CarrbridgeSaintee Posted 18 hours ago Share Posted 18 hours ago 16 minutes ago, The Moonster said: The bible says the universe is about 6,000 years old. The big bang happened 13.8 billion years ago. If God did create the big bang, it certainly wasn't a Christian god. The bible doesn’t claim a 6000 year old universe or even a 6000 year old earth IMO. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted 18 hours ago Share Posted 18 hours ago 5 minutes ago, CarrbridgeSaintee said: The bible doesn’t claim a 6000 year old universe or even a 6000 year old earth IMO. How old is it then? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarrbridgeSaintee Posted 18 hours ago Share Posted 18 hours ago 8 minutes ago, The Moonster said: How old is it then? I’d imagine it’ll be the age you stated, which was several billion years. What do you think? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarrbridgeSaintee Posted 18 hours ago Share Posted 18 hours ago (edited) 8 hours ago, milton75 said: I probably didn't phrase it well tbh. Put it this way, when I look up Christian characteristics of God, the stuff that comes up includes: Omnipresent: God is everywhere at all times Omniscient: God is all-knowing and knows everything Omnipotent: God is all-powerful All of which I think is a cleaner way of stating what I was trying to get across here: I'm genuinely curious as to whether Christians who really believe in God do believe those "Omnis" accurately describe him. In practical terms I suppose the have to - I can't see how a "God" figure could be vulnerable to time or physical assault, but I'm not Christian so not in the best place to understand. Ah fair play mate. Yes I believe the three Omni’s accurately describe God. As a Christian I’ll be the first to admit that I don’t understand everything, but if he is the creator of time, space and matter as per the Kalam Cosmological Argument (), then he’s unlikely to experience them in the same way as us. He’ll understand them more than anyone though. Edited 18 hours ago by CarrbridgeSaintee 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted 18 hours ago Share Posted 18 hours ago 13 minutes ago, CarrbridgeSaintee said: I’d imagine it’ll be the age you stated, which was several billion years. What do you think? Perhaps I should have phrased my question better. How old does the Bible suggest the universe (or even earth) is? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarrbridgeSaintee Posted 17 hours ago Share Posted 17 hours ago 13 minutes ago, The Moonster said: Perhaps I should have phrased my question better. How old does the Bible suggest the universe (or even earth) is? I don’t know. There are probably lots of different interpretations, but it’s not something I’ve ever looked into in great detail. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vietnam91 Posted 17 hours ago Share Posted 17 hours ago 9 hours ago, CarrbridgeSaintee said: Rejected the notion? They started the abolition movement because they were inspired by scripture. There was no picking and choosing. Take the bible passages in context and with their actual meaning and you’ll reach the same conclusion. Yes rejected the notion. All the way through both the old and new testament owning slaves is accepted and the rules pertaining to it are outlined. Even Peter and Paul got involved in the hippy new testament. So for the abolitionist's to reject and look to end slavery then they must have rejected the parts in the bible that sanction it. If the bible is God's unequivocal word then it's nothing more than rejecting the stuff that you find objectionable while picking and choosing which bit fits with your moral code the same as all Christian's have done for the past 2,000 years. But we are debating a book of short stories mostly with an element of supernatural about them, the vengeful old testament with Noah being 500 years old when he had kids, to the whole bin fire that is the story of Lot to Goliath being 10ft tall. Fast forward to walking on water, feeding 5,000 and turning water into wine. With all its inconsistencies and nonsense, why it gets any more reverence than other works of fiction such as Lord of the Rings or Star Wars is beyond me. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milton75 Posted 17 hours ago Share Posted 17 hours ago 19 minutes ago, CarrbridgeSaintee said: Ah fair play mate. Yes I believe the three Omni’s accurately describe God. As a Christian I’ll be the first to admit that I don’t understand everything, but if he is the creator of time, space and matter as per the Kalam Cosmological Argument (), then he’s unlikely to experience them in the same way as us. He’ll understand them more than anyone though. Cheers, that makes sense to me. It sound obvious, as I can't really see any way an ultimate being / creator of everything could be anything other than all-powerful, but then who knows. The reason it interests me is that I used to debate it with a work colleague who was a Jehovahs Witness. My position was that God being Omnipresent / Omniscient / Omnipotent means that there's no such thing as Free Will. He said I was talking nonsense as everyone makes their own decisions. I said, and still say, that we perceive that we make our own decisions, but it's not us that's the arbiter and judge at the end of the day, it would be God. And, if God is Omnipresent then my lifespan is nothing to him and he exists outside of linear time anyway. If he exists outside of linear time then any moral decision I am going to make has actually already been made, at least from his perspective. So while I think I've had free will, what I might do has already been done. Equally if he's Omniscient then he already knows every decision that (I perceive) I make before I make it. He knows it before I'm born. And if he's Omnipotent I only have the perceived ability to make choices because he grants me the "free will", albeit knowing already what my decision is. I don't think any of that truly reflects free will, and I think the concept is non-compatible with those Omnis. But I could be wrong. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted 17 hours ago Share Posted 17 hours ago 39 minutes ago, CarrbridgeSaintee said: I don’t know. There are probably lots of different interpretations, but it’s not something I’ve ever looked into in great detail. Is it not important to you or do you worry about the answers you'll find? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarrbridgeSaintee Posted 16 hours ago Share Posted 16 hours ago 35 minutes ago, The Moonster said: Is it not important to you or do you worry about the answers you'll find? I don’t see it as hugely important. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted 16 hours ago Share Posted 16 hours ago Just now, CarrbridgeSaintee said: I don’t see it as hugely important. Is it not important to understand why God created everything but waited 13 billion years to produce something which would understand him and put his word in a book? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarrbridgeSaintee Posted 16 hours ago Share Posted 16 hours ago 5 minutes ago, The Moonster said: Is it not important to understand why God created everything but waited 13 billion years to produce something which would understand him and put his word in a book? That’s a loaded question. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted 16 hours ago Share Posted 16 hours ago 2 minutes ago, CarrbridgeSaintee said: That’s a loaded question. It's really not but if you're not interested in debating it that's fine. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richey Edwards Posted 15 hours ago Share Posted 15 hours ago Shitebag mentality. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btb Posted 15 hours ago Share Posted 15 hours ago 48 minutes ago, The Moonster said: Is it not important to understand why God created everything but waited 13 billion years to produce something which would understand him and put his word in a book? It was a long weekend. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbaxters Posted 15 hours ago Share Posted 15 hours ago You're all going to be sorry! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarrbridgeSaintee Posted 15 hours ago Share Posted 15 hours ago 43 minutes ago, The Moonster said: It's really not but if you're not interested in debating it that's fine. OK, I’ll answer your question. I don’t think what you detail is important. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btb Posted 15 hours ago Share Posted 15 hours ago 1 minute ago, jimbaxters said: You're all going to be sorry! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blootoon87 Posted 15 hours ago Share Posted 15 hours ago 14 minutes ago, jimbaxters said: You're all going to be sorry! You're wasting your one and only shot at life believing this shite. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbaxters Posted 15 hours ago Share Posted 15 hours ago 11 minutes ago, Blootoon87 said: You're wasting your one and only shot at life believing this shite. Aye I would be much happier trying my absolute best to disprove it by regurgitating Stephen Fry videos. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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