What is the point of labour ?

[BFTD]

1 hour ago, Alan Twelve said:

I was about to post that very link. I can understand a lot of their caution and desire not to be seen to be too radical, but do they really believe that this is going to gain them votes? 

Yeah, probably. The idea will be that anyone left of Genghis Khan will be desperate to be rid of the Conservative horror, so they only need to reassure enough of the hang 'em and flog 'em crew to slip into power by default.

[doulikefish]

Pmqs....No question from sir Keir about the  Israel/Palestine situation

[Highlandmagar]

2 minutes ago, doulikefish said:

Pmqs....No question from sir Keir about the  Israel/Palestine situation

Totally in behold to the Jewish community. 

[Billy Jean King]

1 minute ago, doulikefish said:

Pmqs....No question from sir Keir about the  Israel/Palestine situation

Absolute charlatan. At least Mhairi Black did it for him albeit she was met with the old "Israel can do what it wants" trope that is "we respect the right of Israel to defend itself"

[Sherrif John Bunnell]

Starmer is up against an utterly pathetic PM and somehow never manages to lay a glove on him.

[Granny Danger]

25 minutes ago, doulikefish said:

Pmqs....No question from sir Keir about the  Israel/Palestine situation

 

21 minutes ago, Billy Jean King said:

Absolute charlatan. At least Mhairi Black did it for him albeit she was met with the old "Israel can do what it wants" trope that is "we respect the right of Israel to defend itself"

It’s beyond any understanding that the deputy leader of the third largest party in Parliament is the one who has to raise this issue at PMQs.  Rather than evolving we’re going backwards.

[O'Kelly Isley III]

2 hours ago, Sherrif John Bunnell said:

Starmer is up against an utterly pathetic PM and somehow never manages to lay a glove on him.

Well, Sir Keir is merely channelling Denis Healey's famous put-down to Geoffrey Howe about 'being attacked by a dead sheep'.

[Highlandmagar]

The Labour Party are just as vile and disgusting as the Tories. I hope they rip themselves apart and blow the next GE.

Edited October 25, 2023 by Highlandmagar

[GHF-23]

You'd think if your entire value proposition to the electorate was being the kind of people who did all their homework at school you'd make sure your Shadow Chancellor didn't lift a bunch of her piece of vanity publishing directly from Wikipedia and the Guardian 

ETA the actual article ffs 

https://www.ft.com/content/e4c190b0-cc4e-4dc4-945b-9f680ce1c67f 

 

Edited October 26, 2023 by GHF-23

[GTG_03]

On 25/10/2023 at 06:24, carpetmonster said:

It's like they're actively looking for pledges to pish on now. 

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/oct/25/labour-u-turns-on-promise-of-scottish-style-right-to-roam-in-england

Abolish student fees - naw, f**k that

Renationalise the utilities - ehhh....maybe just the railways...maybe

Rosebank? Drill em if you got em!

Who can we shit on now?  I've got it boss! Ramblers....

I can honestly still see Starmer blowing it. When is the next general election, a year away? He's going further and further right to shore up those Tories. There must be millions of centre and centre left voters aswell as centre right who aren't keen on this version of labour.

Who will they all vote for?

A part of me wants him to blow it so they can sort themselves out and actually be the Labour party, it would be nice to have a choice at an election. Not just 'hard right or not quite as hard right.' 

[vikingTON]

3 minutes ago, GTG_03 said:

I can honestly still see Starmer blowing it. When is the next general election, a year away? He's going further and further right to shore up those Tories. There must be millions of centre and centre left voters aswell as centre right who aren't keen on this version of labour.

Who will they all vote for?

There's literally no evidence to support that claim.

Quote

A part of me wants him to blow it so they can sort themselves out and actually be the Labour party, it would be nice to have a choice at an election. Not just 'hard right or not quite as hard right.' 

How did this Real Laebur Party deal work out for them in the most recent election? 

[Salt n Vinegar]

21 hours ago, doulikefish said:

Pmqs....No question from sir Keir about the  Israel/Palestine situation

"Don't mention the war..."

The Mother(fkkr) of Parliaments? Fawlty Towers, more like.

[RuMoore]

9 hours ago, Highlandmagar said:

The Labour Party are just as vile and disgusting as the Tories. I hope they rip themselves apart and blow the next GE.

 

26 minutes ago, GTG_03 said:

A part of me wants him to blow it so they can sort themselves out and actually be the Labour party, it would be nice to have a choice at an election. Not just 'hard right or not quite as hard right.' 

Oh look, it's that thing that never happens happening again.

[lichtgilphead]

45 minutes ago, RuMoore said:

 

Oh look, it's that thing that never happens happening again.

What thing that never happens?

Hoping that Labour f*ck things up is not the same as hoping that the Conservatives win. 

Personally, I would be happy with a hung parliament with Labour holding most seats & the SNP holding the balance of power.

You've been given ample opportunity to provide proof of your claim that SNP supporters on here are hoping for a Tory win at the next GE. The two posts that you have quoted do not advance your case

TL:DR - Stormzy is still persisting with his deluded pish.

[GTG_03]

1 hour ago, virginton said:

There's literally no evidence to support that claim.

How did this Real Laebur Party deal work out for them in the most recent election? 

Badly, but that was mainly down to Corbyn not being an effective leader and his own MPs coming out against him.

53 minutes ago, RuMoore said:

 

Oh look, it's that thing that never happens happening again.

I said 'a part of me'. If it comes down to it I'd want labour over the conservatives. It just doesn't really feel like it would be much of a win. Are they going to bring about any real change or just a managed decline? 

[Wee-Bey]

Tbf it would be funny if they fucked it and failed to get an overall majority, unlikely though.

Equally funny and more likely is that the tories are wiped out on an incredibly low turnout by a party that no one particularly likes, offering nothing much in particular.

 

[Sherrif John Bunnell]

It's proper Old Firm fan behaviour to not understand that some people want both the Tories and Labour to fail miserably.

"Aye, but who's yer big team pal?"

[Granny Danger]

10 minutes ago, Sherrif John Bunnell said:

It's proper Old Firm fan behaviour to not understand that some people want both the Tories and Labour to fail miserably.

"Aye, but who's yer big team pal?"

In fairness my big team is the political party in Scotland with the biggest support and the largest number of elected representatives.

[GHF-23]

35 minutes ago, Ziggy Sobotka said:

Tbf it would be funny if they fucked it and failed to get an overall majority, unlikely though.

Equally funny and more likely is that the tories are wiped out on an incredibly low turnout by a party that no one particularly likes, offering nothing much in particular.

 

Yeah, while I think it's pretty mental to be like @RuMoore and be genuinely enthusiastic for a Starmer government, it's much more mental to pretend at this point that anything other than a Labour landslide is at all likely, or that Labour Right (provided they don't do another war) isn't the lesser of two evils. You don't have to vote for them but the "as bad as the toaries" is getting tiresome, if they do even the limited things they say they'll do (which tbf I can understand people doubting given they are deeply dishonest and unpleasant people (they are, of course, politicians)) then the country will at least be less of a car crash and something that can maybe, potentially be built on?

There's nothing to the left which is an option, and as @virginton says, look how that worked out last time. The whole country needs the window moved and maybe getting used to the idea of Government as something which even tries to do dull managerialism properly rather than exist to wind the population into a froth before anything to the left of Thatcher will be electable in this country. I don't expect a Starmer led Labour government to actually do the above, it's shite but that's where it is. I, of course, plan to emigrate.

Edited October 26, 2023 by GHF-23

[Wee-Bey]

19 minutes ago, GHF-23 said:

Yeah, while I think it's pretty mental to be like @RuMoore and be genuinely enthusiastic for a Starmer government, it's much more mental to pretend at this point that anything other than a Labour landslide is at all likely, or that Labour Right (provided they don't do another war) isn't the lesser of two evils. You don't have to vote for them but the "as bad as the toaries" is getting tiresome, if they do even the limited things they say they'll do (which tbf I can understand people doubting given they are deeply dishonest and unpleasant people (they are, of course, politicians)) then the country will at least be less of a car crash and something that can maybe, potentially be built on?

There's nothing to the left which is an option, and as @virginton says, look how that worked out last time. The whole country needs the window moved and maybe getting used to the idea of Government as something which even tries to do dull managerialism properly rather than exist to wind the population into a froth before anything to the left of Thatcher will be electable in this country. I don't expect a Starmer led Labour government to actually do the above, it's shite but that's where it is. I, of course, plan to emigrate.

I don't disagree with any of this really, but it is a best case scenario that is likely to fly out the window at some point. 

It's highly likely they take their forthcoming thumping victory as an endorsement of their programme (austerity, punting off the NHS, sacking up to big business, crackdowns and flag shagging) rather than the obvious collapse of the tories. Which would be a huge error and likely results in them becoming incredibly unpopular within a year or two. Throw in any number of crises, maybe a nice sensible war, the consensus that Labour governments move to the right when in power (maybe Starmer has done all his moving beforehand, although that is more hope than expectation) and we're looking at some fun times ahead.