Junior Cup Draw

[Kennie]

23 minutes ago, Bestsinceslicebread said:

The junior cup final, I'm genuinely, and speaking from the heart here, still to find anyone who enjoyed the Junior cup final last season, it was horrendous.  I even know neutrals who went and told me it was rubbish. 

 

I don't know anyone could argue that it was a thrill a minute final. A lot of finals in a lot of cups seldom give you that. But the Scottish Junior Cup is not just about the Final. It is so much more than that.

The vast majority of teams know that they will not reach the final yet they still enter. As happens in loads of other cups.

[Bestsinceslicebread]

5 minutes ago, Kennie said:

We actually had 9 new entrants but lost 2 entrants from last season.

Hall Russell and Whitehills as you said.

St Cadoc’s and Finnart as new members from the West.

Kello Rovers returning after a ban. Rossvale and Pollok competing as non-members as allowed in the new rules.

Pumpherston returning to the competition and Camelon returning to membership from the East.

A total of 9 new clubs.

Syngenta folded and Harthill Royal did not take up Junior membership.

A loss of 2, making it a gain of 7.

Of the increase in Byes into the Second Round we gained 6 and lost one.

Beith as winners of the West Premier, Culter as Winners of the North Premier,

Carluke, Glenafton, (New Members of SFA) & Pollok, Camelon. (SFA Full members that did not participate last season).

We lost Syngenta.

Footnote -  In the West of Scotland it now has the same priority as the South Region Challenge Cup, the Strathclyde Cup and the West of Scotland League Cup. As voted for at the WoSFL AGM.

Rossvale?
Which one, as the higher team not changed to their new name yet? or are both in it?

Yes concur its treated the same priority in the WOSFL, is this the same in the other associations.   Also the WOSFL have to fulfill the fixtures by certain dates etc.. as you know and it should actually now be easier, i think to fit in with an earlier start but if there wasn't enough dates and it would make the season finish late and as the Junior cup is not part of the SFA curricular or is not their priority, they could step in / pressure to make sure the season finishes in time?  I don't think it would happen now all clubs down to 16 teams and earlier start for scheduling

[Bestsinceslicebread]

55 minutes ago, Kennie said:

I don't know anyone could argue that it was a thrill a minute final. A lot of finals in a lot of cups seldom give you that. But the Scottish Junior Cup is not just about the Final. It is so much more than that.

The vast majority of teams know that they will not reach the final yet they still enter. As happens in loads of other cups.

I know what its about about Kennie, I participated in it many times.  That reply was in context to the actual previous post that I replied too

Edited June 23, 2023 by Bestsinceslicebread

[Kennie]

1 minute ago, Bestsinceslicebread said:

Rossvale?
Which one, as the higher team not changed to their new name yet? or are both in it?

Yes concur its treated the same priority in the WOSFL, is this the same in the other associations.   Also the WOSFL have to fulfill the fixtures by certain dates etc.. as you know and it should actually now be easier, i think to fit in with an earlier start but if there wasn't enough dates and it would make the season finish late and as the Junior cup is not part of the SFA curricular or is not their priority, they could step in / pressure to make sure the season finishes in time?  I don't think it would happen now all clubs down to 16 teams and earlier start for scheduling

There's only one Rossvale. Caledonian Locomotives are a separate club and still Juniors.

[Guest MickGarvey]

12 minutes ago, Kennie said:

Footnote -  In the West of Scotland it now has the same priority as the South Region Challenge Cup, the Strathclyde Cup and the West of Scotland League Cup. As voted for at the WoSFL AGM.

If that is what the people voted for then I guess it ends my argument.

I assume having last year's experience behind you, and I recognise that the addition of two midweek match days to calendar. Will your expectations be that by 2nd March all clubs will have 10 fixtures remaining (20 played of 30) ensuring that the league will be completed by 4th May?

Clubs really should be forced to play midweek to ensure that no significant backlogs are experienced. In my humble opinion, it should be communicated that clubs will be expected to complete the league in thirds. 1st third of league fixtures completed by 28th October, 2nd third by 2nd March and the final league game for ALL CLUBS must take place on 4th May.

[Bestsinceslicebread]

14 minutes ago, Kennie said:

We actually had 9 new entrants but lost 2 entrants from last season.

Hall Russell and Whitehills as you said.

St Cadoc’s and Finnart as new members from the West.

Kello Rovers returning after a ban. Rossvale and Pollok competing as non-members as allowed in the new rules.

Pumpherston returning to the competition and Camelon returning to membership from the East.

A total of 9 new clubs.

Syngenta folded and Harthill Royal did not take up Junior membership.

A loss of 2, making it a gain of 7.

Of the increase in Byes into the Second Round we gained 6 and lost one.

Beith as winners of the West Premier, Culter as Winners of the North Premier,

Carluke, Glenafton, (New Members of SFA) & Pollok, Camelon. (SFA Full members that did not participate last season).

We lost Syngenta.

Footnote -  In the West of Scotland it now has the same priority as the South Region Challenge Cup, the Strathclyde Cup and the West of Scotland League Cup. As voted for at the WoSFL AGM.

Has there been a full list of tier 6 teams and below who are participating in the main Scottish cup this season been announced yet? 

[Kennie]

1 minute ago, Bestsinceslicebread said:

Has there been a full list of tier 6 teams and below who are participating in the main Scottish cup this season been announced yet? 

I'm still waiting to see the Format of the Scottish Cup.

[Kennie]

2 minutes ago, MickGarvey said:

If that is what the people voted for then I guess it ends my argument.

I assume having last year's experience behind you, and I recognise that the addition of two midweek match days to calendar. Will your expectations be that by 2nd March all clubs will have 10 fixtures remaining (20 played of 30) ensuring that the league will be completed by 4th May?

Clubs really should be forced to play midweek to ensure that no significant backlogs are experienced. In my humble opinion, it should be communicated that clubs will be expected to complete the league in thirds. 1st third of league fixtures completed by 28th October, 2nd third by 2nd March and the final league game for ALL CLUBS must take place on 4th May.

My expectations are the same as always. The Scottish weather will make a bigger impact on the schedule than any cup.

[Guest MickGarvey]

1 minute ago, Kennie said:

My expectations are the same as always. The Scottish weather will make a bigger impact on the schedule than any cup.

I recognise that the weather system plays its part. I would question the desire to play midweek games outside of the WoS Premier League.

I also do not think extending the season is the answer.

[Kennie]

10 minutes ago, MickGarvey said:

I assume having last year's experience behind you, and I recognise that the addition of two midweek match days to calendar. Will your expectations be that by 2nd March all clubs will have 10 fixtures remaining (20 played of 30) ensuring that the league will be completed by 4th May?

Clubs really should be forced to play midweek to ensure that no significant backlogs are experienced. In my humble opinion, it should be communicated that clubs will be expected to complete the league in thirds. 1st third of league fixtures completed by 28th October, 2nd third by 2nd March and the final league game for ALL CLUBS must take place on 4th May.

I've no idea where you got that date from nor why you think an extra date was bolted on to the end of last season Premier Division. It was always down as finishing by the 13th May to allow participation in the Lower Pyramid play-offs if required. (Which it wasn't).

[Guest MickGarvey]

1 minute ago, Kennie said:

I've no idea where you got that date from nor why you think an extra date was bolted on to the end of last season Premier Division. It was always down as finishing by the 13th May to allow participation in the Lower Pyramid play-offs if required. (Which it wasn't).

The date came from you Kennie, assuming you do circulate the fixture list?

When last season's fixture list was put out, the final fixture (30th game of the season) was 6th May. I have correlated the start date and end date of this season with last season hence where my dates have came from.

So judging by your comment was it only the Premier Division that was required to finish by the 13th May? Can we expect the First, Second, Third and Fourth to be extended to suit the demands of the fixture list?

Just for clarity, teams in those divisions had to fulfil fixtures up until the 27th May. I was certain I was using the correct terminology with bolt on, I wouldve thought it would be wise to have all sides in all divisions finishing in the same date to avoid any ambiguity.

Those additional competitive fixtures from the 13th May didnt come in handy this time for Glencairn whilst Cumnock had just over a fortnight thinking of ways to keep themselves busy and most probably in bubble wrap. 

[glensmad]

5 minutes ago, MickGarvey said:

The date came from you Kennie, assuming you do circulate the fixture list?

When last season's fixture list was put out, the final fixture (30th game of the season) was 6th May. I have correlated the start date and end date of this season with last season hence where my dates have came from.

So judging by your comment was it only the Premier Division that was required to finish by the 13th May? Can we expect the First, Second, Third and Fourth to be extended to suit the demands of the fixture list?

Just for clarity, teams in those divisions had to fulfil fixtures up until the 27th May. I was certain I was using the correct terminology with bolt on, I wouldve thought it would be wise to have all sides in all divisions finishing in the same date to avoid any ambiguity.

Those additional competitive fixtures from the 13th May didnt come in handy this time for Glencairn whilst Cumnock had just over a fortnight thinking of ways to keep themselves busy and most probably in bubble wrap. 

We were quite happy to be playing competitive fixtures up till 27th May instead of siting idle for a month before the cup final.

[Guest MickGarvey]

2 minutes ago, glensmad said:

We were quite happy to be playing competitive fixtures up till 27th May instead of siting idle for a month before the cup final.

That is all well and good, I'm not so sure Cumnock wouldve been had Glencairn won the cup.

[Bestsinceslicebread]

17 minutes ago, MickGarvey said:

The date came from you Kennie, assuming you do circulate the fixture list?

When last season's fixture list was put out, the final fixture (30th game of the season) was 6th May. I have correlated the start date and end date of this season with last season hence where my dates have came from.

So judging by your comment was it only the Premier Division that was required to finish by the 13th May? Can we expect the First, Second, Third and Fourth to be extended to suit the demands of the fixture list?

Just for clarity, teams in those divisions had to fulfil fixtures up until the 27th May. I was certain I was using the correct terminology with bolt on, I wouldve thought it would be wise to have all sides in all divisions finishing in the same date to avoid any ambiguity.

Those additional competitive fixtures from the 13th May didnt come in handy this time for Glencairn whilst Cumnock had just over a fortnight thinking of ways to keep themselves busy and most probably in bubble wrap. 

I think the Premier has to be sorted for the Lowland league Playoff between the champions of the SOSFL, EOSFL and WOSFL, that's the only thing that the SFA would really want sorted by a certain specific date so understand why the other divisions can be finished later.

[Bestsinceslicebread]

1 hour ago, jimbaxters said:

Point 1- Aye a dae,
Actually I never thought about you until my notifications came up that you mentioned me.
but as I'm in your head and by the sounds of it, you get off, (whatever way you get off), that you think your in my head then carry on

Point 2- Naw it isnae
Not sure what your meaning by this but if going by Fact, yeah the stuff I posted to your reply, if I state fact then they are fact.

Point 3- Ask St. Pats if any team in Scotland can progress
St Pats aint in the Pyramid, so wtf have they got to do with it, you can only progress if your in the pyramid, you have to be in it to progress and ultimately what SPFL2 teams do to Lowland and What lowland Do To WOSFL, the WOSFL do to outsiders, all hindering what could be an even better product

Point 4- Hyperbole is good sometimes but admittedly you're right on that one
Of course I am, usually when it comes to your comments, i know, crazy but its true

 

[glensmad]

45 minutes ago, MickGarvey said:

That is all well and good, I'm not so sure Cumnock wouldve been had Glencairn won the cup.

That's not a WoSFL issue though, the SJFA schedule when the Scottish Junior Cup Final is.

[Ginaro]

1 hour ago, Shannon said:

Interesting that Camelon have decided to compete in SJC and wonder if more East teams may join them again in the years to come?

We'll see what happens with the EOSFL fixture list, Camelon will get a bye in round 1 but if they have a league fixture on the round 2 date then they may well have to forfeit like Syngenta did last season. Unless the EOS fixture secretary gives them a free Saturday (on what was an international derby weekend last season) it would require either league or cup opponents to agree to moving one of the fixtures.

45 minutes ago, MickGarvey said:

The date came from you Kennie, assuming you do circulate the fixture list?

When last season's fixture list was put out, the final fixture (30th game of the season) was 6th May. I have correlated the start date and end date of this season with last season hence where my dates have came from.

So judging by your comment was it only the Premier Division that was required to finish by the 13th May? Can we expect the First, Second, Third and Fourth to be extended to suit the demands of the fixture list?

Just for clarity, teams in those divisions had to fulfil fixtures up until the 27th May. I was certain I was using the correct terminology with bolt on, I wouldve thought it would be wise to have all sides in all divisions finishing in the same date to avoid any ambiguity.

Those additional competitive fixtures from the 13th May didnt come in handy this time for Glencairn whilst Cumnock had just over a fortnight thinking of ways to keep themselves busy and most probably in bubble wrap. 

You may wish to familiarise yourself with the EOSFL fixture list, which had Premier Division games on 13th May and First/Second/Third games on 27th May. Kennie did nothing wrong in that regard. I'm sure this season if more midweek games are played - at the start of the season and more promptly when games are displaced due to cup fixtures - there should be fewer issues with fixture congestion.

[Kennie]

The season finishes in June.

The Premier Division has a deadline to meet to provide a champion to go forward (or not) to the Lowland League Play-Offs.

The new season starts now and the first game is on the last Saturday in July. As it was last year.

So far with all league fixtures in place the last game in the Divisions would be 30th March. But we all know that will not happen.

Games will get postponed for all sorts of reasons, so just because a Saturday doesn't have game attached to it doesn't mean we're into an extension.

[Thejackdaw]

2 hours ago, Kennie said:

I don't know anyone could argue that it was a thrill a minute final. A lot of finals in a lot of cups seldom give you that. But the Scottish Junior Cup is not just about the Final. It is so much more than that.

The vast majority of teams know that they will not reach the final yet they still enter. As happens in loads of other cups.

I've been very vocal In saying that the Scottish junior cup is a very poor shadow of its former self but I have to agree that even In its greatest ever days that I could count in the one hand how many decent cup finals that there were , they're quite often torturous to watch,  maybe too much pressure on the players just to win on the day,  maybe the TV cameras kind of gets to them , whatever the reason they're seldom good games to watch. 

Edited June 23, 2023 by Thejackdaw

[Kennie]

3 minutes ago, Thejackdaw said:

I've been very vocal In saying that the Scottish junior cup is a very poor shadow of its former self but I have to agree that even In its greatest ever days that I could count in the one hand how many decent cup finals that there were , they're quite often torturous to watch,  maybe too much pressure on the players just to win on the day,  maybe the TV cameras kind of gets to them , whatever the reason they're seldom good games to watch. 

It could be that teams are playing with a view to not losing, rather than going all out for the win.

Anyway, I need to go again. My 12 year old grand-daughter wants on the computer as the SPFL have heard that she does the fixtures for the West and they've asked her to get their fixtures sorted for next week.