The Queen of the South thread

[Homer Thompson]

13 minutes ago, steakpiegravy said:

Not saying Sunderland didn’t have some ball skills but he was a passenger most days at that level and really unable to compete for 50:50 balls. I would happily bet money that he won less than 10 headers during his time at Queens. We used to have this thing where we could trace every goal Queens lost back to a missed challenge or error by him. Queens have a proud history of effective wee midfielders but he wasn’t one of them.

Sunderland was nearly 6ft tall

[steakpiegravy]

Sunderland was nearly 6ft tall

Really!? Well that makes his heading even worse[emoji23]

[Distant Doonhamer]

6 minutes ago, Mr X said:

Sunderland was nearly 6ft tall

5ft 6 when he jumped though 

[19QOS19]

5ft 6 when he jumped though [emoji6]

Scott Robertson was a great player for that. He seemed to master the ability to jump down when going for a header.

[Guest Flash]

1 hour ago, Skyline Drifter said:

Jon Sunderland was a winger though, he wasn't there to win headers! 

Somebody should tell Naysmith this and maybe we’d stop launching nearly every goal kick and kick off in the general direction of the furthest away point on the touchline.

[Fae_the_'briggs]

32 minutes ago, Flash said:

Somebody should tell Naysmith this and maybe we’d stop launching nearly every goal kick and kick off in the general direction of the furthest away point on the touchline.

Grant Anderson (pre-Naysmith)   is another example of a winger who is "not there to win headers" being used as a wide target man to win headers. Most of the niggling injuries he picked up when he was here came as a result of him landing awkwardly or being caught by the opposition when jumping for headers.  Lyndon Dykes,  when deployed out wide,  is also used a a target man for heading the ball down (mostly unsuccessfully)  for his teammates.  Our goalkeepers actually practice long kick-outs to the wings in their pre-match routine so it's not as if the management discourage this tactic. 

[palmy_cammy]

I think it is very obviously a deliberate tactic that was brought in by Skelton and continued by Naysmith.  It certainly isn't a very successful one however.  The alternative is for it to be played short to one of our defenders, who invariably just launch it up the field anyway.  Hopefully plans are in place to sign a centre half who is comfortable with the ball at his feet as this will make a huge difference.  As will the addition of Harkins who should be able to drop off and give the goalkeeper and defenders and option in the centre of the park.

 

Edited June 6, 2018 by palmy_cammy

[Skyline Drifter]

22 minutes ago, palmy_cammy said:

I think it is very obviously a deliberate tactic that was brought in by Skelton and continued by Naysmith.  It certainly isn't a very successful one however.  The alternative is for it to be played short to one of our defenders, who invariably just launch it up the field anyway.  Hopefully plans are in place to sign a centre half who is comfortable with the ball at his feet as this will make a huge difference.  As will the addition of Harkins who should be able to drop off and give the goalkeeper and defenders and option in the centre of the park.

It was absolutely a deliberate tactic brought in by Skelton and he signed Grant Anderson and took to playing Dykes wide for that reason. It was also intended to take advantage of Lee Robinson's kicking prowess.

I dont particularly see it as being one we have carried on under Naysmith though when he was here Robinson continued to kick it long and wide even once Anderson had gone. There is obviously sometimes a temptation to go long to Dykes as he is good in the air and when he played wide that was where it went but I dont think its a particular Naysmith tactic. If Danny Carmichael had been fit more we wouldnt gave been playing high balls to him.

Edited June 6, 2018 by Skyline Drifter

[Guest Flash]

2 minutes ago, Skyline Drifter said:

It was absolutely a deliberate tactic brought in by Skelton and he signed Grant Anderson and took to playing Dykes wide for that reason. It was also intended to take advantage of Lee Robinson's kicking prowess.

I dont particularly see it as being one we have carried on under Naysmith though when he was here Robinson continued to kick it long and wide even once Anderson had gone. There is obviously sometimes a temptation to go long to Dykes as he is good in the air and when he played wide that was where it went but I dont think its a particular Naysmith tactic. If Danny Carmichael had been fit more we wouldnt gave been playing high balls to him.

You are joking, right? I mean, I know people can see things differently, but I’m starting to think I’m having a Pamela Ewing moment and I imagined the whole of last season.

[Fae_the_'briggs]

14 minutes ago, Skyline Drifter said:

It was absolutely a deliberate tactic brought in by Skelton and he signed Grant Anderson and took to playing Dykes wide for that reason. It was also intended to take advantage of Lee Robinson's kicking prowess.***

 

***Tell me you're joking.  Lee Robinson continually launching balls into the crowd was one of the main reasons fans turned against him, as well as his clownlike behaviour of course.  Kicking prowess is probably the last thing you would associate with him,  in the latter phase of his Queens career anyway. 

[Skyline Drifter]

1 hour ago, Flash said:

You are joking, right? I mean, I know people can see things differently, but I’m starting to think I’m having a Pamela Ewing moment and I imagined the whole of last season.

You did or I did. I dont recall any great tendency to hit long to wingers per se though I already conceded there was a tendency to clear long at Dykes who was often playing on the wing. Its not quite the same thing though. We werent hitting long balls at Murray, Stirling, Carmichael and Thomas that I remember.

54 minutes ago, Fae_the_'briggs said:

***Tell me you're joking.  Lee Robinson continually launching balls into the crowd was one of the main reasons fans turned against him, as well as his clownlike behaviour of course.  Kicking prowess is probably the last thing you would associate with him,  in the latter phase of his Queens career anyway. 

Lee Robinson's kicking season before last was extremely disappointing and got worse as the season went on but it had previously been perceived as a very strong part of his game and it was certainly a deliberate tactic to have him aim long balls wide to Anderson and Dykes. It worked pretty well for about a quarter of the season too.

Edited June 6, 2018 by Skyline Drifter

[19QOS19]

...to Dykes as he is good in the air...

Might as well jump on the disagreement bandwagon [emoji38]

I don't think Dykes is particularly good in the air. I don't think it's a coincidence that he performs better when the ball is played into his feet as opposed to being lumped up to him.

[Fae_the_'briggs]

1 minute ago, Skyline Drifter said:

You did or I did. I dont recall any great tendency to hit long to wingers per se though I already conceded there was a tendency to clear long at Dykes who was often playing on the wing. Its not quite the same thing though. We werent hitting long balls at Murray, Stirling, Carmichael and Thomas that I remember.

Lee Robinson's kicking season before last was extremely disappointing and got worse as the season went on but it had previously been perceived as a very strong part of his game and it was certainly a deliberate tactic to have him aim long balls wide to Anderson and Dykes. It worked pretty well for about a quarter of the seadon too.

So didn't work at all well for three-quarters of  the season yet was persevered with. Also Dykes may win a good few headers but he rarely knocks it down to a teammate, not always his fault of course,   but flicks it behind himself where it's easily dealt with by defenders. 

[palmy_cammy]

1 hour ago, Skyline Drifter said:

It was absolutely a deliberate tactic brought in by Skelton and he signed Grant Anderson and took to playing Dykes wide for that reason. It was also intended to take advantage of Lee Robinson's kicking prowess.

I dont particularly see it as being one we have carried on under Naysmith though when he was here Robinson continued to kick it long and wide even once Anderson had gone. There is obviously sometimes a temptation to go long to Dykes as he is good in the air and when he played wide that was where it went but I dont think its a particular Naysmith tactic. If Danny Carmichael had been fit more we wouldnt gave been playing high balls to him.

I would imagine 95% of our goalkeeper kickouts last season were aimed at Dykes's head.  He was probably played out wide for at least half of his appearances, possibly more.  It seemed pretty deliberate to me.

Also "Lee Robinson's kicking prowess" 

[steakpiegravy]

38 minutes ago, Fae_the_'briggs said:

 Also Dykes may win a good few headers but he rarely knocks it down to a teammate, not always his fault of course,   but flicks it behind himself where it's easily dealt with by defenders. 

Agree with this. Dykes can be excellent in the air but is infuriatingly inconsistent, both during the game and game to game. He has the odd game where he looks like a player then seems unable to replicate it  . Must be a nightmare for the manager to be honest.

[SUPERSOUTH]

Get the ball on the deck I think Harkins coulis have a big influence in this dropping off and collecting the ball from the back, type of player we haven't had recently and should get the best out of both Dobbie & Dykes. Would like to see a little more movement in on the transfer front soon tho, lots of our league rivals are strengthening squads daily. Come on Naysmith and the board the Holiday period is over.... 

[weeredbook]

11 minutes ago, SUPERSOUTH said:

Get the ball on the deck I think Harkins coulis have a big influence in this dropping off and collecting the ball from the back, type of player we haven't had recently and should get the best out of both Dobbie & Dykes. Would like to see a little more movement in on the transfer front soon tho, lots of our league rivals are strengthening squads daily. Come on Naysmith and the board the Holiday period is over.... 

We will be waiting on the dross .

[Guest Flash]

1 hour ago, Skyline Drifter said:

You did or I did. I dont recall any great tendency to hit long to wingers per se though I already conceded there was a tendency to clear long at Dykes who was often playing on the wing. Its not quite the same thing though. We werent hitting long balls at Murray, Stirling, Carmichael and Thomas that I remember.

Virtually every goal kick was aimed at Dykes. When he was playing on the left, the ball was aimed there. When he was playing through the middle, he stood on the left touchline and the ball was aimed there. At Palmerston, when we’re shooting into the Terregles end, almost every goal kick is aimed towards the East Stand. When we’re shooting the other way, they are aimed towards the old stand. In both cases, the ball is launched at Dykes. When he wasn’t playing all that well, I actually thought he was only in the team because otherwise we wouldn’t know what to do with goal kicks. If it wasn’t a deliberate tactic, then all four of the keepers who have played under Naysmith must have been allowed to do what they liked. Eta and it just so happened that they all chose to punt it to Dykes. 

Edited June 6, 2018 by Flash

[Come on queens]

If you can’t play the ball out from the back at goal kicks, what is the goalkeeper expected to do? Aim for the smallest player on the park? No you would aim for the tallest guy in the team. Anyone who’s played football at a decent level will tell you that any goalkeeper is told to kick the ball into wide positions from goal kicks, if they can’t play it out from the back. If you start punting straight down the middle and it’s headed by the defence, then they are straight back on top of you. By hitting it out wide if the defending team win the header it’s not going to go into such a dangerous area if it stays in play at all. I’ve not really seen any team in the division successfully play out from the back. If we had any players that comfortable on playing out from the back then we probably  wouldn’t have them for long. 

[weeredbook]

1 hour ago, Flash said:

Virtually every goal kick was aimed at Dykes. When he was playing on the left, the ball was aimed there. When he was playing through the middle, he stood on the left touchline and the ball was aimed there. At Palmerston, when we’re shooting into the Terregles end, almost every goal kick is aimed towards the East Stand. When we’re shooting the other way, they are aimed towards the old stand. In both cases, the ball is launched at Dykes. When he wasn’t playing all that well, I actually thought he was only in the team because otherwise we wouldn’t know what to do with goal kicks. If it wasn’t a deliberate tactic, then all four of the keepers who have played under Naysmith must have been allowed to do what they liked. Eta and it just so happened that they all chose to punt it to Dykes. 

Pretty much spot on .