Sky Sports are Taking the Piss Thread

[VincentGuerin]

4 hours ago, AJF said:

This all hinges on sky actually giving a f**k about showing partly empty stadiums. Do they? If viewership remained at similar levels, would they bother?

It then comes onto the next point about it being an embarrassment for the league which would spur them on to take action. This should already be happening. Clubs are acutely aware of fan feeling towards the TV deal. Why would it take a boycott for them to want better than we currently have?

I’m not sure if all fans not attending an away game would watch it on sky, but you’d bet a fair chunk of them would, bringing me back to my earlier point regarding Sky not caring about empty stadiums if it’s not impacting their bottom line.

I personally know all about striking and the sacrifice it brings. However we are locked into a multi year deal and due to the points I’ve already mentioned, I’m not sure a boycott would hold the same power over Sky if they aren’t being impacted financially.

It’s just an odd narrative to me, as it seems you are blaming Rangers and Celtic fans for inaction while absolving everyone else of the same blame.

 

4 hours ago, gannonball said:

Would agree with this this they can't be arsed at checking the graphics are right for games or even filling out their game quota so I would imagine it's not going to be much of a deal for them.

https://www.dw.com/en/bundesliga-monday-games-to-be-discontinued-as-fan-protests-persist/a-46390559

Media organisations do not want to become the story when that story is a negative one.

Old Firm fans boycotting their away games (and I'd be for ALL fans boycotting lunchtime Sunday kick-offs) would be a huge news story, and Sky have a rolling 24-hour sports news channel that would find the issue extremely difficult, if not impossible, to avoid while it was all over Twitter and their media rivals.

Fans have power. They just choose not to use it.

Rangers and Celtic fans can say 'it's not our fault' all they like. But the bottom line is they are the group in a position to have the most impact on this, and they are choosing to do absolutely nothing about it. Thousands of them are live on Sky tv every single week and they use that platform for nothing at all.

They're allowed to make that call, but don't then act annoyed about the shite tv deal not changing.

Edited April 28, 2023 by VincentGuerin

[gannonball]

1 minute ago, VincentGuerin said:

 

https://www.dw.com/en/bundesliga-monday-games-to-be-discontinued-as-fan-protests-persist/a-46390559

Media organisations do not want to become the story when that story is a negative one.

Old Firm fans boycotting their away games (and I'd be for ALL fans boycotting lunchtime Sunday kick-offs) would be a huge news story, and Sky have a rolling 24-hour sports news channel that would find the issue extremely difficult, if not impossible, to avoid while it was all over Twitter and their media rivals.

Fans have power. They just choose not to use it.

Rangers and Celtic fans can say 'it's not our fault' all they like. But the bottom line is they are the group in a position to have the most impact on this, and they are choosing to do absolutely nothing about it. They're allowed to make that call, but don't then act annoyed about the shite tv deal not changing.

I get your point but German clubs are all owned by the fans to force this change. There are very few clubs in Scotland that are truly clubs these days and for that reason we rarely get what is fair for the match day punter.

[VincentGuerin]

4 minutes ago, gannonball said:

I get your point but German clubs are all owned by the fans to force this change. There are very few clubs in Scotland that are truly clubs these days and for that reason we rarely get what is fair for the match day punter.

Being fan run has absolutely no impact on the ability of the fans to embarrass the broadcaster and the authorities.

[AJF]

8 minutes ago, VincentGuerin said:

 

https://www.dw.com/en/bundesliga-monday-games-to-be-discontinued-as-fan-protests-persist/a-46390559

Media organisations do not want to become the story when that story is a negative one.

Old Firm fans boycotting their away games (and I'd be for ALL fans boycotting lunchtime Sunday kick-offs) would be a huge news story, and Sky have a rolling 24-hour sports news channel that would find the issue extremely difficult, if not impossible, to avoid while it was all over Twitter and their media rivals.

Fans have power. They just choose not to use it.

Rangers and Celtic fans can say 'it's not our fault' all they like. But the bottom line is they are the group in a position to have the most impact on this, and they are choosing to do absolutely nothing about it. Thousands of them are live on Sky tv every single week and they use that platform for nothing at all.

They're allowed to make that call, but don't then act annoyed about the shite tv deal not changing.

I think you are trying too hard to paint this into a Rangers and Celtic fans issue while absolving anyone else of any burden. So because we don’t protest we can’t act annoyed about a shite TV deal that is the responsibility of the clubs (via the SPFL) to negotiate? Away to f**k

Edited April 28, 2023 by AJF

[gannonball]

1 minute ago, VincentGuerin said:

Being fan run has absolutely no impact on the ability of the fans to embarrass the broadcaster and the authorities.

Sorry but this is absolute nonsense. The broadcaster negotiates with the league stakeholders who are generally all fan appointed at some point in the chain. The fans therefor have much more power to influence change.

[VincentGuerin]

4 minutes ago, AJF said:

I think you are trying to hard to paint this into and Rangers and Celtic fans issue while absolving anyone else of any burden. So because we don’t protest we can’t act annoyed about a shite TV deal that is the responsibility of the clubs (via the SPFL) to negotiate? Away to f**k

Again, you're putting words in my mouth.

But what meaningful protest against Sky tv can Kilmarnock supporters make?

Thousands of Rangers and Celtic fans are live on Sky every single week. Nobody else has that platform.

Do you have any suggestion for a meaningful protest at the upcoming (untelevised) Hearts v Aberdeen game?

Old Firm fans get so fucking touchy about stuff like this. I don't like that it's your support that is on telly every week, but that's just where we are. What do you propose the rest of us do?

[VincentGuerin]

4 minutes ago, gannonball said:

Sorry but this is absolute nonsense. The broadcaster negotiates with the league stakeholders who are generally all fan appointed at some point in the chain. The fans therefor have much more power to influence change.

Aye, you're right. There's nothing that can be done.

Might as well just give up.

Never mind.

Fucking hell.

[gannonball]

3 minutes ago, VincentGuerin said:

Aye, you're right. There's nothing that can be done.

Might as well just give up.

Never mind.

Fucking hell.

I'm not saying that I'm just saying your suggestion wasn't really going to achieve anything other than less cash flow for clubs like Livi/Saints who budget for large away crowds several times a season.

[VincentGuerin]

3 minutes ago, gannonball said:

I'm not saying that I'm just saying your suggestion wasn't really going to achieve anything other than less cash flow for clubs like Livi/Saints who budget for large away crowds several times a season.

I completely disagree, and I think attitudes like yours are -going all Daily Mail letters page here - part of the problem.

Fan protests work. Embarrassing media organisations works.

Here we just choose not to.

Sky give thousands of your supporters a platform every fortnight and you choose to do absolutely nothing with it.

Imagine if Celtic and Rangers fans coordinated on this and agreed to boycott each place between them. Rangers fans go to St Mirren but not Motherwell, Celtic vice-versa. The boycott days one or two organisers go in with big anti-Sky banners. The attended days there's something along the lines of tennis balls disrupting the match in a coordinated way.

Sky would be completely unable to not address this happening all season. It would be a huge media story and would also push the clubs into action through embarrassment and being hit in the pocket.

Your attitude that fans are powerless is what makes us powerless. It's pathetic.

[SlipperyP]

4 hours ago, kingjoey said:

Is there another league in Europe that is run for two clubs, neither of which sees themselves as belonging to that particular country?

Not that, the SPFL bend over and ask can you do it for me....Police & SKY

[AJF]

7 minutes ago, VincentGuerin said:

Again, you're putting words in my mouth.

But what meaningful protest against Sky tv can Kilmarnock supporters make?

Thousands of Rangers and Celtic fans are live on Sky every single week. Nobody else has that platform.

Do you have any suggestion for a meaningful protest at the upcoming (untelevised) Hearts v Aberdeen game?

Old Firm fans get so fucking touchy about stuff like this. I don't like that it's your support that is on telly every week, but that's just where we are. What do you propose the rest of us do?

 

17 minutes ago, VincentGuerin said:

 

Fans have power. They just choose not to use it.

Rangers and Celtic fans can say 'it's not our fault' all they like. But the bottom line is they are the group in a position to have the most impact on this, and they are choosing to do absolutely nothing about it. Thousands of them are live on Sky tv every single week and they use that platform for nothing at all.

They're allowed to make that call, but don't then act annoyed about the shite tv deal not changing.

I don’t think I’m putting words in your mouth at all. These last 3 paragraphs of your previous post pretty clearly implies you don’t think we can be critical of the TV deal if we don’t use our powers of protest.

[VincentGuerin]

6 minutes ago, AJF said:

 

I don’t think I’m putting words in your mouth at all. These last 3 paragraphs of your previous post pretty clearly implies you don’t think we can be critical of the TV deal if we don’t use our powers of protest.

No. But I'm not saying only Rangers and Celtic fans.

IT cannot be said often enough. Thousands of your fans are on their channel every single week, yet are more interested in the pope than doing anything that might have an impact on improving watching football in Scotland.

It's an incredible thing to think about. You do absolutely nothing with the perfect chance to make a real impact every weekend.

I note you didn't bother answering when I asked what other teams' fans could do.

Edited April 28, 2023 by VincentGuerin

[AJF]

Just now, VincentGuerin said:

No. But I'm not saying only Rangers and Celtic fans.

IT cannot be said often enough. Thousands of your fans are on their channel every single week, yet are more interested in the pope than doing anything that might have an impact on improving watching football in Scotland.

It's an incredible thing to think about. You do absolutely nothing with the perfect chance to make a real impact every weekend.

Because, and I try to say this with some respect, it’s not the job of Rangers and Celtic fans to influence a new TV deal and I’ve already given you various examples as to why it’s probably unlikely to work.

You could make a similar claim of every single club in the country, in the sense that if they took X action it would lead to Y result. But it’s not ever as simple as that.

[VincentGuerin]

4 minutes ago, AJF said:

Because, and I try to say this with some respect, it’s not the job of Rangers and Celtic fans to influence a new TV deal and I’ve already given you various examples as to why it’s probably unlikely to work.

You could make a similar claim of every single club in the country, in the sense that if they took X action it would lead to Y result. But it’s not ever as simple as that.

This is madness.

We're talking about a situation where pretty much all fans agree Sky is shafting us. Two clubs have their fans on Sky every single week of the season yet you don't see why those sets of fans have a platform to influence this more than others?

Celtic and Rangers fans are uniquely positioned to make this a big news story. And they don't do it.

I see you've still yet to suggest any meaningful impact other fans could have.

[AJF]

Just now, VincentGuerin said:

This is madness.

We're talking about a situation where pretty much all fans agree Sky is shafting us. Two clubs have their fans on Sky every single week of the season yet you don't see why those sets of fans have a platform to influence this more than others?

Celtic and Rangers fans are uniquely positioned to make this a big news story. And they don't do it.

I see you've still yet to suggest any meaningful impact other fans could have.

No, what’s madness is you claiming that Rangers and Celtic fans cannot act annoyed about a shit TV deal not changing unless we somehow stage a prolonged and coordinated form of protest ourselves.

And I’ve not made any suggestions of any meaningful impact other fans could have to influence the current TV deal because I don’t really have any suggestions. Other than every single Scottish football fan cancelling their Sky subscription, I don’t know what would work. I’m simply saying I don’t think your suggestion would.

[VincentGuerin]

4 minutes ago, AJF said:

No, what’s madness is you claiming that Rangers and Celtic fans cannot act annoyed about a shit TV deal not changing unless we somehow stage a prolonged and coordinated form of protest ourselves.

And I’ve not made any suggestions of any meaningful impact other fans could have to influence the current TV deal because I don’t really have any suggestions. Other than every single Scottish football fan cancelling their Sky subscription, I don’t know what would work. I’m simply saying I don’t think your suggestion would.

Fair enough. I'm not sure how many times I have to remind you I've never said only Rangers and Celtic fans should be involved. But nobody else has the platform to lead this.

Ah well, then. Nothing to do. Just need to put up with it.

If only some fan groups were given hours of free media time during the season, eh?

[Dons_1988]

2 minutes ago, AJF said:

No, what’s madness is you claiming that Rangers and Celtic fans cannot act annoyed about a shit TV deal not changing unless we somehow stage a prolonged and coordinated form of protest ourselves.

And I’ve not made any suggestions of any meaningful impact other fans could have to influence the current TV deal because I don’t really have any suggestions. Other than every single Scottish football fan cancelling their Sky subscription, I don’t know what would work. I’m simply saying I don’t think your suggestion would.

The point he’s making is rather obvious tbh. 

You are just put out that the burden of this does predominantly fall on OF fans. 

A Scottish football collective would be better but would be utterly meaningless without the only clubs they care about involved. 

[AJF]

5 minutes ago, Dons_1988 said:

The point he’s making is rather obvious tbh. 

You are just put out that the burden of this does predominantly fall on OF fans. 

A Scottish football collective would be better but would be utterly meaningless without the only clubs they care about involved. 

But that’s where I disagree. The burden doesn’t predominantly fall on OF fans, it falls on those who run the SPFL and the clubs within it. That’s probably my overriding point here.

The action that’s been described I’ve already contested why I don’t think that would work.

That’s not to say it definitely wouldn’t or that there are no other possible alternatives. I just disagree that by attending an away match I am somehow failing a duty to promote a better TV deal.

[Brother Blades]

I don’t think it’s about embarrassing Sky although that helps matters, it’s about embarrassing every club who allow Doncaster et al to run Scottish football for the benefit of two clubs. 
I take the point about Celtic & Rangers fans being in a position to make the biggest impact, both manage to have televised Tifos celebrating whichever branch of a made up story they choose to associate with-I refuse to say follow (or follow follow), or some other made up shite, they have an issue with. 
But, it’s really not solely their responsibility, every club that can, should organise some sort of protest at every televised game. Only protest at Sky games & it would quickly become apparent & embarrassing for all parties. 

[Dons_1988]

9 minutes ago, AJF said:

But that’s where I disagree. The burden doesn’t predominantly fall on OF fans, it falls on those who run the SPFL and the clubs within it. That’s probably my overriding point here.

The action that’s been described I’ve already contested why I don’t think that would work.

That’s not to say it definitely wouldn’t or that there are no other possible alternatives. I just disagree that by attending an away match I am somehow failing a duty to promote a better TV deal.

The clubs couldn’t give a shit. That is well established, and as long as people keep moaning on sites like this but continue to subscribe and watch then they won’t give a shit. That’s the point. 

In 2012 sevco would have been an SPL side if fans hadn’t withheld their money. The clubs wanted the path of least financial resistance and that was to maintain the status quo regardless of the circumstance. 

Fans can absolutely have an impact if there’s enough will and organisation.