jagfox Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 It's almost like countries should get around a table and discuss a ceasefire to the war in Ukraine moving towards peacetalks and have parallel talks on energy supply to Europe. As if all that would happen.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 20 minutes ago, jagfox said: It's almost like countries should get around a table and discuss a ceasefire to the war in Ukraine moving towards peacetalks and have parallel talks on energy supply to Europe. As if all that would happen.. Seems unlikely that Russia would agree to returning the occupied territories even if Crimea is given as a win for Russia which Ukraine don't seem keen on then it's unlikely Russia would be able to pay for the damages to Ukraine caused by their invasion which seems like a bare minimum outcome of the talks. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagfox Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 Ukrainian government seem entrenched in no ceasefire or negotiations. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bairnardo Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 Ukrainian government seem entrenched in no ceasefire or negotiations. Seems to me like they have to maintain tough rhetoric throughout. Ukraine have ground the whole thing to a position of relative stalemate so I guess they have something to take to the negotiating table certainly more than week one of the war. It surely wouldn't be in their negotiating interests to not be talking up their belief, and intention, to win the war? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 14 minutes ago, jagfox said: Ukrainian government seem entrenched in no ceasefire or negotiations. They were involved in negotiations in Turkey back in the spring until Boris flew in to make them an offer they obviously didn't want to refuse. As long as NATO keeps the cash flowing they will keep sending working class Ukranians into the meat grinder. If the dollar tap turns off whoever replaces Zelensky will start negotiating. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todd_is_God Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 23 minutes ago, jagfox said: Ukrainian government seem entrenched in no ceasefire or negotiations. Easy to commit to an endless war when it's being externally funded. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 20 minutes ago, jagfox said: Ukrainian government seem entrenched in no ceasefire or negotiations. Russia are never going back to their 2021 positions far less 2014 unless they're forced to. The land bridge between Donbass and Crimea is the first stage of separating Ukraine entirely from the Black Sea, either now or later, which would finish Ukraine as a viable state. It would be pointless for Ukraine to make any concessions now, Russia have gone too far to back down. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todd_is_God Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 1 hour ago, welshbairn said: At a minimum they could impose windfall taxes on suppliers to pay for fuel subsidies. France froze gas prices back in October 21 and capped electricity price rises to 4%, partly helped by fully nationalising EDF, which is still charging full whack to UK households btw, thus the need for concerted action. They may have frozen consumer prices, but by fully nationalising EDF the French Government will be absorbing all of the astromical losses this entails. This will need to be repaid at some point. The same losses that will need to be absorbed and later repaid if / when the price cap is frozen here. 1 hour ago, Detournement said: Imported gas is accounts for 20% of UK energy use but the international price of gas in the futures market is being used to set the price for 100% of UK energy consumption. The solution to this is to unpeg electricity costs from the price of gas, instead charging end users for electricity at the cost to produce it depending on energy source. This is both possible and miles away from implementing a global price cap on the wholesale gas market. I also believe this will happen at some point next year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagfox Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 12 minutes ago, Todd_is_God said: They may have frozen consumer prices, but by fully nationalising EDF the French Government will be absorbing all of the astromical losses this entails. This will need to be repaid at some point. The same losses that will need to be absorbed and later repaid if / when the price cap is frozen here. The solution to this is to unpeg electricity costs from the price of gas, instead charging end users for electricity at the cost to produce it depending on energy source. A postcode lottery on energy bills. I'm sure that would go down well with voters. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTChris Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 15 minutes ago, jagfox said: Not sure that the decree details how they plan to achieve this - will they draft more conscripts, recruit more contract soldiers or mobilise more? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagfox Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagfox Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 32 minutes ago, ICTChris said: Not sure that the decree details how they plan to achieve this - will they draft more conscripts, recruit more contract soldiers or mobilise more? There will probably be another decree going into how the numbers will be achieved shortly haha Not a general mobilisation so probably a mix of recruitment and maybe extending period of national service? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagfox Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todd_is_God Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 Why on earth would anyone clap this? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 28 minutes ago, Todd_is_God said: Why on earth would anyone clap this? From the woman who said we should all go over and fight I'm just relieved she didn't say "I'd push it right away" But you're right even if Russia nuke us what's the point in killing millions of innocent civilians just to make a point. Bizarre that it's a well rehearsed question in these hustings and scary that folk think it's a point for celebration. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 23 minutes ago, 101 said: From the woman who said we should all go over and fight I'm just relieved she didn't say "I'd push it right away" But you're right even if Russia nuke us what's the point in killing millions of innocent civilians just to make a point. Bizarre that it's a well rehearsed question in these hustings and scary that folk think it's a point for celebration. It's a bit of a pointless question, any PM who said differently would be as good as giving up the nuclear deterrent which Truss is obviously not about to do. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todd_is_God Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 12 minutes ago, welshbairn said: It's a bit of a pointless question, any PM who said differently would be as good as giving up the nuclear deterrent which Truss is obviously not about to do. The question isn't really the point I was making mind. It's just such an odd thing for people to applaud and for her to then smile about. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bairnardo Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 The question isn't really the point I was making mind. It's just such an odd thing for people to applaud and for her to then smile about.Being willing to suffer as ling as other folk suffer slightly worse/ o one has it better than you is a cornerstone of Britishness. Hardly surprising the prospect of being the ones to torch the entire world gets the blood labouring through their clogged up vessels just a little bit faster. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TxRover Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 4 hours ago, jagfox said: Ukrainian government seem entrenched in no ceasefire or negotiations. Well, to be honest, if the Jerries held Kent, the Isle of Wight, Devon and most of Cornwall, and the French and US wandered in with a proposal to call a ceasefire and let the Jerries keep the Isle of Wight if they gave back the rest, how excited would No. 10 be? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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