Steve Clarke - in/out/general discussion

[Gmfc 23]

7 minutes ago, Chripper said:

People should genuinely get a grip and stop acting like entitled brats.

A little perspective is required: 

In the previous four years we've qualified for two major tournaments. The previous twenty years before that we qualified for nothing. 

This is a good time to be a Scotland fan. 

Yes. We lost tonight. We went out with a whimper, etc.

it is what it is.

I have no complaints. I feel magnanimous about it. We deserved to be eliminated tonight but the world will still keep on turning and we'll be ready for the World Cup qualifiers when it comes around.

We're lacking a goalscorer, top class centerbacks, a top keeper, a ball winning midfielder, a player with pace and a dribbler. 

On the horizon we have Doak coming through. We have Barron coming through. We have Hickey and Ferguson to come back from injury. We have Miller coming through. 

Will the aforementioned players make a difference? Hickey, Ferguson will and Doak could very well be a generation talent and I think Barron and Miller have potential. 

Sadly there's no keeper or goalscorer on the horizon.

As far as I'm concerned Steve Clarke has credit in the back. He's got us to two tournaments. Yes, we've only taken two points but at least we are qualifying. 

Clarke's contract is up after the World Cup. I said yesterday that I'd offer him a new contract, and I still would. 

We could be in a worse position than being knocked out of a European Championships.

Onwards and upwards.

We've qualified yes and shat the bed on both occasions. 

None of the last two euros were glorious failures they were just complete failures. 

You can only fk with the cock you've got but ffs at least go out fkn fighting instead of being a  fucking shitebag. 

Clarkes time is up. 

[Moonboot]

The result tonight will have me down over the next week or so but the lack of ambition for our country portrayed  by some folk in this thread makes me want to weep.

What is wrong with Scottish people that they find it acceptable to be pretty shit and not expect to ever be better?

[Waspie]

15 minutes ago, Moonboot said:

Reach for the stars.

Reach for the stars sounds nice but I was in France 98 and Germany 2024 and endured some amount of pish in between. The bigger picture is important. Clarke has done enough to earn another crack at it. 

[accies1874]

While I disagree with a lot of the pish spouted on here, I don't think it's unfair to question his future. I'd give Clarke the Nations League campaign to turn it around, like he did after disappointing summers in 2021 and 2022, but the ageing squad, a second tournament let-down, poor run of form and losing the run of himself at the end of this game all make we wonder if Clarke's race might be run. It's amplified by having a Scottish, Premier League level manager currently out of work, though a lot of the same criticisms would be levelled at Moyes were he to ever become manager. 

I thought that we were OK tonight up until we reached the final third, but Hungary did not look good at all so to create so little is poor. That's a result of missing Tierney and, to a much lesser extent, the RWBs, but there's also the chat about pressing being the best playmaker which means that things look turgid when either press isn't working or you're not given opportunities to press. We're not a great possession team, which is a very fair criticism of Clarke, but I don't think that this group is at their best as a possession team; their best and Clarke's best line up, but it requires us to be at 100% pretty much every game against decent opposition. Maybe it's a bit like when Klopp realised he had to move his Liverpool team away from heavy metal football to valuing possession a lot more. This is a real ramble and I'm not even gonna re-read it to see if it makes any sense. 

Imo it's wrong to say stuff like "he's got to go" and make out that it's an obvious decision to get rid as he's got us to two tournaments as well as League A in the Nations League, but I do think that things have gone a bit stale. Clarke's able to evolve so it might not be that we need to change manager, which is why I'm happy to give him the Nations League to see what he's learned from this tournament, however it's not like the last tournament which felt like the start of something; this one feels more like the end. 

[Vimto90]

The not qualifying for 20 years argument does my head in. 

Even if you don't use the 24 team euros & nations league back door chance argument surely it all comes down to the current crop. Be like saying Belgium getting to last 16 at a tournament few years back was good cause they hadn't done it for **enter years** 

We can absolutely get out a group with the squad we have under what can't be argued now a better manager.

Edited June 23 by Vimto90

[Bully Wee Villa]

Mildly off topic but has it been confirmed yet that we definitely qualify for Euro 2028? If we are going to go down the new manager route then feels like a time when we have basically two years of friendlies would be ideal to give them chance to experiment and find their best side.

[Gordon EF]

2 minutes ago, Bully Wee Villa said:

Mildly off topic but has it been confirmed yet that we definitely qualify for Euro 2028? If we are going to go down the new manager route then feels like a time when we have basically two years of friendlies would be ideal to give them chance to experiment and find their best side.

We'll play qualifiers. Best two host countries that don't qualify normally get the "host" spots.

There needs to be changes made. If Clarke is capable of bringing that change about, fine. If not, we should be bringing in someone who can.

[Jaggy McJagface]

17 minutes ago, Moonboot said:

The result tonight will have me down over the next week or so but the lack of ambition for our country portrayed  by some folk in this thread makes me want to weep.

What is wrong with Scottish people that they find it acceptable to be pretty shit and not expect to ever be better?

It is the history of the Scotland 

[MarkoRaj]

Thing that bothers me the most is Clark talked about being flexible.

We didn't have a plan b, just wait until the 80th minute to throw the kitchen sink.

Too many sacred cows like McGinn, McGregor and McTominay when it clearly wasn't working.

Hungary's plan was to keep it tight until 60 minutes and then go 2 up top. Then as it got more and more desperate they threw players up front

We skipped any tactical changes and just waited until 90 to throw Hanley up front.

We didn't have 2 strikers on at any point.

We didn't have any wingers on at any point.

We didn't at any point try to get in behind Hungary's defence.

Where is the tactical flexibility?

[Beckford]

Even if every squad player was fit, does anyone else believe our approach under Clarke would have been any different? Play for a draw every game and you get what we have over two euros! 

[2426255]

9 hours ago, 2426255 said:

No chance he's getting sacked. Enjoy your discussion. Especially @Bing.McCrosby, you've waited a long time for this. 

[eez-eh]

1 minute ago, 2426255 said:

No chance he's getting sacked. Enjoy your discussion. Especially @Bing.McCrosby, you've waited a long time for this. 

Everyone knows he isn’t getting sacked. You’re pointing out the blindingly obvious as usual.

It doesn’t stop people discussing whether he should carry on.

[HibeeJibee]

17 minutes ago, Bully Wee Villa said:

Mildly off topic but has it been confirmed yet that we definitely qualify for Euro 2028? If we are going to go down the new manager route then feels like a time when we have basically two years of friendlies would be ideal to give them chance to experiment and find their best side.

Reportedly they'll hold 2 places for any home nation who doesn't qualify.

That virtually guarantees qualification - especially if NI falls through.

[Moonboot]

7 minutes ago, Waspie said:

Reach for the stars sounds nice but I was in France 98 and Germany 2024 and endured some amount of pish in between. The bigger picture is important. Clarke has done enough to earn another crack at it. 

If I'd known how negative Steve Clarke was going to be, I'd rather we had not qualified in the first place. I could have enjoyed all the other football, which has been positive, energetic and entertaining. Not like watching Scotland.

I want more from a team representing my country than what Steve Clarke had them set up to do tonight. The manager was negative, cowardly and lacking in confidence in his players. I can't think of worse characteristics in a manager.

[2426255]

4 minutes ago, eez-eh said:

Everyone knows he isn’t getting sacked. You’re pointing out the blindingly obvious as usual.

It doesn’t stop people discussing whether he should carry on.

Enjoy your discussion. 

[Acastus]

1 hour ago, gerrymcc1978 said:

The thing is I’ve been quite happy with Clarke for the most part but it’s like he hasn’t learned that we cannot always been some passive attacking wise , I don’t see that changing . Terrible first game, vastly improved second game and when it comes to the crunch he just does not grasp that chance . 
 

if we had a go tonight and lost I don’t think many would complain too much 

Spot on mate. So passive attacking wise. I know we are limited but to maintian the same setup and personel for so long when its clearly not working in such a monumental game...

[AngusTheBull]

47 minutes ago, Hoose Rice said:

Everyone is moaning about the negative cautious football and how stubborn Clarke is.  Why do you think West Ham fans wanted Moyes punted? 

I’m not the biggest Moyes fan… but does anybody really think we’d have had only four shots at goal in three games under him?

There’s negative cautious football, and then there’s tonight.

[Moonboot]

38 minutes ago, Young Eddie said:

Need to be objective and look at the bigger picture. Whoever manages the side is working with more or less the same group of limited players.

SFA as always is the problem here. Why are our kids still playing 11 a side competitive games on full size pitches? Just focus on skills and technical side until the teenage years then start introducing competitive matches. Then we might have a team of 11 players who are comfortable on the ball, have mastered the basics and are coachable.

Then we can worry about who the manager should be. 

The fact of the matter is that a better manager with the same players would have comfortably won that game tonight. Hungary were there for the taking but our manager wanted to play it cagey. He chose negative tactics and a team full of players, including a few who hadn't turned up in the first 2 games and looked leg weary. If we'd freshened up the starting lineup we'd be celebrating tonight. 

The manager  is the problem, not the players.

[Moonboot]

7 minutes ago, 2426255 said:

Enjoy your discussion. 

Enjoy your acceptance of failure.

[Butters Scotch]

13 minutes ago, 2426255 said:

No chance he's getting sacked. Enjoy your discussion. Especially @Bing.McCrosby, you've waited a long time for this. 

That's pretty obvious, SFA handed out a big contract to him so will have to stick with him regardless unless the next qualifying campaign goes tits up  then I think it could be shoogly peg time then. 

I'm interested to hear your thoughts on the tactics, shape etc tonight? Are you gonna dare question it I wonder?