LongTimeLurker Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I'm not sure what this even means (your absence of condemnation of "KAT", alongside your highlighting of "KAH", is duly noted) Try to move beyond the NI them and us thing. The bigger picture is that expressions of hatred against other groups of people are a major no no from a tolerance standpoint regardless of whether they are ..H, ..T, Romanians, Nigerians or Poles. Both sides in NI are made of the same stuff and are subject to the exact same human frailties. Using tolerance issues to point score in an ussuns are better than themuns (Portadown News lingo) identity politics sort of way isn't the answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivo den Bieman Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 could you please indicate who you think I am trying to "point score" against, please? my posts on this thread have been about the racist attacks in Belfast and ways in which they might be dealt with (I had hoped for a discussion as to why they were happening here and not elsewhere, but never mind). once you answer that question I might have more of an idea of what on earth you;ve been on about for the last four pages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Stick to the Northern Ireland tribalism then. No point pursuing this further. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AberdeenBud Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I had hoped for a discussion as to why they were happening here and not elsewhere, but never mind. Indeed. Genuinely, why are they focused mainly in the Loyalist communities of Belfast? Anybody got a spare enigma machine to enable us to decipher Ltl's posts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivo den Bieman Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Stick to the Northern Ireland tribalism then. No point pursuing this further. so you can't answer a very simple question and will not justify four pages of bizarre whataboutery on this thread? can you find a single post of mine anywhere on this, or any other messageboard exhibiting "Northern Ireland tribalism"? even an example from this thread would do. you're a very strange bloke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audaces Fortuna Juvat Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Indeed. Genuinely, why are they focused mainly in the Loyalist communities of Belfast? Anybody got a spare enigma machine to enable us to decipher Ltl's posts? A misplaced "beleaguered community" mentality perhaps? The Loyalist community is shrinking due to demographic changes and republican violence eroding traditional Loyalist areas, so they mistakenly perceive the incomers as a threat. Poor education as opposed to republican areas. None of these, apart from the last one perhaps, are excusable, just my guessing at answers to your question. Furthermore, most of the ethnic minority community in Northern Ireland live in what were traditional Loyalist areas. From a Guardian article by Gerard Stewart, "Why there appears to be a correlation between Loyalist areas and race hate crime, and why there appears to be a significant synergy between Loyalist paramilitaries and racist attacks is open to exploration. Unquestionably, the vast majority of Northern Ireland’s ethnic minorities appear to reside largely in traditional Loyalist areas, where many previously owner-occupied houses in areas such as The Village, for example, are now owned by private landlords and rented out to an array of those in dire need of housing – including migrants. Proximity, however, does not explain why race hate crime exists but does help to explain why they are concentrated primarily in Loyalist areas. A more precise point that could be made, I would argue, is that the impact of community segregation during The Troubles – combined with a political history of fascist intrusion (albeit episodically welcomed) in these areas – has, in many ways, aided the reinforcement of exclusion against ‘the Other’. That said, there have been a small number of anti-racist initiatives in the last number of years – such as the participation of Loyalists (some affiliated with paramilitaries) in localised anti-racist football tournaments – as well as the promise of funding to Loyalists to oppose racism in their own areas. In 2004, both the UDA/UPRG and the UVF/PUP launched an anti-racist leafleting campaign via the Loyalist Commission." It does happen all over Belfast though. http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/man-badly-beaten-in-racist-attack-in-west-belfast-30340894.html http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2011/oct/12/republican-dissidents-blamed-belfast-shooting Either way, it has to be tackled everywhere it happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bookies Love Me Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 so you can't answer a very simple question and will not justify four pages of bizarre whataboutery on this thread? can you find a single post of mine anywhere on this, or any other messageboard exhibiting "Northern Ireland tribalism"? even an example from this thread would do. you're a very strange bloke. You're beating your head against a brick wall buddy. Some people just have to turn constructive criticism of NI into an us and them sectarian session. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doulikefish Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 A misplaced "beleaguered community" mentality perhaps? The Loyalist community is shrinking due to demographic changes and republican violence eroding traditional Loyalist areas, so they mistakenly perceive the incomers as a threat. Poor education as opposed to republican areas. None of these, apart from the last one perhaps, are excusable, just my guessing at answers to your question. Furthermore, most of the ethnic minority community in Northern Ireland live in what were traditional Loyalist areas. From a Guardian article by Gerard Stewart, "Why there appears to be a correlation between Loyalist areas and race hate crime, and why there appears to be a significant synergy between Loyalist paramilitaries and racist attacks is open to exploration. Unquestionably, the vast majority of Northern Ireland’s ethnic minorities appear to reside largely in traditional Loyalist areas, where many previously owner-occupied houses in areas such as The Village, for example, are now owned by private landlords and rented out to an array of those in dire need of housing – including migrants. Proximity, however, does not explain why race hate crime exists but does help to explain why they are concentrated primarily in Loyalist areas. A more precise point that could be made, I would argue, is that the impact of community segregation during The Troubles – combined with a political history of fascist intrusion (albeit episodically welcomed) in these areas – has, in many ways, aided the reinforcement of exclusion against ‘the Other’. That said, there have been a small number of anti-racist initiatives in the last number of years – such as the participation of Loyalists (some affiliated with paramilitaries) in localised anti-racist football tournaments – as well as the promise of funding to Loyalists to oppose racism in their own areas. In 2004, both the UDA/UPRG and the UVF/PUP launched an anti-racist leafleting campaign via the Loyalist Commission." It does happen all over Belfast though. http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/man-badly-beaten-in-racist-attack-in-west-belfast-30340894.html http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2011/oct/12/republican-dissidents-blamed-belfast-shooting Either way, it has to be tackled everywhere it happens. A typical "they other side are doing it aswell and its all the fault of the immigrants moving into houses beside us" and through in i condemn it all at the end Usual stock response Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~ Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 They can't cope with a flag being removed, how do you expect them to react when seeing brown people Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AberdeenBud Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 A misplaced "beleaguered community" mentality perhaps? The Loyalist community is shrinking due to demographic changes and republican violence eroding traditional Loyalist areas, so they mistakenly perceive the incomers as a threat. Poor education as opposed to republican areas. None of these, apart from the last one perhaps, are excusable, just my guessing at answers to your question. Furthermore, most of the ethnic minority community in Northern Ireland live in what were traditional Loyalist areas. From a Guardian article by Gerard Stewart, "Why there appears to be a correlation between Loyalist areas and race hate crime, and why there appears to be a significant synergy between Loyalist paramilitaries and racist attacks is open to exploration. Unquestionably, the vast majority of Northern Ireland’s ethnic minorities appear to reside largely in traditional Loyalist areas, where many previously owner-occupied houses in areas such as The Village, for example, are now owned by private landlords and rented out to an array of those in dire need of housing – including migrants. Proximity, however, does not explain why race hate crime exists but does help to explain why they are concentrated primarily in Loyalist areas. A more precise point that could be made, I would argue, is that the impact of community segregation during The Troubles – combined with a political history of fascist intrusion (albeit episodically welcomed) in these areas – has, in many ways, aided the reinforcement of exclusion against ‘the Other’. That said, there have been a small number of anti-racist initiatives in the last number of years – such as the participation of Loyalists (some affiliated with paramilitaries) in localised anti-racist football tournaments – as well as the promise of funding to Loyalists to oppose racism in their own areas. In 2004, both the UDA/UPRG and the UVF/PUP launched an anti-racist leafleting campaign via the Loyalist Commission." It does happen all over Belfast though. http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/man-badly-beaten-in-racist-attack-in-west-belfast-30340894.html http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2011/oct/12/republican-dissidents-blamed-belfast-shooting Either way, it has to be tackled everywhere it happens. Thanks for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audaces Fortuna Juvat Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 A typical "they other side are doing it aswell and its all the fault of the immigrants moving into houses beside us" and through in i condemn it all at the end Usual stock response Not at all; try reading what I actually wrote as I guessed at answers to another posters question and then said the reasons were no excuse; in fact I used the words mistaken and misplaced when describing this type of thinking. As for where the immigrants are actually living - that was an article by SOMEONE ELSE. Do the big letters help? Stick to posting photoshopped shit. Ps - It's "throw in", not, "through in". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Gaines Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 how do you expect them to react when seeing brown people With hatred most likely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doulikefish Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 They can't cope with a flag being removed, how do you expect them to react when seeing brown people Did the kkk flag have a union flag on it?If not the LOL could be protesting against there own fleg for not having it on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audaces Fortuna Juvat Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Where's the rib doctor, quick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doulikefish Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Not at all; try reading what I actually wrote as I guessed at answers to another posters question and then said the reasons were no excuse; in fact I used the words mistaken and misplaced when describing this type of thinking. As for where the immigrants are actually living - that was an article by SOMEONE ELSE. Do the big letters help? Stick to posting photoshopped shit. Ps - It's "throw in", not, "through in". Bollox you always try and pan the blame off on other things apart from the absolute dimwittedness of the orange side of the problem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing (2) Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Stated before several times - photoshopped. Correct. No man that slender/with that much hair, is in the Ludge. Clear 'shop'. Maybe they are just being Loyal to their roots? The Klan was formed by Masonic Scots/sons of Masonic Scots after all............ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audaces Fortuna Juvat Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Bollox you always try and pan the blame off on other things apart from the absolute dimwittedness of the orange side of the problem No, it's not bollox, it really is "throw in". I do not palm anything off - I have condemned this repeatedly. I suspect you have an agenda. For example, why have you even brought Orangemen into it when they haven't been mentioned so far? http://www.pieandbovril.com/forum/index.php/topic/210961-racist-abuse-at-peterhead/ Put your own house in order and stop photoshopping made up shite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~ Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Someone ask for a doctor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audaces Fortuna Juvat Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 Correct. No man that slender/with that much hair, is in the Ludge. Clear 'shop'. Maybe they are just being Loyal to their roots? The Klan was formed by Masonic Scots/sons of Masonic Scots after all............ I know, sadly. Ulster Scots too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinkinFighter Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I presume longtermlurker is a proddy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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