Mr Heliums Posted June 1, 2015 Share Posted June 1, 2015 Killie went for the old school template of building big and maximising income from old firm fixtures with big away crowds.... Fine for those games, but pretty grim for your regular fans and non-old firm away supports. Ross county and st mirren have gone sensible, now we are rid of the ridiculous 10000 capacity rule. You have to remember - and it's a particular bugbear of mine - that walk-in tickets were much cheaper then in real terms. You were much more likely to get a one-off stadium-filler in 1990 because it was relatively cheap to attend matches. A point of reference: it was £3.50 for an adult to get into the East Stand at McDiarmid in its first season. That would work out at about £6 or £7 now. In short, it's easy to criticise Killie for their 'old-school' approach, but circumstances played their part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambie's Pigeon Feed Posted June 1, 2015 Share Posted June 1, 2015 You have to remember - and it's a particular bugbear of mine - that walk-in tickets were much cheaper then in real terms. You were much more likely to get a one-off stadium-filler in 1990 because it was relatively cheap to attend matches. A point of reference: it was £3.50 for an adult to get into the East Stand at McDiarmid in its first season. That would work out at about £6 or £7 now. In short, it's easy to criticise Killie for their 'old-school' approach, but circumstances played their part. If your numbers are correct then that's mental. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted June 1, 2015 Author Share Posted June 1, 2015 They used to print ST & admission prices in the old League Reviews. Current top tier clubs at 5yr intervals: Club '85-86 '90-91 '95-96 '00-01 '05-06 Aberdeen Seat £2-4 £5-8 £9-16 - £15-25 Terr Celtic Seat £3 £7-8 £9-19 - £20-23 Terr £2 £5 Dundee Seat £2-4 £4-7 £7-9 - £16 Terr £2 £4 £7 Dund Utd Seat £4 £7 £8-10 - £19-23 Terr £2 £5 Hamilton Seat £2 £5 £7 £10 £14 Terr £1 £3 Hearts Seat £3-5 £5-8 £9-12 - £10-25 Terr £2 £5 Inverness Seat £6 £11 £15-25 Terr £5 £9 Kilm'k Seat £2 £4-5 £9-12 - £18 Terr £1 £3 Mother'l Seat £3 £7 £9-11 - £16-24 Terr £2 £5 Partick Seat £1-2 £4 £10 £10 £13 Terr £1 £3 £8 £9 Ross C'y Seat £6 £11 £14 Terr £5 £9 £12 St John'e Seat £2 £5-8 £7-10 - £16-18 Terr £1 All are for Adult admission to regular accommodation (i.e. no directors box or VIP prices) £2-4 means minimum-maximum Figures rounded down if price included pence Cat B price taken where categories applied SPL prices not included in SFL Review in 2000-01 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted June 1, 2015 Author Share Posted June 1, 2015 Standing in SFL2 in 1985-86 (and sitting at Meadowbank) was... £1.10 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alert Mongoose Posted June 1, 2015 Share Posted June 1, 2015 Standing in SFL2 in 1985-86 (and sitting at Meadowbank) was... £1.10 . So overpricing isn't exactly a new phenomenon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Heliums Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Inflation calculator is a good site to work out the current value of old prices: http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/bills/article-1633409/Historic-inflation-calculator-value-money-changed-1900.html Basically adult entrance to McDiarmid (£3.50 in 1989-90) is equivalent to £8 now. For a fairer comparison, our first season in the Premier in 1990 was £5 in the same stand. That works out as £11 in today's money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrelhumper Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 You have to remember - and it's a particular bugbear of mine - that walk-in tickets were much cheaper then in real terms. You were much more likely to get a one-off stadium-filler in 1990 because it was relatively cheap to attend matches. A point of reference: it was £3.50 for an adult to get into the East Stand at McDiarmid in its first season. That would work out at about £6 or £7 now. In short, it's easy to criticise Killie for their 'old-school' approach, but circumstances played their part. Killie had 11 crowds over 10k in 98/99. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RussellAnderson Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Killie had 11 crowds over 10k in 98/99. but over 10k is still 60-70% for your biggest crowds. I just seems bizarre to me that with no recent historical record of attracting 18k crowds regularly that a stadium of that size would be built. Has it ever sold out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat(The most tip top) Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 The opposite mistake is to not build enough capacity. If you're regularly turning people's money away because you've sold out then you've got a problem. I reckon the ideal capacity would be one that sells out about 5 times a season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PauloPerth Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 but over 10k is still 60-70% for your biggest crowds. I just seems bizarre to me that with no recent historical record of attracting 18k crowds regularly that a stadium of that size would be built. Has it ever sold out? That season they averaged 9000 in 98/99, St Johnstone and killie were in a battle for third and the final European place, the second last game of the season at Rugby Park was killie v Saints and I'm sure the crowd was 15 or 16 thousand!!! Can any killie fans confirm this or am I remembering it wrong?! The opposite mistake is to not build enough capacity. If you're regularly turning people's money away because you've sold out then you've got a problem. I reckon the ideal capacity would be one that sells out about 5 times a season. Sometimes having to turn away folk and having a scramble for tickets creates even more interest - and maybe more folk buy season tickets, come to smaller games for vouchers for all ticket games etc to avoid potentially missing out, But in the case of Hearts where they could probably get a few thousand more every week just now, definitely agree their ground is currently not big enough. Probably the only team in scotland where that's the case??5 sell outs a season would be magic!!! I can't remember the last crowd over 10000 at McDiarmid. ETA - Elton John or the Jehovah's excluded! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 In regard to stadium sizes, what lead chairmen to believe their clubs could attract such large crowds on a regular basis? All the historical evidence for a start would show that most teams had a fairly standard level of support, with it obviously increasing for big games (like it does at every single other club in the world). Did they truly believe that forcing people to sit at games would really bring almost double the number of fans to games? I know that many clubs were targeting families and the ‘middle class’, but did they truly believe these groups would suddenly flock to games in huge numbers just because they could sit on a crappy piece of plastic? It shows such ignorance, as families and middle class people attended football anyway and loads more wouldn’t come along when the prices suddenly rocketed. The saddest part is that they never consulted the fans. I know the rules were originally for a 10,000 all seater ground in the top tier in Scotland, but that was based on the opinion of one man who had never been a regular football attendee and who personally thought it preferable to sit rather than stand. He also made plenty of other recommendations that were ignored (especially about keeping prices down). Interestingly, if the media talked up the game more and gave other clubs better coverage, then perhaps the crowds might have risen. The English Premier League is brilliant at promoting itself, as are the media and the folk running it. They make out that even the most thunderingly dull games are must watch encounters, whereas up here the media tear in to the small crowds and don’t even pretend to be interested or care about teams outwith Celtic and Sevco (and formerly Oldco). Even the folk running our game run it down (Armageddon!), and they’ve been at it for years. In England they can pretty much name their price for TV deals, sponsors are lining up and crowds are consistently huge. Here we didn’t have a sponsor for a couple of years, the TV deals are laughable and the crowds remain steady but low. Obviously we’re never going to compete with England, and we shouldn’t even try, but to get the basics in marketing so utterly wrong for so long is unacceptable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted June 2, 2015 Author Share Posted June 2, 2015 Tbf, crowds here aren't "low"... with the exception of a couple of islands (for whatever reason) they are the highest per head of population in Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7-2 Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Which game v aberdeen do you mean? That must be going back a long time .. Not sure exactly to be honest. It was ages ago though. I believe Aberdeen were going well at the top of the league, Saints were doing very well too and it was during the festive period. It all added up to the last 20k+ we ever had. I've always taken it at face value. Would be good to find out more. RADFORD...! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrestersKTID Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 That season they averaged 9000 in 98/99, St Johnstone and killie were in a battle for third and the final European place, the second last game of the season at Rugby Park was killie v Saints and I'm sure the crowd was 15 or 16 thousand!!! Can any killie fans confirm this or am I remembering it wrong?! Yes i was at the game. Pretty sure a wee baldy guy for saints put the ball in off lekovic's legs. Gutted. Closest Rugby park has been to full in recent years has been Scotland tonga rugby game last october 16000 odd. And the 2 times MJ sold the stadium to old firm title days. Biggest non old firm match recently was 9000 odd against Ayr this season and before that 11500 odd against ayr again a few years before (that one seemed more). It's always been too big for us. But at the time the fleetings/Moffat had us on the up and had big ambitions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Costanza Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Yes i was at the game. Pretty sure a wee baldy guy for saints put the ball in off lekovic's legs. Gutted. s. Gary Bollan? Wasn't that wee! Jim Lauchlan made a sensational clearance off the line to deny Simao in that game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ggr Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 8th highest average crowd in Scotland and we finished 17th. Lots of morons in the Falkirk support will tell you we're punching our weight. 17th highest average crowd in Scotland and we finished 7th. We *are* punching above our weight and have been for the past 10 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted June 2, 2015 Author Share Posted June 2, 2015 If clubs had finished in order of attendances, table would've been: Celtic (CL) Rangers (EL) Hearts (EL) Aberdeen (EL) Hibs Dundee Utd ~~~~~~~~~~~ Dundee Falkirk St Johnstone Motherwell ------------------- Kilmarnock =========== St Mirren Partick =========== Inverness Ross County Hamilton ------------------- QotS Raith Dunfermline Livingston ------------------- Morton =========== Cowdenbeath Alloa =========== Ayr Dumbarton Airdrie ------------------- Stirling Forfar Arbroath Queen's Park ------------------- Stenhousemuir =========== Peterhead East Fife =========== Brechin Albion Rovers Elgin ------------------- Stranraer Clyde Berwick Pollok JFC Montrose Annan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsimButtHitsASix Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 You got the last league wrong. Everyone knows the Junior clubs attendances put half the SPFL to shame Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted June 2, 2015 Author Share Posted June 2, 2015 For those interested - Clydebank (only partial figures available) also surpassed East Stirlingshire. That's it, AFAIA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherrif John Bunnell Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Clyde Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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