IrishBhoy Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 1 minute ago, 54_and_counting said: Aye the bookie gamblers were the worst "got 4 ton back on a treble tonight" till yoi find out they stuck 200 quid on an even money treble, then you ask to see their losing bets that week "ach ive only lost 20 quid here and there" lying c***s Btw this is coming from me whos now 3 year clear of gambling cause i used to hedge my weekly losses against one big monthly win, great winning it but fucking bricking it later in the month when you had fucked it all away, and yes before anyone asks, ive lost over my gambling time, never money needed for bills, but aye ive lost a fair wedge From the age of about 18 till about 25 I was exactly the same. Had a few big wins of a few grand at a time on accumulators, but didn’t bother telling anyone about the £200 I lost on an even money favourite at Lingfield, or the £400 lost on a 5/4 fav at Wolverhampton that was supposed to win my losses back. And before you know it you’ve spunked a months wage up the wall sitting watching At The Races on a Tuesday night. I have the odd bet on the golf now which will be my biggest stake, but I put genuine research into my selections. It took me years to realise that by betting on an event that I had literally no idea about I was playing straight into the bookies hands. I put the odd bet on for the football but usually only 10 or 20 quid. Something I found that helped me stop betting so big, was to pick out my selections and put the stake in, and instead of placing the bet I would take a screenshot and see how many times I would have actually won. I can’t remember what my last count was but I would have been many thousands of pounds down if I had actually placed the bets. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 4 hours ago, IrishBhoy said: Neymar spent $400,000 on them, Justin Bieber over $1M, Jimmy Fallon $600,000 and Post Malone $700,000. It’s got to be a high level money laundering scheme that us normal people aren’t involved in, it’s literally the only explanation. The celebrities don't actually pay for them. They get them for nothing as part of a fee for promoting the NFT. The biggest celebrity agency in the world, CAA, is a big investor in Open Sea so they get their clients to promote NFTs to lure in dumbasses. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrishBhoy Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 15 minutes ago, Detournement said: The celebrities don't actually pay for them. They get them for nothing as part of a fee for promoting the NFT. The biggest celebrity agency in the world, CAA, is a big investor in Open Sea so they get their clients to promote NFTs to lure in dumbasses. Makes sense. Shame for the people who did genuinely spend their hard earned money on them. It always seems to be the way that the people who actually have the means to comfortably spend that kind of money, get it gifted to them, and the people who can just about it afford it get their fingers burnt. A lot of these celebrities who have pushed NFTs on to their fans over the last year or so must be having a moral dilemma with themselves round about now. Dread to think how many people have been scammed of their money in order to own these one off digital artworks, which are now trending close to worthless. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 3 minutes ago, IrishBhoy said: Makes sense. Shame for the people who did genuinely spend their hard earned money on them. It always seems to be the way that the people who actually have the means to comfortably spend that kind of money, get it gifted to them, and the people who can just about it afford it get their fingers burnt. A lot of these celebrities who have pushed NFTs on to their fans over the last year or so must be having a moral dilemma with themselves round about now. Dread to think how many people have been scammed of their money in order to own these one off digital artworks, which are now trending close to worthless. Anyone who bought into 'NFT' jpegs and the like hasn't been scammed, they're just gullible idiots. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 5 minutes ago, IrishBhoy said: Makes sense. Shame for the people who did genuinely spend their hard earned money on them. It always seems to be the way that the people who actually have the means to comfortably spend that kind of money, get it gifted to them, and the people who can just about it afford it get their fingers burnt. A lot of these celebrities who have pushed NFTs on to their fans over the last year or so must be having a moral dilemma with themselves round about now. Dread to think how many people have been scammed of their money in order to own these one off digital artworks, which are now trending close to worthless. They are working for it. It's like an advert and they probably didn't manage to sell the NFT for much either if at all. It's not really Crypto related but that advertising seems really seedy. I was listening to a Sopranos podcast with the actors who played Chris and Bobby and they were constantly doing adverts for some dodgy company called Better Help who exploit mentally ill people looking for affordable therapy and the gig economy 'therapists' who work for them. It eventually made me stop listening to it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrishBhoy Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 16 minutes ago, virginton said: Anyone who bought into 'NFT' jpegs and the like hasn't been scammed, they're just gullible idiots. As 54 and counting said, crypto and NFTs was/is a dangerous market for people with a tendency to gamble. People seen the tales of someone buying an NFT for 1.5 ETH and 3 months later selling it for 300 ETH. No different from betting companies showing bet slips of winning accumulators to try and get the vulnerable/gullible to part with their cash. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat(The most tip top) Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 1 hour ago, IrishBhoy said: From the age of about 18 till about 25 I was exactly the same. Had a few big wins of a few grand at a time on accumulators, but didn’t bother telling anyone about the £200 I lost on an even money favourite at Lingfield, or the £400 lost on a 5/4 fav at Wolverhampton that was supposed to win my losses back. And before you know it you’ve spunked a months wage up the wall sitting watching At The Races on a Tuesday night. I have the odd bet on the golf now which will be my biggest stake, but I put genuine research into my selections. It took me years to realise that by betting on an event that I had literally no idea about I was playing straight into the bookies hands. I put the odd bet on for the football but usually only 10 or 20 quid. Something I found that helped me stop betting so big, was to pick out my selections and put the stake in, and instead of placing the bet I would take a screenshot and see how many times I would have actually won. I can’t remember what my last count was but I would have been many thousands of pounds down if I had actually placed the bets. The big advantage the bookies have over you is that they set the prices the one advantage you have is that you don’t actually need to place a bet 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 (edited) 5 hours ago, IrishBhoy said: As 54 and counting said, crypto and NFTs was/is a dangerous market for people with a tendency to gamble. People seen the tales of someone buying an NFT for 1.5 ETH and 3 months later selling it for 300 ETH. No different from betting companies showing bet slips of winning accumulators to try and get the vulnerable/gullible to part with their cash. The difference is that in football you're betting on outcomes that the bookie usually has no more idea than you what will happen, and in most cases isn't bothered because he's balanced his book. In Crypto all you can do is guess on the future propensity of thousands, maybe millions of individuals to invest in this near valueless thing, and hope the whales and the guy who invented it don't sell out before you get a chance to. Edited June 17, 2022 by welshbairn 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat(The most tip top) Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, virginton said: Anyone who bought into 'NFT' jpegs and the like hasn't been scammed, they're just gullible idiots. Gullible idiots are usually the people that get scammed, that doesn't make scams OK Sneering at people who aren't as clever as oneself is a guilty pleasure that I've still not entirely grown out of despite being significantly older than you but it can lead you up some ethical dead ends Edited June 17, 2022 by topcat(The most tip top) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, IrishBhoy said: As 54 and counting said, crypto and NFTs was/is a dangerous market for people with a tendency to gamble. People seen the tales of someone buying an NFT for 1.5 ETH and 3 months later selling it for 300 ETH. No different from betting companies showing bet slips of winning accumulators to try and get the vulnerable/gullible to part with their cash. One key difference between crypto and gambling is that there's an ideology centred around the former. Most people who gamble recognise the general folly and while some believe that they have inside knowledge on an established market, there's no fundamental world view powering that claim. Crypto has amassed a raft of (mostly young male) weirdos who view Elon Musk as a hero and think that pumping up their ridiculous bubble puts them ten steps ahead of the sheeple. Which makes the implosion of this market objectively fucking hilarious. 31 minutes ago, topcat(The most tip top) said: Gullible idiots are usually the people that get scammed, that doesn't make scams OK Sneering at people who aren't as clever as oneself is a guilty pleasure that I've still not entirely grown out of despite being significantly older than you but it can lead you up some ethical dead ends It's really not a scam to be 'persuaded' that a jpeg of a bored ape has enormous tangible intrinsic value. It's not a timeshare scheme where you can realistically picture yourself enjoying the benefits of the offer. It's just a fucking jpeg. Under no meaningful definition can the buyer claim to have been 'duped', to use the famous Glasgow Rangers liquidation phrase. There's a distinction to be made between investment in cryptocurrency (mostly morons; some genuinely desperate people in developing countries) and NFTs (wall to wall morons) and anyone who bought into the latter should be treated like Peter Griffin buying volcano insurance. Edited June 17, 2022 by vikingTON 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat(The most tip top) Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 11 minutes ago, virginton said: It's really not a scam to be 'persuaded' that a jpeg of a bored ape has enormous tangible intrinsic value. It's not a timeshare scheme where you can picture yourself enjoying the benefits of the offer. It's just a fucking jpeg. Under no meaningful definition can the buyer claim to have been 'duped', to use the famous Glasgow Rangers liquidation phrase. There's a distinction to be made between investment in cryptocurrency (mostly morons; some genuinely desperate people in developing countries) and NFTs (wall to wall morons) and anyone who bought into the latter should be treated like Peter Griffin buying volcano insurance. I think we're in broad agreement on the moron thing let's put that to one side The underlying ethical proposition is that One should be able to believe someone else to be a moron whilst still having human empathy for them and not thinking that people preying on that vulnerability is fine. Spoiler Though sometimes it hard not to laugh 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 So long as it is the folly of fully sentient adults rather than a pre-established moron throwing their money away then there is no moral issue. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loonytoons Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 From the age of about 18 till about 25 I was exactly the same. Had a few big wins of a few grand at a time on accumulators, but didn’t bother telling anyone about the £200 I lost on an even money favourite at Lingfield, or the £400 lost on a 5/4 fav at Wolverhampton that was supposed to win my losses back. And before you know it you’ve spunked a months wage up the wall sitting watching At The Races on a Tuesday night. I have the odd bet on the golf now which will be my biggest stake, but I put genuine research into my selections. It took me years to realise that by betting on an event that I had literally no idea about I was playing straight into the bookies hands. I put the odd bet on for the football but usually only 10 or 20 quid. Something I found that helped me stop betting so big, was to pick out my selections and put the stake in, and instead of placing the bet I would take a screenshot and see how many times I would have actually won. I can’t remember what my last count was but I would have been many thousands of pounds down if I had actually placed the bets. What kind of research can you put into a game where it's purely based on an individual who's short game can go all to shit within an hour?Team sports one person's drop in form can be covered, individual sport is a pure gamble on mentality and a drop in form every time.All gambling long term is just that and the bookie always has the edge. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wastecoatwilly Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 1 hour ago, topcat(The most tip top) said: The big advantage the bookies have over you is that they set the prices the one advantage you have is that you don’t actually need to place a bet The difference from the bookies and the market is putting on a £20 treble and one team beats you,you lose the £20 with the market the only way you lose the £20 is if it goes to zero. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
54_and_counting Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 10 minutes ago, virginton said: So long as it is the folly of fully sentient adults rather than a pre-established moron throwing their money away then there is no moral issue. Surely it depends on the level of stupidity of said moron, said moron who dropped a couple hundred, realised their mistake and didnt drop anymore is probably one to admire in their admitting of the mistake and correcting it Other said moron who dropped a couple hundred, then another couple hundred, seen they'd maybe made a hundred so then flogged everything not nailed down and mortgaged the shit out of their house just to buy more crypto............. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat(The most tip top) Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 8 minutes ago, Loonytoons said: What kind of research can you put into a game where it's purely based on an individual who's short game can go all to shit within an hour? Team sports one person's drop in form can be covered, individual sport is a pure gamble on mentality and a drop in form every time. All gambling long term is just that and the bookie always has the edge. And that edge increases exponentially on an accumulator 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrishBhoy Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 5 minutes ago, Loonytoons said: What kind of research can you put into a game where it's purely based on an individual who's short game can go all to shit within an hour? Team sports one person's drop in form can be covered, individual sport is a pure gamble on mentality and a drop in form every time. All gambling long term is just that and the bookie always has the edge. Well obviously a golfer blowing up on a hole can’t be accounted for, but I didn’t say my research had a 100% strike rate. In a golf market you will have a favourite usually somewhere between 6/1 and 12/1, depending on the strength of the field, and the rank outsider could be 1000/1. If I was betting to level stakes and my research produced one single 50/1 winner a year I would be in profit. Then you take into account that I will be betting on multiple selections each week, some each way that can return a profit for finishing in the top 8. Most of my golf bets are made on an exchange that has an over round of roughly 100%, although you pay 2% commission on any winnings. A bookmakers over round for any given golf tournament will be anywhere between 120% and 160%. If my research produces even a slight edge over the market then it’s me that is winning over the long term. There is people who’s full time job is finding an edge and eeking out slight profits over a long timescale. It’s not as simple as just saying ‘the bookies always win’. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 9 minutes ago, IrishBhoy said: There is people who’s full time job is finding an edge and eeking out slight profits over a long timescale. I'd rather be a train driver. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 (edited) 18 minutes ago, 54_and_counting said: Surely it depends on the level of stupidity of said moron, said moron who dropped a couple hundred, realised their mistake and didnt drop anymore is probably one to admire in their admitting of the mistake and correcting it Other said moron who dropped a couple hundred, then another couple hundred, seen they'd maybe made a hundred so then flogged everything not nailed down and mortgaged the shit out of their house just to buy more crypto............. They almost certainly didn't 'drop' anything though: they jumped on the boat, steered miles from shore giving it the big licks to everyone on shore about their phuree money from buying fucking jpegs, and are receiving the inevitable, crushing losses only now. It would take the conscience of a saint to do anything but laugh, but I'm not a saint and so won't bother restraining myself. Edited June 17, 2022 by vikingTON 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTChris Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 NFTs are ruining the art heist. Someone once stole Edvard Munich’s The Scream using the Olympic opening ceremony as cover and leaving a funny note for police (“thanks for the bad security”). Now I can rob priceless artwork by right clicking on them. Where’s the fun in that? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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