in the road, well that's another story! 

[jagfox]

UK Residents Applaud the NHS Despite Routinely Voting to Cripple Them