2426255 Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 (edited) 1 hour ago, the snudge said: I wonder if there's any chance at all of Quansah being tempted? Seems a good big player and an upgrade on our current central defenders Wishful thinking. Ask yourself if you would commit to Northern Ireland, Wales or the Republic of Ireland if you had played for Scotland at underage levels, were at a good club and only 21 years old and you'll have your answer. If he was inclined to play for Scotland he wouldn't have played for the England underage levels and so it will only be a backup for him if his career doesn't pan out as planned. Edited May 13 by 2426255 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pie Of The Month Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 (edited) Hungary squad announced for their friendlies and with it being 26 presumably their Euros squad too barring injury (not sure if there's an opponents thread on the go) Edited May 14 by Pie Of The Month 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
German Jag Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 Germany have been releasing names in dribs and drabs the last day or so via various channels, as a build up to the official announcement at noon UK time on Thursday. Names confrimed so far are:- Manuel Neuer (Tor) Nico Schlotterbeck (Abwehr) Jonathan Tah (Abwehr) Robin Koch (Abwehr) Aleksandar Pavlovic (Mittelfeld) Chris Führich (Mittelfeld) Niclas Füllkrug (Angriff) Kai Havertz (Angriff) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butters Scotch Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 5 hours ago, Pie Of The Month said: Hungary squad announced for their friendlies and with it being 26 presumably their Euros squad too barring injury (not sure if there's an opponents thread on the go) We shouldn't have anything to fear playing this lot, more than beatable! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highlandmagar Posted May 15 Share Posted May 15 7 hours ago, Butters Scotch said: We shouldn't have anything to fear playing this lot, more than beatable! I am sure they say the same about us. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2426255 Posted May 15 Share Posted May 15 49 minutes ago, Highlandmagar said: I am sure they say the same about us. It's incredible what Rossi has done with his group of players - doesn't get enough publicity imo. A great success story showing how the strength of a team as a whole can make up for gaps in individual quality. Hungary are presently where Scotland want to get to. They don't get beaten often, even against the 'big' teams. Realistically a draw against them would have to be considered a decent result, but given we probably need to win one of the group games I understand why folk consider Hungary to be the weakest link. I think it's a misguided way of looking at personally. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggy McJagface Posted May 15 Share Posted May 15 Hungary are a much weaker team on paper than Switzerland (at least player for player) but the recent results of both countries would suggest otherwise. Despite their poor form, the Swiss have a great deal of tournament experience and always seem to qualify from their group. I think our games against both will be nerve wracking and could go either way. It really depends on which versions of the respective teams show up. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2426255 Posted May 15 Share Posted May 15 (edited) 1 hour ago, Jaggy McJagface said: Hungary are a much weaker team on paper than Switzerland (at least player for player) but the recent results of both countries would suggest otherwise. Despite their poor form, the Swiss have a great deal of tournament experience and always seem to qualify from their group. I think our games against both will be nerve wracking and could go either way. It really depends on which versions of the respective teams show up. Maybe on paper. Hungary have with that group of players managed under Marco Rossi to hold their own against pot-1 nations. Scotland are still on a journey to reach that level. Hungary have survived a season in UEFA Nations League A. Scotland are still on that journey too. This is the Hungarians 3rd successive European Championship (2nd under Rossi) compared to Scotland's two under Clarke. I think there's a strong case that they're a bit further along in their journey than Scotland are and therefore a team that we'll be doing quite well to beat. Added to that they're not missing any key players from the squad they announced. Edited May 15 by 2426255 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggy McJagface Posted May 15 Share Posted May 15 1 hour ago, 2426255 said: Maybe on paper. Hungary have with that group of players managed under Marco Rossi to hold their own against pot-1 nations. Scotland are still on a journey to reach that level. Hungary have survived a season in UEFA Nations League A. Scotland are still on that journey too. This is the Hungarians 3rd successive European Championship (2nd under Rossi) compared to Scotland's two under Clarke. I think there's a strong case that they're a bit further along in their journey than Scotland are and therefore a team that we'll be doing quite well to beat. Added to that they're not missing any key players from the squad they announced. Sorry if I didn’t word it correctly but I do broadly agree with this. They’re clearly a good team that are better than the sum of their parts, but when you look at their squad and who they play for it’s even more impressive considering there aren’t many leading names. The Swiss squad is full of players playing in the Bundesliga, EPL, Serie A etc whereas Hungary only have a few at that level surrounded with a smattering of 2nd tier players and guys playing outwith the big 5 leagues, which was my point. In any case, I could see Hungary, Switzerland and ourselves finishing in any order next month and think it’s very difficult to predict. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butters Scotch Posted May 15 Share Posted May 15 You can be pessimistic all you want but we shouldn't be 'fearing' either in one off games to be honest nor should they fear us. If we struggle against the likes of Hungary or Switzerland and put in bad performances against them with one of the best Scottish teams we've had in decades then i think most fans will be rightly pissed off and think, what a missed opportunity. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2426255 Posted May 15 Share Posted May 15 4 minutes ago, Butters Scotch said: If we struggle against the likes of Hungary or Switzerland and put in bad performances against them with one of the best Scottish teams we've had in decades then i think most fans will be rightly pissed off and think, what a missed opportunity. What's your basis for thinking that? It's based on what we have player wise? anything else? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butters Scotch Posted May 15 Share Posted May 15 1 minute ago, 2426255 said: What's your basis for thinking that? It's based on what we have player wise? anything else? Do we not have the world's best coach that does no wrong and take us to glory? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2426255 Posted May 15 Share Posted May 15 Just now, Butters Scotch said: Do we not have the world's best coach that does no wrong and take us to glory? Our coach is good, but even he said it's not just about what Scotland have available to them player wise in his recent interview with Tom English. He said fans only look at what's in their team and don't really bother focusing on what their opponents have. It was the part with the discussion around Scotland teams from the 80's that weren't successful. I haven't transcribed it so don't have the quote to hand. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butters Scotch Posted May 15 Share Posted May 15 4 minutes ago, 2426255 said: Our coach is good, but even he said it's not just about what Scotland have available to them player wise in his recent interview with Tom English. He said fans only look at what's in their team and don't really bother focusing on what their opponents have. It was the part with the discussion around Scotland teams from the 80's that weren't successful. I haven't transcribed it so don't have the quote to hand. I can't agree with the statement (if true) regarding, "He said fans only look at what's in their team and don't really bother focusing on what their opponents have". I don't think normal footballs fans are so oblivious to think like this even in the 80s. There was probably a lot of optimism as we were playing inferior teams we were expected to beat which we didn't, I would say that was down to the team's failure more than anything. Majority of folk know that Switzerland and Hungary are good teams who are better than us currently, results have shown that. However, there is no such alarming drop off to us, we can certainly beat them if our team performs to the level we all know they can and compete with teams like these. Surely you should have a bit of belief about your team to beat nations like this, it's no as if i'm talking about a France, Portgual, England etc. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Diamond For Me Posted May 15 Share Posted May 15 It's certainly much easier for fans - never mind coaches and so on - to be reasonably well-informed on teams from other countries now than it was in the 1980s. TV, the internet, much easier to get to Eastern European countries in person... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
immcinto Posted May 15 Share Posted May 15 I go by Transfermarket Market Values to determine a nations relative strength in depth. Number of players from a country with values 5Meuros or above. Maybe a bit arbirtrary but it is one way to tell if you are over or under performing. Scotland have 17 players Swiss 24 Hungary 8 Far from perfect, but it gives you an idea. If you were trying to relatively rate teams further down the ranking you need to drop to 1M to get a large enough sample size Other interesting ones are Ireland 12, Wales 11, NI 3. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2426255 Posted May 15 Share Posted May 15 (edited) This is what Steve Clarke said when asked by Tom English why he thinks Scotland haven’t ever qualified from the group stage at a major tournament if it’s not a talent issue given the players we had in previous generations. Quote I think you always look at your own squad and think that’s a good squad - a lot of good players there, but other Nations are thinking that as well. Other nations also have good squads and when you get to that sort of level of competition you have to get everything right. Steve Clarke I agree with it. Supporters/media will big up a Scottish player like Shankland because they are exposed to him all the time, but happily dismiss the Hungarian or say Swiss equivalent. That's normal and natural, no one's going into depth on other teams - that's Clarke's job, but still causes an an issue in terms of expectations as there's a knowledge gap if you base your expectations solely on what you have player wise. I think you're falling into that particular trap @Butters Scotch. Edited May 15 by 2426255 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSJ.84 Posted May 15 Share Posted May 15 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butters Scotch Posted May 15 Share Posted May 15 45 minutes ago, 2426255 said: This is what Steve Clarke said when asked by Tom English why he thinks Scotland haven’t ever qualified from the group stage at a major tournament if it’s not a talent issue given the players we had in previous generations. I agree with it. Supporters/media will big up a Scottish player like Shankland because they are exposed to him all the time, but happily dismiss the Hungarian or say Swiss equivalent. That's normal and natural, no one's going into depth on other teams - that's Clarke's job, but still causes an an issue in terms of expectations as there's a knowledge gap if you base your expectations solely on what you have player wise. I think you're falling into that particular trap @Butters Scotch. What Clarke has said there is right, I don't think I have said anything to contradict that and have said very similar things in other posts. Your follow on paragraph isn't the same as what he has described either. I haven't dismissed any of the other two nations and there isn't some knowledge gap from me anyway. I think if we play to our top level then we are thoroughly capable of beating them and the same could be said for Switzlerand & Hungary against us. I mentioned fans will be pissed off if we struggle to compete against them, if we play well and narrowly lose cause of some flukey goal then so be it, that happens and I can accept that. If we are deservedly beaten by both, it should be seen as a failure IMO. Shankland is being talked about by some posters cause we are struggling in that particular position and he is an option worth considering, I don't think anyone is completely bigging him up and people know his limitations. Hungary actually have a very similar issue to us on that front playing Martin Adam a lot despite being in a poor league. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyline Drifter Posted May 15 Share Posted May 15 17 minutes ago, PSJ.84 said: So no suggestion it will be a "long list" or anything like that. He'll name the "26" although potentially he may have a short standby list in addition and of course there's the opportunity to name doubtful players and still replace them in the subsequent week or so. That date is of course before the respective Cup Finals / EFL Championship play off final too so injury will remain a possibility. So Armstrong, Jack, and more particularly Hickey and Patterson have 7 days left to see where they are at. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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