killienick Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Regarding payments.... at the moment most of the income from the BBC deal must go to the clubs being broadcast? As the BBC are said to pay about £1m per season, and the clubs apparently get about £100k for appearing on TV, and there are 4 games broadcast? Income from naming rights go into the general SPFL pot but presumably the prizemoney is made equivalent. With this BT deal apparently doubling the TV fee to £2M per season in tandem with more than tripling the number of matches broadcast from 4 to 13, I hope that the monies won't just go to the clubs being broadcast. There must be a good chance that BT will only show those group games involving the likes of Rangers, Hibs, Dundee Utd and any half-decent derbies. I would like to see a model which pools some of the TV cash and some gate receipts. I reckon the fact that these games are on in July across a few days means that BT will treat it like a mini tournament and broadcast quite a few games as there is feck all else on and it makes sense as to why they'd sponsor it at that time. They can advertise it during the Euros to drum up a bit of interest. If the games are on at different times then we could even see a couple of games a day across the 5 dates. 10 televised games is a great many more than we normally get. I can't see them paying £2m a year and not showing as many games as they can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 That won't happen. I'm sure I saw in one article that they're showing 6 group games and 7 knockout games (presumably 2x Last 16, 2x QFs, 2x SFs, Final). EDIT: I don't think they can show matches on Tue/Wed/Thu either, as those are CL/EL nights? So maybe it's 2 games per weekend = 6. Anyway, on the basis of the info given across various media platforms, I've done a random draw (I know I know...). Possible strengths and weaknesses on show, IMO. Group 1 Group 2 Group 3 Group 4 Dundee Hibernian Inverness Ross County Cowdenbeath Cove Rangers Brechin Arbroath Dundee Utd Dunfermline East Fife East Stirl Montrose Forfar Falkirk Elgin Peterhead Raith Stenhousemuir Stirling Group 5 Group 6 Group 7 Group 8 Hamilton Ac Kilmarnock Partick Th Rangers Annan Alloa Albion Rov Airdrie Ayr Berwick Clyde Dumbarton Motherwell Morton Livingston Edinburgh City Queen of t S Queen's Park St Mirren Stranraer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 You know what, f**k off. Don't go. Maybe you're right and it'll all end in farce and embarrassment but the way you're going on nothing we can do with our 40 odd teams will ever be attractive to you or anyone and we should be paying TV to show it. Don't go. I like Scottish football, so do others. I'll go watch some games and plenty others will go see their team regardless of the format or anything else because they're supporters an enjoy it. I won't f**k off, no. I probably won't go if it's in this format (maybe take in one game if I have nothing to do, much like I do for every pre-season), does that mean I can't have an opinion on it? I'm not going on like that at all, I'm only saying that bringing up ideas that have already been proven unpopular in the past is hardly "trying something different". It looks half arsed with silly ideas thrown in to give it some novelty value. Sorry that I feel those in charge should be doing a better job. Am I not a supporter now because I don't like this format? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pride_of_the_Clyde Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Surely you can see how frustrating it is to have ideas meet not with resistance but with pure negativity. Of course you can have an opinion but like in any walk of life, they're far more valid and likely to be listened to if your criticism can be expressed more flatly and with improvements suggested. What would you do? And please don't say do away with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A sense of belonging Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 That won't happen. I'm sure I saw in one article that they're showing 6 group games and 7 knockout games (presumably 2x Last 16, 2x QFs, 2x SFs, Final). EDIT: I don't think they can show matches on Tue/Wed/Thu either, as those are CL/EL nights? So maybe it's 2 games per weekend = 6. Anyway, on the basis of the info given across various media platforms, I've done a random draw (I know I know...). Possible strengths and weaknesses on show, IMO. Group 4 Ross County Arbroath East Stirling Elgin Stirling On one hand, 3 teams in the same league and a diddy 'big club' that's miles away. On the other hand, would be a very decent battle for 2nd place Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A sense of belonging Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 That won't happen. I'm sure I saw in one article that they're showing 6 group games and 7 knockout games (presumably 2x Last 16, 2x QFs, 2x SFs, Final). EDIT: I don't think they can show matches on Tue/Wed/Thu either, as those are CL/EL nights? So maybe it's 2 games per weekend = 6. Anyway, on the basis of the info given across various media platforms, I've done a random draw (I know I know...). Possible strengths and weaknesses on show, IMO. Group 1 Dundee Cowdenbeath Dundee Utd Montrose Peterhead Us instead of Peterhead would be a very fun group Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunning1874 Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 The more i think about it the more i realise that it's going to be incredibly hard for lower league teams to have a cup run. You'd bet on plenty lower league teams beating a Premier League team in a one off game, but over a 4 game group stage i'd imagine that the majority of Premier League teams will have the quality to win their group, or at least finish best runner up, which leaves maybe 4 or 5 Championship teams to go through as well. That means for over 20 teams who's realistic cup aims is to draw a team like Celtic at home or away and get a decent crowd in, they'll never have a chance to play them in this competition ever again as Celtic will always be in Europe and not participating in the group stage. Obviously it's going to be harder to have a cup run, but rather than saying this is bad because they can't progress to latter stages, you're saying it's bad because they can't get a big team with a big crowd and the money that comes with that. If you want to look at it from the big payday perspective rather than excitement of progressing, this change in format can only be an absolutely humongous positive for smaller clubs. Currently many League One & League Two teams will be out of both cups before the Premiership clubs enter, now they're guaranteed to play one every season and could easily find themselves in a group with both a Premiership club and a well-supported Championship club. If you're a dickhead whose main concern in a cup competition is making money from a big crowd rather than having some memorable wins, there really isn't a single negative here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paranoid android Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Remember it from the last time we had it - fucking terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moo Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Excluding the European teams so Celtic, Aberdeen and Hearts at the minute, possibly St Johnstone depending on the Scottish cup winner. So that gives us 8 teams being pot 1 so every SPL team barring Utd at the minute, possibly Motherwell depending on the playoff winner. I get that part and the how the rest works but what would happen if St Johnstone finish 5th, Dundee 7th and Utd 10th? How are they supposed to regionalise this? Ok St Johnstone could play Falkirk, Stirling etc but it would make it harder for the Dundee clubs if both teams are pot one? If we're keeping it local then only Forfar, Brechin, Arbroath and Montrose are close by unless they plan on regionalising it loosely? I might just be confusing myself with this but this is the bit that's throwing me off at the minute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Only "loose regionalisation" according to press. Might just be North/East + South/West, who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunning1874 Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Excluding the European teams so Celtic, Aberdeen and Hearts at the minute, possibly St Johnstone depending on the Scottish cup winner. So that gives us 8 teams being pot 1 so every SPL team barring Utd at the minute, possibly Motherwell depending on the playoff winner. I get that part and the how the rest works but what would happen if St Johnstone finish 5th, Dundee 7th and Utd 10th? How are they supposed to regionalise this? Ok St Johnstone could play Falkirk, Stirling etc but it would make it harder for the Dundee clubs if both teams are pot one? If we're keeping it local then only Forfar, Brechin, Arbroath and Montrose are close by unless they plan on regionalising it loosely? I might just be confusing myself with this but this is the bit that's throwing me off at the minute. There'll probably just be a North/South split across the country, so there's no problem at all with both Dundee clubs being in the same pot: it's not going to be so tightly regionalised you can only get clubs from Angus. Dundee could end up with Elgin, Peterhead & Cove, Partick could end up with Stranraer, Berwick & Annan. In that scenario of all three Tayside teams plus Ross County & ICT being involved as seeds, you either put St. Johnstone in the South region to have an even split, or - less likely - have five seeds as part of the North region and put more lower league teams in the North draw to suit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunning1874 Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Also I saw this headline and thought we might get some genuinely insightful analysis on how good the TV deal is compared to nations of our size: http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/competitions/league-cup/how-league-cup-tv-deal-compares-with-other-nations-1-3969865 I should have known better considering it's the Scotsman. Comparing us with England, Spain, Germany, Italy, Netherlands & the Champions League Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sergie's no1 fan Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 It's going to be harder for the smaller teams but they only get 1 bite of the cherry just now, they'd get 4 games with the new set up. Some clubs don't have their team finalised until the final day of the transfer window: Maybe a chance for the smaller clubs to catch the bigger ones off guard. It's money coming in that we previously weren't getting, we should embrace it for a few seasons and see how it goes. If it's a disaster we can always change it again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sergie's no1 fan Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 The thicko callers on Clyde1 aren't grasping it at all . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 I should have known better considering it's the Scotsman. Comparing us with England, Spain, Germany, Italy, Netherlands & the Champions League FFS !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doonhamer doon south Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Mmm I not going to be negative it's something different and see how it goes. The wee teams could shock the so called big ones and suddenly it's a great competition. I hope it works out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim McLean's Ghost Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Excluding the European teams so Celtic, Aberdeen and Hearts at the minute, possibly St Johnstone depending on the Scottish cup winner. So that gives us 8 teams being pot 1 so every SPL team barring Utd at the minute, possibly Motherwell depending on the playoff winner. I get that part and the how the rest works but what would happen if St Johnstone finish 5th, Dundee 7th and Utd 10th? How are they supposed to regionalise this? Ok St Johnstone could play Falkirk, Stirling etc but it would make it harder for the Dundee clubs if both teams are pot one? If we're keeping it local then only Forfar, Brechin, Arbroath and Montrose are close by unless they plan on regionalising it loosely? I might just be confusing myself with this but this is the bit that's throwing me off at the minute. The 8 Premiership teams will be seeded in each group. So teams are going to be in groups with Ross County, Inverness and Aberdeen. You can expect one of those teams (probably Aberdeen) to be in europe most years. So 8 teams will be in their groups, presumably Elgin, Peterhead and the Highland league entrants which leaves 5 teams from further afield meaning long midweek trips. Other than guaranteeing that teams in the far south can't be drawn in groups with the far north the regional stuff is unworkable with the announced format. What is clear is that was no formal vote to scrap the current structure and replace it with a new one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomGuy. Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Starting to wonder if due to the seedings we'll end up with the knockout stages featuring the same teams 80% of the time, which would be horrific Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tam Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 I remember the group stages format from the late 60s. Don't recall Queens ever getting out of the blasted things. At least this format sees more than one team getting out of each 5 team group and no home and away games. It's worth a go. League reconstruction interests me more though. As for a winter shut- down - if you can predict when the worst weather is going to strike, you've obviously never experienced Scotland in May, June, July, August, September, or October. No football between November and March? Get the placcy pitches down! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alert Mongoose Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 If Utd are not given an honorary seeding then I will huffily refuse to go to any of the matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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