ObserverFromAfar Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 Just to knock this point on the head, there's never been any suggestion of taking over and killing another club in the trust's plan. Excellent use of a "lessons learned" reports from the inception of Livingston that resulted from the take over of Meadowbank. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livi Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 My daughter was playing guitar at a concert at her school for the last time before she leaves for Uni in the summer. I felt it was important to be there to support her.I was kept updated of the score by txt messages. I went to the PotY do last night to show my support and have a word with the players. Didn't see you there though Shame - you missed an exciting game. I had already committed to supporting one of the supporters' clubs football team on a fundraiser they were holding that night long before the club decided to hold any event. Get everything you needed on Saturday in McArthur Glen ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCL Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 Get everything you needed on Saturday in McArthur Glen ? Yes thanks. Just the normal Saturday Night takeaway though 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingfaetheSooth Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 I agree, compare how much livi fans sit about arguing with each other to Stirling fans doing absolutely everything they can to save their club, hundreds of volunteers, fundraising, trying to buy the club etc etc and you see just how embarrassing livi fans are in this situation.The stirling fans have come up with a plan and every single on of their fans is trying to do something about it, while Livi fans sit on their arse arguing with each other while this man ruins their club. Some people always say Livi aren't a real club compared to others and a franchise and their fans aren't as good as others which although i dont agree with, the way stirling have gone about it is what real football fans do, i dont see any excuses for why Livi aren't. At the end of the day Livvy fans are newbies who have no history of supporting the club beyond one generation. Stirling Albion are a club worth saving. You're right, but the thing is Livvy have ALWAYS been vulnerable to this kind of thing due the very fact they are a "franchise" club. If you analyse it enough, that has made them an appealing proposition to a certain type of ambitious businessman who fancies building a lucrative, successful football club by moulding it utterly and buying success.It may be harsh, but there really is an artificial air about Livingston, because any success they had was not based on any real foundation of history or community involvement. They started as effectively a blank canvas for some spiv to mould his own dream out of. The fact that the bulk of their fans have taken part in this dream en masse, and for them Livvy are an SPL team who have slipped up in recent times, merely adds to the unreality of it all. Livvy have no real history with generations of fans to create an ethos and spirit like almost all other clubs have. They are an artificial proposition fuelled by opportunists' money and (understandably) supported by a generation of fans buying into a very false dream. THAT'S why, now that it's come to the crunch, they have no idea whatsoever how to go about saving their club or even coming together as a band to protect the club that's never really been theirs in the first place. Spot-on. Thing is, Griffiths isn't a Theo Walcott.........not by a million miles. Hell, he isn't even close to McCarthy at Hamilton. Anyway, I digress. Actually, much of what is written isn't so far off the mark. Livi fans have tended to be junkies for "heroes pumping in cash because we are special". It's always been this way. You lurch from one crisis to the next, because if there isn't a McGuinness to be relieved of his millions, then income never comes close to meeting expenditure. Now, if it's true that Massone has paid only the players he believes he doesn't want to be able to claim breach of contract (i.e., get a transfer fee), then right there is the measure of the man. I'm sure he is a plausible individual, but those who met him are starry eyed because they've just come into contact with the Hawthorne Effect. A bit of external interaction, and they'll improve their outlook to the point of suspending their normal decision making behaviours because they are flattered by and responding to external attention. They feel they are on the inside track. Are they really? Of course not. I bet you anything you like Massone is trying to lever the stadium from the council for a pittance, or on the never never. Since your loyalty to the club exceeds your loyalty to the council, you'd happily let him get it too because ultimately, you don't care about a loss to the public purse, you just want your club to be "better" and to "move forward". It's the way some fans can be.You want to believe. Massone is completely reliant upon nothing more than spreading a few seeds of doubt until he can have one last turn of the cards.........and if it fails, he'll blame the council. He doesn't have the money to pay the players. He doesn't have the money to run the club. The club are spending more than they earn. The club are running up debts (again!). You really cannot run back to the well marked "administrators". Lets say you sell Griffiths for 200k. Where will that money go? Can you tell me with any certainty? Has Massone proven to any Livingston fan that in all matters fiscal, he plays with a straight bat? Livingston fans really do need to start fearing the worst instead of hoping for the best. Your clubs reputation has been rock bottom for a long time now. You really do need to start thinking about how to bring about change. The longer you are scared of existance without a benevolent dictator in charge, the more likely the chances of you being erased from the footballing map. You wanted Hunter to pump in money, you wanted Keane to pump in money. You wanted Flynn to pump in money. Now you want to believe Massone will pump in money. You need to face up to what Livingston FC really are. A middle ranking first division club with a core support of about 1,000. By all means, grow, but do it organically. Stop looking for the next adrenalin rush from a millionaire who loves you. Another post that hits nail on head. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mabawsa_Ritchie Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 I see the Livingston Official site has been down since Saturday - server maintenance apparently. :lol: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Germinator Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 There are 5 active CCJ's running at the moment for approx £20K. Perhaps one of these has something to do with the website? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbo Posted May 11, 2009 Share Posted May 11, 2009 I see the Livingston Official site has been down since Saturday - server maintenance apparently. Get yer facts right man. It's been down since Thursday. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livi Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 Get yer facts right man. It's been down since Thursday. Begining to think the website hasn't been paid rather than them working on it. Or maybe its been hacked again 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonsilitis Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 Excuse my ignorance if I'm wrong but I don't think the HMRC are actually one of our long-awaiting creditors at the moment. I would be very surprised if Livi do not owe VAT and/or PAYE. I have yet to be involved in an insolvency case that does not have these debts. Add to that the fact that both the VAT and PAYE authorities are under instruction to take a soft line at the moment to try to help as many companies survive the credit crunch as possible and I would expect that Mr Massone is paying them just enough to prevent insolvency action. Having said that, Massone does seem to be adept at paying those debts that have to be paid. I would speculate that that this has happened already with some debts where the creditors have gotten themselves into a position to force liquidation. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LIVIFOREVER Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 I would be very surprised if Livi do not owe VAT and/or PAYE. I have yet to be involved in an insolvency case that does not have these debts. Add to that the fact that both the VAT and PAYE authorities are under instruction to take a soft line at the moment to try to help as many companies survive the credit crunch as possible and I would expect that Mr Massone is paying them just enough to prevent insolvency action.Having said that, Massone does seem to be adept at paying those debts that have to be paid. I would speculate that that this has happened already with some debts where the creditors have gotten themselves into a position to force liquidation. Livi fc had outstanding debt for both the IR and the rent for the stadium when Massone took charge, he said a pay,ent plan had been set up for both, whether he kept the payments up is anyones guess but i've not heard anything about the IR chasing him for money. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick cash Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 Talk on Radio Scotland tonight of SFL sanctions including Livi being relegated to Div 3, based on the fact that they are breech of the SFL number 1 principle of member clubs honouring players contracts 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calum_gers Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 Talk on Radio Scotland tonight of SFL sanctions including Livi being relegated to Div 3, based on the fact that they are breech of the SFL number 1 principle of member clubs honouring players contracts Question that instantly came to me on hearing that was if that were to happen. Do Airdrie get to stay up? Do the team who lose the play-off final get to go up ( if airdrie get relegated ) or the team who finish 2nd in the 2nd division ( assuming they are not the team that goes up anyway ). Typically Scottish for this to get incredibly messy. Anyhoo, 1) It's hypothetical at this stage 2) Sorry for butting in 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick cash Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 There was a precedent set last year and Airdrie as losers of the play offs got to stay up 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monster Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 After all that's happened it would be sweet if they were demoted, especially if other clubs that have been victims of their finagling were to benefit. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoTeamGaz Posted May 12, 2009 Share Posted May 12, 2009 let's hope it doesn't come to Livi folding (perhaps being relegated to div 3 to ensure survival!) I believe that the club who loses the playoff final would be promoted If Livi AND Clyde go, who knows how there going to judge it (have a third place plyoff game ) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingfaetheSooth Posted May 14, 2009 Share Posted May 14, 2009 I see that Massone is back in court tomorrow. http://www.scotcourts.gov.uk/rolls/sheriff...090515.htm#SMCL Anyone know if this relates to the drink-driving charge or something else? Bit disappointed that the Daily record are not on to this. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allstars #9 Posted May 14, 2009 Share Posted May 14, 2009 dunno but the boy huttons going down 17 charges!!!!!!!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RTDEE2 Posted May 14, 2009 Share Posted May 14, 2009 Livi website has one page. One page, you've only got one page, you've only got one page. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banjo player Posted May 14, 2009 Share Posted May 14, 2009 I see that Massone is back in court tomorrow.http://www.scotcourts.gov.uk/rolls/sheriff...090515.htm#SMCL Anyone know if this relates to the drink-driving charge or something else? Bit disappointed that the Daily record are not on to this. It's listed under "criminal" so it will be the drunk in charge case. I wonder if his key witness has made it across from Italy or if he will find another excuse to have the case continued? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livi Posted May 14, 2009 Share Posted May 14, 2009 It's listed under "criminal" so it will be the drunk in charge case. I wonder if his key witness has made it across from Italy or if he will find another excuse to have the case continued? Rumour in Livi is he has 2 cases at court. Not confirmed at this stage & is just still a rumour 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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