Livingston - all the threads merged

[LIVIFOREVER]

On paper it maybe looks an attacking set up, but it doesn't play out like that, wasn't at Killie but from what i've read it was the same as yesterday, very little goal threat. We have the players to get down the wings and get balls across for Anderson, but we aren't playing at all to do that. Nouble has stopped taking players on and hitting the byeline, to run into the box and fire a ball across the 6 yard box, instead he takes the easy/lazy option and passes to another player. MacKay has blistering pace but again isn't using it. We had him as the player up the pitch when defending a set piece, but don't lump it straight up to him, for a quick counter. He showed against Motherwell how good he is getting in behind defenders with his pace, and even playing against us when Caley humped us, we need to start playing to attacking players strengths.

Dropping Nouble would be a start, we're far too reliant on him, and when he isn't performing well we're knackered. We've got Penrice, Montano (once he's served his suspension), Brandon and Mackay, all 4 would be great with 2 on each wing, MacKay up the right wing, and Montano on the left. That would get us hitting the byelines and balls into the box. For me, Nouble slows everything down, as he waits for defenders to come to him before making his move, which was fine when he took them on and got past them and continued up the pitch, but he's not doing that now, and is now just slowing down our attacks. MacKay and Montano are more aggressive in attack and run at defenders putting them on the back foot.

On Montano, he was the one bright spark in attack, driving up the wing, and looking to get the ball forward, once he was red carded we had no attacking threat at all, and it was all Dundee. I also think his sending off may have been the reason we conceded to set pieces, he's good in the air, can't be a coincidence when he was missing we conceded those type of goals. Two balls into our box that bounced through everyone till a Dundee player got onto it. The 2nd goal was particular annoying because de Lucas stopped marking the goal scorer, the first was just a scramble.

We need to sort out our defending of set pieces, hopefully Obileye is back against Hearts, but we also need to get our attack sorted, because right now we're toothless up front.

[Livi La Vida Loca]

So in our last 3 games we have had 4 shots on target, 2 of which have been penalties and that right there is our biggest problem.

Last season we were the lowest scorers in the league but this season Martindale has opted to focus more on being defensively solid than scoring goals. No matter how good you are defensively you have to score to win games....

For me our current system and formation are guff. 

No matter how good we are defensively our goal threat is non existent. I'd love for Martindale to come out and tell us what his attacking philosophy is because then we could determine if he's to blame or if the players simply aren't following instructions. 

 

In my opinion with or without Nouble our best formation I think is a 4-2-3-1  where we use the channels. It allows reduces reliance on having 3 fit centre backs which seems to be a big issue. 

Nouble needs to be dropped but that won't happen for 1 of 2 reasons:

1. When he's interested he's a game winner

2. Martindale is clearly hoping to get something for him come January so needs him in the shop window

 

Should add that Martindale bemoans our budget and fan base a fair amount but to improve both he needs to produce a team that's worth watching and sadly so far this season he's failed to do so.

Edited October 29, 2023 by Livi La Vida Loca

[Scrutinizer]

Some on here were saying all will be fine at the back when Devlin's back from injury, well what's happened there ?

As for young talent Bradley and Makay are not going to get any better,you can hope, wait,it's not going to happen

The midfield is a shambles  static, Kelly,Shinnie, are done at this level far to slow no movement or industry from them,

Holt and Pittman have been good players over the years but time moves on

Pittman is done , Holt is on the downwards  slope, he plays in a position that's basically not productive, you can pass the ball around at the back all day it doesn't get you goals

If you're all waiting for Nouble too come good you'll have a long wait

Don't be frightened to say it Guthrie is not worth his wages ,useless

Montana and Penrice are the only 2 players that can inject pace without losing the ball

Sangare  has some nice touches, his work rate  and pace is nowhere good enough

Its obvious  Livi  don't have Scouts  taking in any games ,I honestly could go  find  some decent young players with pace,hunger, and  do the  basics CONTROL PASS,RUN with the ball without  constantly  making an arse of it , and would gladly take the wages this lot are on..

[Freedom Farter]

Nouble's been up against the same defensive set up the last two weeks. Their right centre back was his marker then their holding mid was shadowing in front of him. If the ball ever did get to him, both those oppinents pounced immediately. He had Portales and Sylla completely shackling him this way in the first half yesterday.

Hearts are looking to finish third in the league and have a home crowd expecting attacking football. Its less likely they'll bother with a specific defensive plan for Nouble. So while its of course true he's been poor the last two games, I'm unsure dropping him for this next match is the answer. He might get more space in it and be able to play again.

Another option is to play a 3-4-1-2 and have him up front alongside Anderson. That stops opponents being able to double up on him as he'll be receiving the ball too far forward for their defensive mid(s) to latch onto him. Or if they do still try that it'll drag their defensive mids deeper, giving our centre mids more space to play in. Just playing him up front would also reduce his defensive and tactical burden. He could do his natural thing of dropping deep or drifting wide depending on where the space was.

[EdinburghLivi]

4 minutes ago, Freedom Farter said:

Another option is to play a 3-4-1-2 and have him up front alongside Anderson. That stops opponents being able to double up on him as he'll be receiving the ball too far forward for their defensive mid(s) to latch onto him. Or if they do still try that it'll drag their defensive mids deeper, giving our centre mids more space to play in. Just playing him up front would also reduce his defensive and tactical burden. He could do his natural thing of dropping deep or drifting wide depending on where the space was.

I would even be in favour of him playing as the 9 with Anderson playing at the 10 compared to the current situation. Despite how well he played against Hibs, he's still way more effective when he's further up the pitch and particularly in the wide areas. 

He's clearly low on confidence (probably not helped by some idiot screaming at him next to the commentators yesterday). There was a chance in the second half at the edge of the box, where he had the chance to run past Beck on the outside (one of his signature moves) but for some reason seemed hesitant to do so and went inside instead. He got crowded out and the chance was gone. 

He's been off form but the fans shouting at him need to calm down a bit and support him. Martindale, in turn, needs to make sure he's in areas of the pitch where we can get the best out of him. He's dealt with several markers well in the past and if he gets back to form, he will do so again.

[Freedom Farter]

1 hour ago, EdinburghLivi said:

I would even be in favour of him playing as the 9 with Anderson playing at the 10 compared to the current situation. Despite how well he played against Hibs, he's still way more effective when he's further up the pitch and particularly in the wide areas. 

He's clearly low on confidence (probably not helped by some idiot screaming at him next to the commentators yesterday). There was a chance in the second half at the edge of the box, where he had the chance to run past Beck on the outside (one of his signature moves) but for some reason seemed hesitant to do so and went inside instead. He got crowded out and the chance was gone. 

He's been off form but the fans shouting at him need to calm down a bit and support him. Martindale, in turn, needs to make sure he's in areas of the pitch where we can get the best out of him. He's dealt with several markers well in the past and if he gets back to form, he will do so again.

Definitely. Martindale is actually putting Nouble in an area where its easiest for the opposition to deal with him. That left attacking mid role has him too deep and too central. It stations him perfectly for opposition defensive mids (generally those are the best tacklers in a team) to snap in on him as soon as he gets the ball. Plus he has the right centre back following him everywhere when we play teams that use 3 centre backs. 

The 3-4-2-1 is fine if we want to be defensively solid but play Nouble as the striker in it and bring Stephen Kelly in as the left attacking mid. I hate to slag our players but Guthrie is getting too much playing time. Martindale viewing Nouble as a forward would hopefully see less need for Guthrie. In the 3-4-2-1 pick Anderson or Nouble at striker. In a 3-4-1-2 we can have them together up front which is ideal. 

Aye, I remember clearly that moment when he didn't have his usual confidence to dribble. Bradley was lacking confidence too yesterday I felt. Martindale said in his match review fans behind the dug out create a negative atmosphere. I've said before but its so weird for me to hear that as I sit the other end of the stand and you only get one negative shout a match, if that. Should maybe switch over the home and away dug outs!

[Livi]

According to companies house (website) Livi FC has not been transferred to the new owners as of today

 

Word on the street is that the new owners have not paid any of the £400k the club was sold for back in September.

[EdinburghLivi]

2 hours ago, Livi said:

According to companies house (website) Livi FC has not been transferred to the new owners as of today

 

Word on the street is that the new owners have not paid any of the £400k the club was sold for back in September.

No recent changes to Oppco6 either aside from Wilson resigning his directorship.

If the ownership changing is dependent on some outstanding payments coming, I feel like we may have dodged a bullet.

[ATLIS]

St Johnstone consider David Martindale move as Livingston boss joins 2 bosses in board thinking before crunch meeting - Daily Record
 

If he was to go (I'm sure I did this before) but theoretically who do we want in? McCabe, Murray, Neilson?

[Cptn Hooch]

23 minutes ago, ATLIS said:

St Johnstone consider David Martindale move as Livingston boss joins 2 bosses in board thinking before crunch meeting - Daily Record
 

If he was to go (I'm sure I did this before) but theoretically who do we want in? McCabe, Murray, Neilson?

I hope he stays but if he were to go then I'd like Bartley if it were a possibility. McCabe is an interesting shout too. He's done a fantastic job at Airdrie, is young and a fan of attacking football. Callum Carson might fall out with Livi though

[LIVIFOREVER]

Can't see it.

 

Slightly bigger than us, but not enough to tempt him. Plus a direct competitor for us staying up, and he's said numerous times it would be up to Livi if they said he could go, and there would be no way we'd consider that when it could end up him keeping them up and us going down. Really want St Johnstone to be a safety net for us staying up, if it came to us struggling this season.

[Livi]

8 hours ago, EdinburghLivi said:

No recent changes to Oppco6 either aside from Wilson resigning his directorship.

If the ownership changing is dependent on some outstanding payments coming, I feel like we may have dodged a bullet.

Looking at the publicly available accounts - last check Livi FC had £1m plus in the bank? 
 

Not sure what they would swerving? 
 

The point is no money (allegedly) has been handed over from the "new owner/s" and since it was announced in September nothing has really changed at the club either? 

[Livi]

8 hours ago, ATLIS said:

St Johnstone consider David Martindale move as Livingston boss joins 2 bosses in board thinking before crunch meeting - Daily Record
 

If he was to go (I'm sure I did this before) but theoretically who do we want in? McCabe, Murray, Neilson?

Very high chance he wouldn't go as he simply wouldn't have the control he does currently.at any other club.

The footballing department alone would fall apart quite quickly given who is in it if he was to leave.

Thats not an SPFL coaching team thats. In place thats set up for success 

 

[RandomGuy.]

58 minutes ago, Livi said:

Very high chance he wouldn't go as he simply wouldn't have the control he does currently.at any other club.

He probably would with us, on the football side.

Gus MacPherson is here but seems to deal entirely with the administrative side of things, and Alec Cleland is a coach, and beyond that he'd have free reign to build the football department as he saw fit. Youth side wouldnt need touched as Alistair Stevenson runs that and has multiple age groups excelling.

Does he actually want to be running your entire club the way its suggested he is, or would he rather just focus entirely on first team matters?

[101]

9 hours ago, Cptn Hooch said:

I'd like Bartley if it were a possibility

I'm sure Queens would be delighted if you took him off their hands, struggling away in L1 this year so it would be a pretty odd appointment.

[Troy.1995]

Get real.Martindale is going nowhere.Every year since we've came up to the SPL weve went through a tough spell,this season is no different.For me Davie will decide when its time for him to go.That won't be for the foreseeable future,and Livi fans in the majority know that.

[LiviLion]

11 hours ago, Cptn Hooch said:

I hope he stays but if he were to go then I'd like Bartley if it were a possibility. McCabe is an interesting shout too. He's done a fantastic job at Airdrie, is young and a fan of attacking football. Callum Carson might fall out with Livi though

Absolutely not. Don't get me wrong, if (when) he gets sacked by Queens I'd be delighted for him to come back into the role he had before, but there's no chance I'd want him in as manager.

 

Martindale won't go to St Johnstone unless they give him a hefty contract. He has a job for life here barring a winless season, and even at that no one would bat an eyelid at him just taking up a DoF position, he won't have that job security anywhere else in the world, which is why I could only see him moving on if it was to try his luck down south.

[Fife Saint]

Sniff sniff.

[RandomGuy.]

4 hours ago, LiviLion said:

 

 

Martindale won't go to St Johnstone unless they give him a hefty contract. He has a job for life here barring a winless season, and even at that no one would bat an eyelid at him just taking up a DoF position, he won't have that job security anywhere else in the world, which is why I could only see him moving on if it was to try his luck down south.

Sorry.

[LiviLion]

16 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

Sorry.

Is there something I've missed?