Frankie S Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 (edited) Could the Russians not manipulate the data in the black box before handing it over, or is that impossible? There was speculation at the time of the NTSB investigation into KAL 007, after Yeltsin handed back the data recorders, that the tapes had been spliced and reassembled by the Russians but the NTSB stated in their report that they were satisfied that the evidence was complete. The Russians were fairly bullish about that one as KAL 007 was shot down over Russian territory (it had drifted off course due to a failure of the pilots to activate the automatic navigation system) and there were spy planes operating in the area at the time. I guess it's possible, but it's probably impossible to do it without leaving evidence that you've done it. Edited July 17, 2014 by Frankie S 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingscot Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 isn't shooting down a unarmed civilian aircraft considered a war crime? The Yanks give you a purple heart award on return if you do it... Pro-Russian rebels who've fucked up using the stuff they took off the Ukrainians? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Nooka Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 But could they just knock around a bit until it was useless and say 'it was like when I found it... honest'? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Wilson Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 My conspiracy theory is... The Russians are fed up with the pro Russian rebels in Ukraine as they have outlived there usefulness for now. So they shot down a passing plane and blamed it on the rebels. They now have an excuse for bailing on them. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankie S Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 The Russians are claiming they already have the blackbox. Regardless of who's got it, I can't imagine it'll have the voice of the captain saying who he thinks fired the missile. Oh and the CVR is more than a voice recorder. It's a microphone in the cockpit that records all sounds including, but not limited to, voices. If there is an explosion, for instance, that will be on the CVR. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 My conspiracy theory is... The Russians are fed up with the pro Russian rebels in Ukraine as they have outlived there usefulness for now. So they shot down a passing plane and blamed it on the rebels. They now have an excuse for bailing on them. I think MI6 did it to bury the paedo scandal. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Wilson Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 I think MI6 did it to bury the paedo scandal. Did they hit it with a tor-paedo? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
placidcasual Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 Is there any evidence this was actually the pro-Russian rebels beyond the Ukrainian Government saying so? They're hardly an impartial source. It's obviously a possibility, but I'd wait for some kind of independent confirmation on this. From the BBC... A tweet (in Russian) from a key Twitter account used by pro-Russian separatists, in which they claim to have captured a Buk surface-to-air missile system, has now been deleted, BBC Monitoring observes. Ukrainians say the Malaysian plane could have been downed with a Buk, but pro-Russian rebels have now denied they have it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagfox Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 I flew over Ukrainian airspace once. It could have been me 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peasy23 Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 The Yanks give you a purple heart award on return if you do it... Pro-Russian rebels who've fucked up using the stuff they took off the Ukrainians? That was my first thought too, that after getting 2 cargo planes in the last couple of days that they have mistaken this for another one. Only thing is though I would reckon there is more chance they were using stuff the Russians have tooled them up with. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Wilson Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 (edited) It could have been me Stop shooting at fucking aeroplanes ya daftie. Edited July 17, 2014 by Sergeant Wilson 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falcor Roar Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 Sanctions certainly aren't doing anything. First it was South Ossetia and Abkhazia in Georgia, then it was The Crimea and now they're arming pro Russian separatists in Donetsk. So far the West has done the square root of zero about any of this. Putin will keep pushing his luck until he's stopped. The West can either continue to let him encroach west into sovereign countries or they can stop him. Neither option is very appealing, but they'll have to pick one. What percentage of Germany's gas requirements are supplied by Russia? There has been talk of sanctions but there is little Europe is willing to do. Out of interest are the Baltic States pro Moscow? From what i've heard Putin's foreign policy is popular inside Russia. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hillonearth Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 What percentage of Germany's gas requirements are supplied by Russia? There has been talk of sanctions but there is little Europe is willing to do. Out of interest are the Baltic States pro Moscow? From what i've heard Putin's foreign policy is popular inside Russia. The general population of the Baltics is anything but pro-Moscow after decades as part of the USSR, although all three have Russian minorities living there - a lot (25%+) in Latvia and a fair bit less in the other two - but they're tiny and all too aware of their vulnerability which is probably why they were all so eager to join NATO. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fotbawmad Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 (edited) isn't shooting down a unarmed civilian aircraft considered a war crime? I don't think it's considered a war crime, but maybe an act of terrorism. However, in this instance the plane flew over a war zone. So it can't be considered anything more than an act of stupidity from the pilot. Edited July 17, 2014 by Fotbawmad 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 I don't think it's considered a war crime, but maybe an act of terrorism. However, in this instance the plane flew over a war zone. So it can't be considered anything more than an act of stupidity from the pilot. Doubt the pilot chose his route, the most fuel efficient route would be planned for him, and they weren't expecting to be shot down at his altitude. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falcor Roar Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 The general population of the Baltics is anything but pro-Moscow after decades as part of the USSR, although all three have Russian minorities living there - a lot (25%+) in Latvia and a fair bit less in the other two - but they're tiny and all too aware of their vulnerability which is probably why they were all so eager to join NATO. Yeah I remember now they are all European Union states. Should mean they are untouchable then in theory. Just as well, Ukraine paid a hefty price for installing a Pro European government. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinkinFighter Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 Sanctions certainly aren't doing anything. First it was South Ossetia and Abkhazia in Georgia, then it was The Crimea and now they're arming pro Russian separatists in Donetsk. So far the West has done the square root of zero about any of this. Putin will keep pushing his luck until he's stopped. The West can either continue to let him encroach west into sovereign countries or they can stop him. Neither option is very appealing, but they'll have to pick one. And how would you go about stopping him? With all the Oil and Gas Russia export I doubt many would like to piss them off. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~ Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 What is jock001's take on this? pilot error 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romeo Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 What is jock001's take on this? It was Craig Whyte 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ned Nederlander Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 I flew over Ukrainian airspace once. It could have been me I've was on a commercial flight that flew over the Ukraine on Saturday night (although nowhere near the Russian border) If I were an American Serviceman they'd have given me a campaign medal !! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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