SJ1210 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Of course its a team sport in this context, but that doesn't strengthen any contention that Froome would have won had he not been supporting Wiggins to the yellow jersey. He has said himself that he learned a great deal during the 3 weeks, and no doubt some of what he learned came from Wiggins. Maybe their placings are bang on based on skill and experience. It's one of the things we'll never know but Wiggins didn't get that much time from Froome on the ITT stages (less than 2 mins for both TTs) and he could not match his speed and acceleration in the mountains. Wiggins is a bit like an Ullrich in that he can't jump onto attacks and on several occasions Froome rode Wiggins off his wheel with ease (and remember he wasn't doing this intentionally) and had to sit up and wait for him to get back on his wheel. The same goes for Van Garderen, he should have been BMC's number 1 rider long before he over took Evans for time. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musketeer Gripweed Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Anyone catch the raffle numbers? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drooper Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 It's one of the things we'll never know but Wiggins didn't get that much time from Froome on the ITT stages (less than 2 mins for both TTs) and he could not match his speed and acceleration in the mountains. Wiggins is a bit like an Ullrich in that he can't jump onto attacks and on several occasions Froome rode Wiggins off his wheel with ease (and remember he wasn't doing this intentionally) and had to sit up and wait for him to get back on his wheel. The same goes for Van Garderen, he should have been BMC's number 1 rider long before he over took Evans for time. I don't disagree with much of that (and particularly concur on BMC), but you have to look at Wiggin's season form. There's no way he could have been playing 2nd fiddle. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
printer Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 To be honest, while none of us really have any idea whether any of these guys really are doping, there is a decent case for Froome, having shot to prominence in the Vuelta last year from almost nowhere. Yes we do. Have you read Rough Ride, Bad Blood, David Millar's bio. It's endemic. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJ1210 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Will be interesting next year, regardless of whether its Wiggins or Froome who are going for yellow will Cavendish be happy to play 2nd fiddle again, he'll be wanting the green jersey back and don't know whether Sky (or any team) can realistically set out to get both the yellow and green jersey. There's already been talk from his previous DS at Highroad that he is unhappy. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Swedgin Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Will be interesting next year, regardless of whether its Wiggins or Froome who are going for yellow will Cavendish be happy to play 2nd fiddle again, he'll be wanting the green jersey back and don't know whether Sky (or any team) can realistically set out to get both the yellow and green jersey. There's already been talk from his previous DS at Highroad that he is unhappy. Could be one way for Sky to top this year. Green and yellow in 2013. I like the sound of that 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Swedgin Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 I was very impressed by LL Sanchez and Voeckler in the Tour. Where do all the main guys go after the Olympics? What races are coming up? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T_S_A_R Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 I was very impressed by LL Sanchez and Voeckler in the Tour. Where do all the main guys go after the Olympics? What races are coming up? after the olympics there is the third grand tour - the vuelta - which will see the return of alberto contador. the vuelta usually has the weakest line up of the three grand tours but the route is decent this year so it should be entertaining. all eyes will be on bertie. the reaction to bert's return will be interesting, wiggins has had a few wee public digs at him despite the fact that bert's positive would have had no effect on his performance. it'll be interesting to see how wiggins, the british press and the legions of newly minted sky fanboys reacts when contador kicks his arse in 2013. apart from the vuelta there are a few decent one day races - san sebastain and lombardy - and the worlds which has a cracking route in the ardennes area this year. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paisleysaints Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Good Tour dominated by Sky well done to them, there was a couple of big names missing but cant take anything away from them. what to watch on the tv now lol need the football back soon 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T_S_A_R Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 I may be way over the top here, but I think the fact that no Sky riders have tested positive for anything so far is a pretty good reason. Anyway, excuse my lunacy, let the hatred continue. is that you lance? you know fine well that there are legions of known dopers who have never tested positve. This weeks More Or Less podcast has a scientific look at the power outputs on this years tour. It's available free on iTunes or on the bbc website. Er, they're all clean how exactly can power outputs tell you that a rider is clean? they can certainly prove someone is doping but i don't get how they can show a rider is clean? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drooper Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 is that you lance? you know fine well that there are legions of known dopers who have never tested positve. how exactly can power outputs tell you that a rider is clean? they can certainly prove someone is doping but i don't get how they can show a rider is clean? Come on now, don't take all that bitterness surrounding your big team dying out on the good guys. Not all sportsmen are cheats. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gnash Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Interesting article on the BBC about how Wiggins managed to win. I'm not saying this proves he isn't doping, but his success is clearly plausible. And you can add to the list the weaker competition this year, with no Contador or Andy Schleck, and an off-form Evans. Yes we do. Have you read Rough Ride, Bad Blood, David Millar's bio. It's endemic. I was referring specifically to this year's Sky team. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Brightside Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 I wouldn't be surprised if it turned out everyone except Cavendish and Wiggins are doped up to the eyeballs. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorlomin Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Epic performance enhancing sideburns. Comes from the old school UK track cycling tradition of hammering round dilapidated velodromes (in his case Herne Hill) in crap weather with only some mates and a girlfriend watching. Got lucky in someways with the money coming into the sport (compared with Obree, Broadman and so on) but was part of a team that actually turned that money into a world class machine (oh hello UK swimming). Perhaps he is doping, or perhaps he just got the right team, the right training and a lucky race at the second half of his career when he fully shifted his focus to the road. Everyone can pick a side. Ill believe our boy is clean until proven otherwise. He is after all just about to head to the Olympics and under the BOA. You can dope past them then no has a chance. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musketeer Gripweed Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 All this doping talk is starting to piss me off now. If it does come out that Wiggins has been cheating feel free to point and laugh at me but for fucks sake, if there was ever going to be a pro rider who would never do that, Wiggins is your man. Come on. some of you must know about his family history? Anyway, the big winners and losers this year :- Winners - SKY, obviously. Liquigas as well. Huge turnaround for those two teams over the last two years. Lotto were good, as per usual. Losers - Despite winning the team classification Radioshack must be hugely disappointed. BMC look like they have to rebuild round Gilbert for next season as Cuddles looked finished. Cofidis. Have they actually done anything since they got thrown off the Tour about 8 years ago, with a certain new Knight of the Realm in the team? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJ1210 Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 (edited) the reaction to bert's return will be interesting, wiggins has had a few wee public digs at him despite the fact that bert's positive would have had no effect on his performance. it'll be interesting to see how wiggins, the british press and the legions of newly minted sky fanboys reacts when contador kicks his arse in 2013. I agree, Wiggins wasn't challenged at all this year and any attack was caught because of the work of the likes of Froome. Would love to see how he'd react to Contador's persistent and high speed attacks. Would also liked to have seen how they'd have coped with the old Schlek double team attack as well as Contador. There was no excitement in the mountains this year. Edited July 22, 2012 by SJ1210 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Brightside Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 All this doping talk is starting to piss me off now. If it does come out that Wiggins has been cheating feel free to point and laugh at me but for fucks sake, if there was ever going to be a pro rider who would never do that, Wiggins is your man. Come on. some of you must know about his family history? I think he is doping. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musketeer Gripweed Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 I think he is doping. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Brightside Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 Exactly, even Wiggins can't believe he has gotten away with it...so far. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T_S_A_R Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 All this doping talk is starting to piss me off now. If it does come out that Wiggins has been cheating feel free to point and laugh at me but for fucks sake, if there was ever going to be a pro rider who would never do that, Wiggins is your man. Come on. some of you must know about his family history? Anyway, the big winners and losers this year :- Winners - SKY, obviously. Liquigas as well. Huge turnaround for those two teams over the last two years. Lotto were good, as per usual. liquigas won the 2010 giro and vuelta. what does his family history have to do with anything? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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