WaffenThinMint Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 What disgusts me is Dundee fans even commenting on the situation. Your cheating club are just as bad as Rangers. Oh FFS Bunty, will you stick with the programme? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highland Dogma Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 Let me re-phrase Regardless of league positions, Aberdeen and United were our best clubs as borne out by their performances in Europe which has resulted in the fantastic restrospective high UEFA co-efficients etc etc indeed, between them over the course of only a few seasons they racked up a cup winners cup win, a super cup win, and european cup semi final and a uefa cup final...in 20 years of spending tens of millions ( In rfc case spending other peoples cash ) the of have failed to match that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hipster Dufus Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 "It's only when the tide goes out that you learn who's been swimming naked." Warren Buffet. The thought of any of the characters from the past 4 months skinny-dipping (The "Big House must stay open" guy, Mark Doughball, Jim Traynor, Chickenlittle Young) ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wunfellaff Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 Billy Dodds is there for comic effect only. He has the mental capacity of a twix. Image in my head now of Mike and Bernie Winters and the 'aw naw, theres two of them' Glasgow gag. He said he had read it but gave the impression he treats any 2 syllable word the same way the rest of the .population greets 'quantum' 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulcarm Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 (edited) The 'New Firm' was a bit of a myth as it was generally Celtic and Aberdeen which shared the top two spots. United won a couple of league Cups and some great runs in Europe but apart from their title in 1983, they never really came close again prior to or after 1983. Also, I dont think there was a co-efficent around then. You make a good point. At the risk of sounding like a bitter Dundee fan, I think United's title success in 83 owed a little to Aberdeen stretching themselves in Europe. Jim McLean was an outstanding coach though and I wish we gave him the job at Dens he desperately wanted in the 70s. The New Firm wasn't a myth because I don't think the idea of the New Firm was that they totally dominated Scottish football. It was that they challenged. As much as I hated being second best in the city part of me does miss being a kid when Rangers and Celtic were regularly beaten. The season before Murray arrived and brought Souness in and started dumping all the shit that is now hitting the fan, Dundee went to the last day with Rangers in the battle for a European spot. That's quarter of a century ago and a lot of medals, trophies and European trips that went to the wrong team. That's why this "treat them gently" shite really fucks me off. Edited May 12, 2012 by paulcarm 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuckinho Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 indeed, between them over the course of only a few seasons they racked up a cup winners cup win, a super cup win, and european cup semi final and a uefa cup final...in 20 years of spending tens of millions ( In rfc case spending other peoples cash ) the of have failed to match that. By not paying tax Rangers have in effect spent OUR money on 20 years of rubbish in Europe. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The DA Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 You make a good point. At the risk of sounding like a bitter Dundee fan, I think United's title success in 83 owed a little to Aberdeen stretching themselves in Europe. Jim McLean was an outstanding coach though and I wish we gave him the job at Dens he desperately wanted in the 70s. Dee fan jealous of United's success. That was unexpected. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuckinho Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 (edited) Will you folk keep focussed on the task at hand - slaggin off Rangers for their complete stupidity. You can take up your rivalry afterwards perhaps. Edited May 12, 2012 by Chuckinho 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xatraps Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 The biggest problem is this saga has produced much chat and has muddied the waters as to the general consensus of what is being said. There is few that actually believe the crowds will flow back to watch football but many believe that without 2 old firm teams it opens up scottish football again. Yes Celtic will be dominant but a bad season for them will mean the chasing pack closer and finally a chance to break this duopoly in voting and prize money. Yes there is most likely to be a lot less income without Rangers but once again it is about finding the right level for scottish football. The prices and wages have been dragged up to a false level that is unsustainable by the attendances. Yes the quality of player will suffer but it is something most small teams fans have seen when they have been in the 1st division and are happy to take that consequence. Most clubs have made efforts to get there debts under control at the expense of their playing squad. Ironically if the clubs started developing younger players that are on longer contracts they would most likely see money coming in for those players again. The current basis of operating is paying high wages for loan deals and short term deals where the player walks away for free. A more competitive league does not make a 'better' one. Logically, as money is the main driver of football these days, if it is reduced it reduces the standard. Teams are paying beyond their means even now. Imagine trimming the budget more if the effect of Rangers leaving is as bad as the SPL clubs are now making out. Fans of a club in the 1st div might be happy in the understanding relegation has effected the standard of player they are able to attract and quality of football played, but they would always be safe in the knolwedge that there was a promotion back to the SPL available. Europe is the only financial cherry on offer if the 'meltdown' without Rangers happens. Can teams compete in Europe if their budget is reduced? SPL fans seem more willing to accept the financial hit without Rangers than club officials, I'm not sure I buy into the 'disaster' myself, but some SPL clubs obviously do. I cant believe there are people buying into this bullshit that we all somehow need Rangers for Scottish football to survive. With Rangers still in the SPL next season, we will have effectively killed the sport of football in this country. We cant condone the cheating, criminality and the sheer arrogance of both staff and support of this blight on our game. Think about it - Cheating is wrong - Allowing a team who've cheated both society and the sport for a number of years is morally wrong and completely unjust. There is absolutely no reasoning in allowing them to continue - newco or not, they need a fitting punishment and not a ridiculous token gesture that the complete morons who call themselves our "media" are calling for. The fact is that they should be expelled from Scottish Football and stripped of any titles they've won through cheating or criminality. All this talk of Scottish football dying if they are no longer in it is just ridiculous. I think the real reason they've not been killed off is fear. The SPL, SFA, Duff and Duffer are ALL shitting it because they know the knuckle dragging element of their fans will be baying for blood. All these adjournments and deadlines - all stalling tactics incase they upset the "Fans" Pull the plug and be done with it. Scottish football will survive without Rangers. But it is becoming increasingly clear that people of influence in the game believe that the survival of Rangers is paramount to their own survival. Someone has to decide what will be the main driver of Scottish football. Money or Integrity? At the moment money is winning by a landslide. I predict it to stay well out in front and romp home at a canter. Rangers will be in the SPL 2012/13. -3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The DA Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 A more competitive league does not make a 'better' one. Yes it does. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invalid Probe Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 "Can teams compete in Europe if their budget is reduced?" Compared to this season they can't do any worse. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
placidcasual Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 By not paying tax Rangers have in effect spent OUR money on 20 years of rubbish in Europe. The TV comedy gold they've given us against the likes of Kaunas and Urinea et all means this viewer gives it a big thumbs up. Better value than the license fee. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
black sapper Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 Oh FFS Bunty, will you stick with the programme? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wunfellaff Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 Rangers will be in the SPL 2012/13. And where they obtain the Uefa license to achieve this? Against SPL regs so its a no no. Forget the newco this, wealthy buyer that, the truth is they may well return, probably 2017/18 at the earliest. They are fecked ma boy, accept it like the rest of the forum. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaffenThinMint Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 A more competitive league does not make a 'better' one. Logically, as money is the main driver of football these days, if it is reduced it reduces the standard. Teams are paying beyond their means even now. Imagine trimming the budget more if the effect of Rangers leaving is as bad as the SPL clubs are now making out. Fans of a club in the 1st div might be happy in the understanding relegation has effected the standard of player they are able to attract and quality of football played, but they would always be safe in the knolwedge that there was a promotion back to the SPL available. Europe is the only financial cherry on offer if the 'meltdown' without Rangers happens. Can teams compete in Europe if their budget is reduced?SPL fans seem more willing to accept the financial hit without Rangers than club officials, I'm not sure I buy into the 'disaster' myself, but some SPL clubs obviously do. Scottish football will survive without Rangers. But it is becoming increasingly clear that people of influence in the game believe that the survival of Rangers is paramount to their own survival. Someone has to decide what will be the main driver of Scottish football. Money or Integrity? At the moment money is winning by a landslide. I predict it to stay well out in front and romp home at a canter. Rangers will be in the SPL 2012/13. Back in the 1970s and 1980s, when Marks and Spencers got themselves into bother first time around, there was much panic about the prospect for British retail without them, as there were so many companies that were tied exclusively into producing items for them, whether clothes or food or whatever, and that they'd all go under without them. Surprise surprise, all those beleaguered suppliers that couldn't possibly survive without being tied to the apron strings of M&S did survive - by supplying to others. In the 1990s, the Big Four supermarkets started effectively charging companies for the privilege of having their items stocked in their shop, then for having them on the "eye level" shelves. Most fell into line because the perceived wisdom was if they didn't they would go bust without kowtowing to the Big Four. All except for PG Tips, who told the supermarkets to go do one (with Unilever approval - who were looking to "rationalise" the old Brooke Bond portfolio and crashed sales of PG would have given them an excuse to get rid of it). Their argument was that the brand was bigger than any supermarket. So no PG Tips in the big four for several years, and only your friendly local corner shops stocking it. Who won? PG did, after they found one of their biggest selling products - tea - being lost once distraught customers discovered where to go to get their PG fix, and the "paying for shelf space" racket collapsed. Business history is littered with examples of firms that everyone knew an industry could not possibly survive the collapse of, only to be proven wrong time after time. Rangers will be simply another football footnote, as well as a monument to Ratner style self-destructive arrogance. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBadSaint Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 Hyman Minsky's famed little ditty might be due out for another spin in a few weeks, we shall see. Risk premiums set to soar, demand for cashflows brought forward requiring everyone to have more liquidity on hand (or at least those who have liquefiable assets) and against a substantial retrenchment of projected income. "It's only when the tide goes out that you learn who's been swimming naked." Warren Buffet. Nemesis follows hubris, What sort of parent calls their boy Hyman ? Only bettered by US Olympic Gold medallist swimmer Misty Hyman 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaffenThinMint Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 What sort of parent calls their boy Hyman ? A bit of a c**t, I'd imagine. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wunfellaff Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 Rangers media accusing SS for bias against them The Sportsound crew ripping into us. Rheinhart, Trayknob, Dung, Bicycle-helmet-heid...they're all at it. Level playing field? Non-biased reporting? Forget it. A quantum of quims And thus 'quantum' is defined....... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squidger Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 A more competitive league does not make a 'better' one. Logically, as money is the main driver of football these days, if it is reduced it reduces the standard. Teams are paying beyond their means even now. Imagine trimming the budget more if the effect of Rangers leaving is as bad as the SPL clubs are now making out. Fans of a club in the 1st div might be happy in the understanding relegation has effected the standard of player they are able to attract and quality of football played, but they would always be safe in the knolwedge that there was a promotion back to the SPL available. Europe is the only financial cherry on offer if the 'meltdown' without Rangers happens. Can teams compete in Europe if their budget is reduced? SPL fans seem more willing to accept the financial hit without Rangers than club officials, I'm not sure I buy into the 'disaster' myself, but some SPL clubs obviously do. Sadly this is the truth, most under the age of 40 barely remember part time football unless in the bottom half of the first division. On a positive note you look at the quality of some of the young guys coming through at the moment. By creating more of a level playing field between the first and the SPL and reintroducing 2up and 2 down or at very least a play off, the pressure matches will still be there but the serious consequences, if you have been frugal with your money, wont be as severe as they are now. This would force the managers into smaller squads and having to use the younger players at their disposal. Its always much easier to get behind a team with some home grown talent even if they are gash, but it makes the team more 'local'. Our only current home grown talent that gets a game is 36 and back after his big move down south. Kevin Moon is the other one, and its always great to see him in a saints shirt. I am certainly not saying your team should all be from your home town but there has to be connections of sorts and for the whole SFA to take a couple steps backwards would not be a bad thing IMHO. But then that's easier for me supporting a team that has to change its level of expenditure on a regular basis. The other issues regarding a section of both OF supports that believe in 2012 it is still appropriate to bring religion to football can also be sorted in one fell swoop. The paranoia from both camps will cease if one head is chopped off. This is a much wider issue than football for Scotland and there is no doubt both clubs have been a breeding ground for something that really shouldn't and cant exist in a modern Scotland. If that small minority attach itself to another club it will be very easy to stamp out without the mass of fans for them to hide in. Of course Rangers wills survive in some form, but if they are hobbled like they deserve, they will not play Celtic regularly for at least 3 years if not longer. They will not be competitive for at least 5-10 years. It would be great to see it happen, but i think we all have our doubts. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7-2 Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 They are fecked ma boy, accept it like the rest of the forum. That's the P&B equivalent of Traynor stating that the SPL needs Rangers and everybody knows it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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