Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[Detournement]

9 minutes ago, Cyclizine said:

Last flu season before Covid the UK had about 3000 ICU admissions for influenza with a roughly 10% mortality. English figures show about 1200 deaths from influenza in total, not "tens of thousands".

With Covid we have had over 35,000 ICU admissions with nearly 40% mortality. Many more ended up in hospital and many died in the community.

Covid is not the flu.

Is it not more common to be admitted with flu then die of pneumonia than have the death recorded as influenza?

[welshbairn]

36 minutes ago, Michael W said:

I will be, yes. Second dose is 17 days before I fly so I'll just sneak in. 

I'm comfortable enough doing the antigen test to get there, it's more the UK requirements I find annoying. Scrambling about Paris for a test (and it has to be a PCR unless I've missed an update) is a bit of a nuscience and the PCR after arrival is more cost. The testing will probably cost more than the flights. 

I'd tolerate this (very begrudgingly) for 14 days away somewhere, but for 4 nights it's a bit much. 

Unless it's changed in the last few days it's just a 30 euroish antigen test which you can probably get at the airport before returning, or in a pharmacy near where you're staying, and a PCR test from £60 for when you get back. Ignore the Scot gov site saying you have to use their firm, someone like Randox will do fine.

[bendan]

12 minutes ago, Cyclizine said:

Last flu season before Covid the UK had about 3000 ICU admissions for influenza with a roughly 10% mortality. English figures show about 1200 deaths from influenza in total, not "tens of thousands".

With Covid we have had over 35,000 ICU admissions with nearly 40% mortality. Many more ended up in hospital and many died in the community.

Covid is not the flu.

I appreciate it's not the flu, but the idea of what restrictions might be justified should be based on what we'd expect ICU admissions to be in a vaccinated/already-exposed population, rather than the naive population that faced Covid last winter. 

[effeffsee_the2nd]

1 hour ago, Elixir said:

Just imagine a bit of patter being restricted to a football forum!

now that lovejoying is taken care off should we start a P&B dictionary?

Cigaring-  

verb- a clear and decisive victory with ease - a merge of two common footballing phrases 1. description of smoking cigars to celebrate a victory  2. description of domination of play " they were under so little pressure they could stroll around the midfield smoking cigars and still keep possesion"

see also - smoking , americansim, meaning victory or destroying 

[Michael W]

2 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

Unless it's changed in the last few days it's just a 30 euroish antigen test which you can probably get at the airport before returning, or in a pharmacy near where you're staying, and a PCR test from £60 for when you get back. Ignore the Scot gov site saying you have to use their firm, someone like Randox will do fine.

That's not so bad if we'll take an antigen. Less cumbersome than a PCR and of course much cheaper. 

I'm in England so I'll need to check the requirements RE providers. I think BA do have some sort of partnership with Randox so I'll check and total the cost. 

[budmiester1]

33 minutes ago, realmadrid said:

Meant to also say you wont be scrambling for somewhere for a test, over in France all the pharmacies seem to have facilities to do these tests.

Les Gets is a small village with a population of under 2000 outwith the summer and winter holiday seasons and we have a facility with the next village which is slightly larger having 2.  There will be 1000's of locations in Paris and your accommodation provider should be able to assist in pointing you in the correct direction.

The next village is Morzine, I love the Portes De Soleil area, first visited the area back in 1991

[Cyclizine]

11 minutes ago, Detournement said:

Is it not more common to be admitted with flu then die of pneumonia than have the death recorded as influenza?

There's no evidence this is the case, influenza is a cause of pneumonia itself. Hospital admissions for pneumonia will routinely be tested for atypical infections, including influenza viruses. The cause of death in the case of someone dying from a superadded bacterial pneumonia on top of influenza would be something like:

I(a) Staphylococcus aureus pneumonia (b) Influenza A infection

The influenza is the ultimate cause of death and is recorded in statistics. Same way as if someone was in a car crash,  shattered their legs and then got a blood clot and died from a pulmonary embolism. Yes, they died because you had a PE, but the ultimate cause of death was a car crash.

[Billy Jean King]

Unless it's changed in the last few days it's just a 30 euroish antigen test which you can probably get at the airport before returning, or in a pharmacy near where you're staying, and a PCR test from £60 for when you get back. Ignore the Scot gov site saying you have to use their firm, someone like Randox will do fine.

My neighbours did just that and were forced at the airport in Glasgow to purchase the SG package (having already paid for a Randox or similar cheaper test) or not be allowed in. That's not particularly good advice your giving there.

[DeeTillEhDeh]

One thing that has not been picked up on by many is that although restrictions may he lifting on 19 July in England there will still be rules in place to at least mid-August regards self-isolating even for the double-jagged.

What you can end up with is lockdown by stealth as perfectly healthy people have to self-isolate, businesses have staff shortages, or in some instances, have to temporarily shut down.

[welshbairn]

2 minutes ago, Billy Jean King said:

13 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

Unless it's changed in the last few days it's just a 30 euroish antigen test which you can probably get at the airport before returning, or in a pharmacy near where you're staying, and a PCR test from £60 for when you get back. Ignore the Scot gov site saying you have to use their firm, someone like Randox will do fine.

My neighbours did just that and were forced at the airport in Glasgow to purchase the SG package (having already paid for a Randox or similar cheaper test) or not be allowed in. That's not particularly good advice your giving there.

I'd like to know exactly what test they booked and if it was definitely PCR. I've heard of plenty people booking tests with other firms with no problem, so long as the Passenger Locator Form accepts the code you're given by your provider. The rules and practice change from day to day though, so if anyone's worried just go with the SG firm and pay the extra. Or arrive at an English airport.

[mizfit]

That's just a presentational issue then.
Hopefully post Covid, Flu deaths will be lower thanks in part to Covid bringing an end to folk who "struggle in" to their work and folk washing their hands after going to the toilet/ before eating.

Another reason why flexible WFH Needs to be standard. A lot of people go into the office out of fear, if you could phone in say you feel ill and your working from home there should be no issue.

[101]

9 minutes ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

One thing that has not been picked up on by many is that although restrictions may he lifting on 19 July in England there will still be rules in place to at least mid-August regards self-isolating even for the double-jagged.

What you can end up is lockdown by stealth as perfectly healthy people have to self-isolate, and businesses have staff shortages, or in some instances, have to temporarily shut down.
 

If cases get to the predicted 100,000 before the test to release comes into play the economy will be severely dampened down.

[Billy Jean King]

I'd like to know exactly what test they booked and if it was definitely PCR. I've heard of plenty people booking tests with other firms with no problem, so long as the Passenger Locator Form accepts the code you're given by your provider. The rules and practice change from day to day though, so if anyone's worried just go with the SG firm and pay the extra. Or arrive at an English airport.

Yes pretty much that. Might even depend on whose working on a given day if forms don't scan etc. All way too much hassle and cost still for many, me included.

[Billy Jean King]

Another reason why flexible WFH Needs to be standard. A lot of people go into the office out of fear, if you could phone in say you feel ill and your working from home there should be no issue.

Our absence rate is down 72% since WFH became the standard another huge plus.

[Billy Jean King]

If cases get to the predicted 100,000 before the test to release comes into play the economy will be severely dampened down.

Absolutely. Imagine just 2 contacts of each (will be way more) being contact traced to isolate. 1.4m people a week which will cripple any effect of lifting restrictions.

[Guest TheJTS98]

1 hour ago, Elixir said:

Except it isn't, because short of state mandating vaccination, every place which has avoided widespread transmission will have next to no immunity from natural infection. All of these places will have epidemics of varying scale when they open up.

Cheers for having a go anyway.

Help mah boab. This lad can vote.

EnJoY YouR tHrEaD LaDiEs!

[Elixir]

32 minutes ago, Cyclizine said:

Last flu season before Covid the UK had about 3000 ICU admissions for influenza with a roughly 10% mortality. English figures show about 1200 deaths from influenza in total, not "tens of thousands".

With Covid we have had over 35,000 ICU admissions with nearly 40% mortality. Many more ended up in hospital and many died in the community.

Covid is not the flu.

Surely the reason 'Covid is not the flu' is because of a naive population with no prior immunity. Over time, i.e. now in places like the UK and US, thanks to vaccination but also natural infection the severity of disease and chance of death will continue to decrease on average.

An influenza pandemic has the exact same potential to cause the same death and morbidity as Covid has while still being 'the flu'. There is evidence and theory that the 'Russian flu' pandemic from 1890 which caused over a million deaths was actually the coronavirus OC43, which is now merely a common cold strain.

[Elixir]

1 minute ago, TheJTS98 said:

Help mah boab. This lad can vote.

EnJoY YouR tHrEaD LaDiEs!

Sorry - what is it you disagree with exactly?

[gav-ffc]

5 minutes ago, Billy Jean King said:

8 minutes ago, 101 said:

If cases get to the predicted 100,000 before the test to release comes into play the economy will be severely dampened down.

Absolutely. Imagine just 2 contacts of each (will be way more) being contact traced to isolate. 1.4m people a week which will cripple any effect of lifting restrictions.

Would this not trim that down a bit 

https://twitter.com/politicsforali/status/1412380419148894211?s=21

[anotherchance]

2 minutes ago, Billy Jean King said:

5 minutes ago, 101 said:

If cases get to the predicted 100,000 before the test to release comes into play the economy will be severely dampened down.

Absolutely. Imagine just 2 contacts of each (will be way more) being contact traced to isolate. 1.4m people a week which will cripple any effect of lifting restrictions.

Compliance will be almost zero.

People will delete the app, ignore phone calls from contact tracing, not bother isolating/getting tested.

Naive of them to think otherwise.