George Floyd/Black Lives Matter Protests

[Mr Waldo]

2 hours ago, WhiteRoseKillie said:

To oppose BLM or any other ant-racist movement at this point invites criticism of your own actions* and motives.

* Which, occasionally seem a little bit, now what's the word...

Just to be clear, you are criticising and questioning the motives of everyone who does not support Black Lives Matter, in both US and UK?

That's a hellava lot of people.

 

[topcat(The most tip top)]

Loving the idea that the world 'rallied round' to help Jewish survivors as opposed to, erm, keeping next to all of the property stolen from them in Nazi occupied/aligned Europe and punting them on the next boat to Palestine to get them out of the road, which is what actually happened after 1945 to the vast majority of survivors.
The rebuilding of a Jewish identity - if by this you're somewhat obliquely referring to the creation of the state of Israel - was of course a concession largely extracted through violence from a reluctant colonial authority (guess who?). The US and the Soviet Union both supported Israeli statehood primarily because they viewed it as a potential ally to serve their geopolitical interests in the Middle East, not as an altruistic gesture because of the Holocaust. The newly liberated states of eastern Europe meanwhile were more than happy to encourage their residual Jewish population to emigrate to an emerging Jewish nation-state: indeed this had been the primary policy goal of the massively anti-Semitic Polish state between the world wars. 
Try actually reading some authoritative history about the Holocaust - Timothy Snyder's Black Earth is a readily available starting point - instead of peddling this ahistorical drivel in the public domain. 
 

You’ve clearly read further forward in Jewish history than me. I’ve only just finished Exodus yesterday so I’ve got some catching up to do I’d appreciate it if you gave some spoiler warnings.

[WhiteRoseKillie]

11 minutes ago, Mr Waldo said:

Just to be clear, you are criticising and questioning the motives of everyone who does not support Black Lives Matter, in both US and UK?

That's a hellava lot of people.

 

Nope. Try reading my post again. I'm here to help if you have any questions.

[WhiteRoseKillie]

1 hour ago, NewBornBairn said:

The entire "civilised" world?

So you're calling Egypt, Jordan, Lebanon, Syria uncivilised? 

 

1 hour ago, virginton said:

Loving the idea that the world 'rallied round' to help Jewish survivors as opposed to, erm, keeping next to all of the property stolen from them in Nazi occupied/aligned Europe and punting them on the next boat to Palestine to get them out of the road, which is what actually happened after 1945 to the vast majority of survivors.

The rebuilding of a Jewish identity - if by this you're somewhat obliquely referring to the creation of the state of Israel - was of course a concession largely extracted through violence from a reluctant colonial authority (guess who?). The US and the Soviet Union both supported Israeli statehood primarily because they viewed it as a potential ally to serve their geopolitical interests in the Middle East, not as an altruistic gesture because of the Holocaust. The newly liberated states of eastern Europe meanwhile were more than happy to encourage their residual Jewish population to emigrate to an emerging Jewish nation-state: indeed this had been the primary policy goal of the massively anti-Semitic Polish state between the world wars. 

Try actually reading some authoritative history about the Holocaust - Timothy Snyder's Black Earth is a readily available starting point - instead of peddling this ahistorical drivel in the public domain. 

 

 

46 minutes ago, NewBornBairn said:

First time I've ever greenied a VT post I think.

 

Britain actively tried to stop the formation of a Jewish state - hence the Israeli terrorism campaign against the Brits. Then, as it became inevitable, tried to broker a deal between the incoming Jews and the Arabs but gave up because both sides refused to compromise. The day after Israel was formed, the Arab states invaded and tried to wipe them out. 

Christ, you try to steer clear of some of the murkier parts of Israel's independence campaign to avoid allegations of AS, only to find you've gone too far the other way. Lehi were cúnts, and the bombing of the King David was up there with 9/11. Happy now?

Oh, and virginton? Auld Nick'll be ice-skating to work before I'll take a recommendation of a book which has helped form your worldview.

and NBB - replace "civilised" with "developed" and you'd be closer to my meaning. Whatever their motives - as the Inverclyde Sage has expressed - the majority of the world's nations supported the formation of a Jewish State.

[WhiteRoseKillie]

15 minutes ago, topcat(The most tip top) said:

You’ve clearly read further forward in Jewish history than me. I’ve only just finished Exodus yesterday so I’ve got some catching up to do I’d appreciate it if you gave some spoiler warnings.

Spoiler

virginton's a knob

 

[dirty dingus]

Gun totting southern redneck lawyer - Like a character straight out a John Grisham novel.

https://www.riverfronttimes.com/newsblog/2020/06/28/gun-swinging-lawyers-confront-protesters-in-central-west-end

 

[Silvio Tattiescone]

Beirut 1935. Looks pretty civilised and developed to me.

[WhiteRoseKillie]

10 minutes ago, NewBornBairn said:

Beirut 1935. Looks pretty civilised and developed to me.

Went downhill a bit a few years later, mind.

[vikingTON]

28 minutes ago, WhiteRoseKillie said:

 

 

Christ, you try to steer clear of some of the murkier parts of Israel's independence campaign to avoid allegations of AS, only to find you've gone too far the other way. Lehi were cúnts, and the bombing of the King David was up there with 9/11. Happy now?

Oh, and virginton? Auld Nick'll be ice-skating to work before I'll take a recommendation of a book which has helped form your worldview.

The book doesn't inform 'my worldview' but rather 'expands my understanding of the objective facts about the Holocaust and general policy towards the Jews in east-central Europe': which is kind of an important thing for a qualified historian and practitioner in the field to have. You're not actually entitled to spout whatever complete and utter nonsense you want about such an important topic without getting called on it, so put your petted lip away and educate yourself for a change.

[NotThePars]

2 hours ago, NewBornBairn said:

BLM speaking about Palestine has more to do with the people who have jumped on the BLM bandwagon, the people who obsess over Palestine and see Israel as the evil guiding hand behind everything. 

This is simply not true. Black Lives Matter, and several other groups that spawned out of the Ferguson protests in 2014, have worked with Palestinian activists for years.

https://electronicintifada.net/blogs/rania-khalek/watch-ferguson-activists-bring-message-love-and-struggle-palestine

[Brother Blades]

Don’t really have much to add regards BLM, but the mention of Beirut & the Lebanon has reminded me of being in Cote d’Ivoir in the same hotel as Lebanese air crew, the women were absolutely stunning & the entire crew knew how to party. Many a day spent at the pool getting merry with them.
And that’s about all I’ve got to say about that.

[Jacksgranda]

Thanks, Forrest.

[Detournement]

5 hours ago, MixuFruit said:

No it's really not. It's an exceptionally easy way to make most people who aren't following any of this closely close their ears and think "crank".

You should always tailor your discourse to the audience in any situation.

However discussing the ideology that drives human rights abuses and land theft in Palestine necessarily involves calling by it's self proclaimed name. It has to be considered as a continuous racist project over the course of over a century and also in the greater context of white settler colonialism. 

 

[Detournement]

Sir Yer Da getting BLM telt. 

That's the most worked up I've ever seen him. 

[Detournement]

2 hours ago, WhiteRoseKillie said:

 

 

Christ, you try to steer clear of some of the murkier parts of Israel's independence campaign to avoid allegations of AS, only to find you've gone too far the other way. Lehi were cúnts, and the bombing of the King David was up there with 9/11. Happy now?

Oh, and virginton? Auld Nick'll be ice-skating to work before I'll take a recommendation of a book which has helped form your worldview.

and NBB - replace "civilised" with "developed" and you'd be closer to my meaning. Whatever their motives - as the Inverclyde Sage has expressed - the majority of the world's nations supported the formation of a Jewish State.

Timothy Snyder is a raging Atlantic Council sponsored Neocon. Definitely do not read him.

[marty_j]

[Theroadlesstravelled]

Karl Henry calls it

 

Edited June 30, 2020 by Theroadlesstravelled

[vikingTON]

13 hours ago, Detournement said:

Timothy Snyder is a raging Atlantic Council sponsored Neocon. Definitely do not read him.

More top notch stuff from the chump who held up a no-mark Esperantist blogger as the voice of authority on nationalism.

[Theroadlesstravelled]

Has anyone ventured into Parler?

I see it’s listed 21st on the App Store.

[pandarilla]

Karl Henry calls it
 

What a bawbag he is