Darren1872 Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 Everytime I've seen chopra (only a handful of times) he's been garbage. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albino Rover Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 Almost relegating us from a good position in the space of 15 games. 6 wins in 40 league games, 3 of which were against dreadful Morton and Cowdenbeath teams, one against ten man Falkirk and one against a Livi team bottom of the league at that time. Yep he was clearly doing a great job. The Hibs and Sevco results were rare bright spots in a year of mainly failure. We'd have swapped places with Cowden if he hadn't left. I don't see Alloa as much as you do, Tam, but that's the kind of form I think most would have expected from the Wasps in this division. If you're comparing every manager to the exceptional talent who got you promoted twice, you can only be let down. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 I hate to say it, but we were about to enter free-fall anyway, which is why Hartley left; he was smart enough to see that was the best option for him at the time. I'm sure we'd have done better if he'd stayed on, but saying that Smith isn't as good a manager as Hartley isn't exactly a terrible condemnation - you'd struggle to find many better operating in Scotland at the moment. Smith didn't do a great job, as he couldn't sort out the pussyfooting around on the edge of the box, but he wasn't poor either. Chopra's the type of player who needs to be in a strong team; he's looked superfluous at times when we're not doing well. I don't know about the last Dumbarton fiasco, but he's certainly put a shift in a few times this season, coming back to defend in roles that aren't his strongest suit and that sort of thing, so credit to him for not giving up like you might expect from a big name player in a wee league. I think he'd have been making absolute hay linking up with Liam Buchanan this season, for what it's worth. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Father Barrys Sign (Top Half) Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 I hate to say it, but we were about to enter free-fall anyway, which is why Hartley left; he was smart enough to see that was the best option for him at the time. Yep, Hartley left because he knew he couldnt take the team any higher on the budget. He wanted more investment but it couldnt be provided without taking the club into a precarious position financially. I think he was quite frustrated (as were all of us Im sure) that he put together an excellent team and our attendances werent increasing. The loan signings made in the January window didnt come off for us and there's no real evidence to suggest that Hartley would have fared all that better than Smith in the second half of the season, terrific manager and total legend though Hartley was. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albino Rover Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 I was going to touch on Hartley picking an optimal jumping-off point (to his credit, not detriment) but didn't want to go full rant as an outsider looking in, and having not seen Alloa in the Championship. It's a relief to see the Wasps of reason with a sense of perspective- part-time teams can't do much better than you have in the last 4 years or so. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 It's a relief to see the Wasps of reason with a sense of perspective- part-time teams can't do much better than you have in the last 4 years or so. I beg to differ. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waspie Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 (edited) I don't see Alloa as much as you do, Tam, but that's the kind of form I think most would have expected from the Wasps in this division. If you're comparing every manager to the exceptional talent who got you promoted twice, you can only be let down. Didn't we already have this debate? Alloa fans know well that as a club we have overachieved by surviving in this league. We will soon return to our more natural historical level and that was was inevitable. In recent times however (until this season) we had an exceptional team by our own standards. We had significantly better players than Cowdenbeath last season. Livingston were a mess and suffered a points deduction. That Alloa team should have got more points that it did. I agree with Tam that we'd have finished bottom of the league had Smith stayed on. That would have been a failure given the quality of player we had. I think Smith himself recognised that he wasn't getting the results required and decided to call it a day. IMO he wasn't a terrible manager at all, he couldn't have been to get some of those great performances from the team, but he wasn't able to pick up the bread and butter results required. Edited December 10, 2015 by Waspie 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waspy Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 If Hartley had satiated on and finished the season with us I think we would have been well safe from relegation IMO. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 Smith probably jumped ship to avoid damage to his rep too, TBH. The Rangers win got him a lot of exposure, tragically, and it was slowly being eaten away by the winless run - don't forget he was being linked with jobs like St Mirren this time last year. I'd imagine that bit of publicity played a part in Aldershot's decision to take him on, where they might not quite have realised how poor our form was in 2015. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawfield shed boy Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 Hurry up and get relegated wasps. Your Roll n bacons & Square at HT are the bomb 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waspy Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 Hurry up and get relegated wasps. Your Roll n bacons & Square at HT are the bomb Are you expecting promotion? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Father Barrys Sign (Top Half) Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 Smith probably jumped ship to avoid damage to his rep too, TBH. The Rangers win got him a lot of exposure, tragically, and it was slowly being eaten away by the winless run - don't forget he was being linked with jobs like St Mirren this time last year. I'd imagine that bit of publicity played a part in Aldershot's decision to take him on, where they might not quite have realised how poor our form was in 2015. Maybe a bit of that, but there were certainly other reasons why Smith quit. Especially when you consider we had a cup final incoming. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamhain Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 I don't see Alloa as much as you do, Tam, but that's the kind of form I think most would have expected from the Wasps in this division. If you're comparing every manager to the exceptional talent who got you promoted twice, you can only be let down. Don't worry I've been at Cliftonhill far more often than the likes of Falkirk over the years, so know our normal place in the grand scheme of things. Might see you next year if you stay down. It was my opinion on Barry Smith as manager during his spell with us. He took over when we were in a good position, with a decent squad (albeit Hartley had done far better than expected that season), and was a whisker away from getting us relegated. The following season despite keeping most of that squad and adding Liam Buchanan, our results under him were even worse. We did far better with the same players both seasons for the periods he wasn't in charge, so I'd say he didn't do a very good job. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
printer Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 Yep he was clearly doing a great job. . So you don't think there's a middle ground between 'dreadful' and 'great'? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
printer Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 Everytime I've seen chopra (only a handful of times) he's been garbage. Great post m8. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
printer Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 I agree with Tam that we'd have finished bottom of the league had Smith stayed. Possibly we may have, but it was equally as likely we would have still finished eigth or ninth. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pencils Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 I think Smith done reasonably okay. It's all very good saying he inherited a good squad for his 2nd season and should've done better with that group of players but it was probably still behind any of the full time teams in terms of quality IMO. Also missing Scott Bain. Wonder how many points he saved us in that first season? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wasps1 Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 Over 20 !!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamhain Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 So you don't think there's a middle ground between 'dreadful' and 'great'? Not with Barry. Would you want him back? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waspy Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 Over 20 !!! Any decent prospects? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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